Riddle me this: normal RMR but whacked respiratory quotient on Keto?

insulinresistance
newbies

(LJ) #1

I was surprised at how on point my resting metabolism is. It was striking, however, that’s 6 weeks strict Keto and my respiratory quotient is .97 which they determine suggests 78%+ carbohydrate oxidation vs. only 22% fat.

This makes little sense to me and the clinic was also a bit stumped. The only thought they suggested is that people with high insulin resistance can have faulty readings or influenced R Outputs.

Any thoughts or similar experiences???

Also, I’m looking at taking berberine and cat’s claw to help with insulin resistance and hormonal balance. Any other recommendations?

I’m a bit flummoxed at my ratios. Next tests will be blood tests for cortisol and insulin (I have larger abdominal fat stores and years of insomnia and feel that I’m out of balance). Also, my sleep cycles are a bit messed up. I’ll post that separately with blood results.

TIA!


#2

Did you eat something before the test? Or is this a fasted reading?

Any idea what your glucose levels were?

Did they test you during exercise, or just at rest?


(LJ) #3

Great questions, Carol! I appreciate your response.
This was a fasted test. I had intended to get my fasting glucose in the morning prior to the test but the test center had a scheduling issues so no BG reading.

It was a resting metabolic rate (RMR) test wherein you actually just sit there and breathe.

I was curiously hungry in the morning which I found to be odd because I regularly utilize intermittent fasting but found myself counting down the minutes until eating. I felt really quite ill and tired (I haven’t felt this way on keto for 6 weeks).

The only difference that strikes me is that I started Wellbutrin (150XL) again recently. Previously, I felt that it was making my glucose levels swing (I don’t have data on this unfortunately). I am compelled to get a blood meter so I can track these things more closely. I’m at a crossroads with the Wellbutrin and find it incredibly helpful for some things but not if it’s working against all of my efforts at improved health.


#4

Yes, it sounds like that may have been an off day for you. I would have expected very little glucose burning in that state. But then again I’ve only really looked at (other people’s) results during exercise.

@richard may be interested in this topic too.


(LJ) #5

I agree. Thanks to your comments I found a few studies that show a direct inverse correlation of low blood glucose and higher R. I’m wondering if that might have been what was going on with me.

This begs a second question, am I in or out of ketosis? If not, what the heck has kicked me out? I don’t do cheats and I stay at or around 10-15g of carbs (while being mindful of total and net carbs). Off to get that meter now…

Thank you! :slight_smile: More to come on the composite data picture of my baseline state.


(LJ) #6

Some references for those interested:

What I expected to see – Lower RQ on Ketogenic diet (1935): http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/article-abstract/1177045

Findings (1998) that show correlation of blood sugar variance and relationship to RQ:

*I am not diabetic but do believe I have insulin resistance. Many of the studies related to RQ were specific to diabetes research.


#7

From the study:

Diabetic patients treated with insulin or sulfonylurea showed significantly higher RQ values than normal subjects and nontreated diabetic patients. Diabetic patients without treatment showed higher glucose levels, and their RQ values were significantly lower than those of treated patients… These results suggest that a high RQ results from excess insulin…

This makes sense when insulin is high enough to block body fat utilization. The subjects were not in ketosis in this study, but I believe the same premise applies. You might want to have your fasting insulin checked and/or make sure you are in ketosis for the next RQ test.


(LJ) #8

Yes, the plan was to have fasting glucose and insulin (and cortisol) tested just prior to the RMR. Unfortunately, the blood lab screwed up my plans. I’ll have all data for the next one.

I don’t know how I could possibly not be in ketosis given what I’m consuming but no way to know for sure without the data.

I used ketostix and they showed high readings for a few weeks and then I couldn’t get a reading (I assumed this was good in that I was more efficiently making use of ketones vs. excreting them in urine but who knows).

In addition, I found an interesting read from Dr. Atkins’s former nurse about how women may experience lower ketone readings (or come out of ketosis) just at the start of their menses. I was at the very end of my TOM but it’s something else to consider as a variable. The human body is a wonderful puzzle.

Nurse Jackie’s essay on hormone changes and ketosis: https://healclinics.com/ketosis-hormone-changes/


#9

Thanks for this! Boy does this explain some things.


(LJ) #10

Right? It’s also nice to know shark week cravings aren’t all in your head! I think it’s important to know so as to moderate fat intake on those days (and increase calcium, magnesium, and potassium).


#11

My cycle didn’t come back right away, but once it did, it seems like I’m jumping through more hoops to keep the weight loss coming.


(LJ) #12

Data update: I took a ketone reading and was 0.7 mmol Thursday (early afternoon) and 1.2 mmol this morning with a fasted glucose of 76.

Relatively certain I was in ketosis during the test (esp given how long I had fasted). I think there must be some other explanation at play here (eg, insulin). The inquiry continues…


#13

Hello,
I give these RMR tests and have found that once in a while a client who is on the ketogenic diet will get a high RQ resting like you. It appears, or at least is my working theory that when In Deep ketosis the carbon dioxide weight derived from burning ketones more closely relates to those burned by sugars then fats. This is why people in keto normally show closer to 0.7 but when running on ketones show closer to .9
I’m wanting to do more testing on this but I believe this is what is occurring.


(Carpe salata!) #14

Great input. Does your place take any ketone or blood sugar readings to give any further hints?


#15

We are bringing the LEVL device into our lab and are working on putting together a study.