Questions about my glucose levels and ketosis

(Full Metal KETO AF) #1

I have been doing keto since September 1. I started out of desperation over a fasting glucose level over 200 I have a kidney transplant since December 2017. I never had a blood sugar issue before the transplant. The doctor said that I was developing post transplant diabetes. Yes, it’s a thing! So I took action the following morning and started Atkins. I at the same time was reading about keto and quickly moved with that since I’m concerned about more than weight loss. I have lost 25# so far and feel better than I have in years, so I think it’s working.

However every month I do fasting blood work and one month ago my glucose level was 135 still. I see it lower each month but the drop is in a decline percentage wise. And my ketone levels are"trace". So I’m wondering if my weight loss is ketosis or just reduced calorie loss. Is ketosis not actually happening in my body yet? Some of the reputed experts like Mike Mutzel claim you can’t really be in ketosis with BG levels like I have. Opinions…

#2

Just so we’re clear - are you only checking your blood glucose once a month?

(Full Metal KETO AF) #3

Yes, I do the lab work monthly after a 12 hour fast.I don’t use any home testing but I do have a glucose testing device.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #4

I don’t want to test all the time because I think that it encourages stress, like weighing yourself constantly. I’m losing so it’s good, just wondering about ketosis.

#5

Well if you only have a monthly fasting number you won’t know what your blood glucose is doing the rest of the time & therefore cannot use it to gauge whether or not you’re in a ‘ketosis friendly’ range. For many diabetics the morning fasting number can be quite high due to something called ‘Dawn Phenomenon’ but will drift lower throughout the day.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #6

I’m not diabetic, just at risk to develop it. So are you suggesting checking glucose levels several times a day? My monthly drops have been 200-150-140-135. I’m testing again tomorrow morning. I’m hoping to drop into the next lower danger category which is 100-130. My current levels indicate diabetes but the doctor said that I don’t have it yet.

#7

The best protocol for new or at risk diabetics is to test as follows:

As soon as you get up in the morning or before breakfast (or both) & then again before each meal, at 1 hour after the first bite & again at 2 hours after the first bite. This is how you can see whether or not your glucose levels are rising too much in response to the food you eat.

It is quite a lot of testing at first but once you have some data for the types of food you eat regularly you can cut right back on the testing.

At the very least I’d suggest testing before meals & 2 hours after meals. And look into Dawn Phenomenon - the fasting glucose level is often the last to respond to dietary changes. I’d also recommend regular HbA1c tests if you’re not already having them. This gives an idea as to how your blood sugars have been over a 3 month period.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #8

I have the 3 month testing in January. My doctor said he wanted to give me some time for glucose levels to drop and stabilize.

#9

As long as you’re under the care of a doctor & are happy with your treatment :slightly_smiling_face:

Your situation is quite different to the majority of diabetics so I imagine your treatment plan will be different too. You are certainly on a diabetes friendly diet so you’re already doing better than many.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #10

I’m pretty strict about being on the straight and narrow food wise. I don’t actually document it but on reflection I am well under 20 net carbs a day. Protein load at breakfast, 2 jumbo eggs 1oz of cheese, some bacon or sausage and sometimes a mini avocado. Lunch is usually something like a stir fry with maybe 3oz of meat and a cup of homemade fermented vegetables or baby bok choy. Dinner might be anything like blackened meat of some kind (fish, shrimp, beef, pork, chicken) and a veg side. I’m very on the low carb vegetables, and I never cheat. I use mostly bacon fat, coconut oil, EVO, avocado oil, butter and toasted sesame oil in tiny quantity. Very tiny occasional amount of allulose.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #11

I know I’m on the right path, thanks for your input.

#12

I expect your doctor knows how you’re eating & is comfortable with it. You’d also be on medications I suppose which can impact blood glucose/ketone levels so just take care of yourself & let the ketones fall where they may. Best of luck to you :slightly_smiling_face:

#13

Hi David, you’ll find what works best for you, but in case this is useful: when I first got a glucose meter, I tested often. Glucose levels rise and fall all the time throughout the day, so one single data point doesn’t tell you much. I was very interested in just finding what my patterns were. Frequent testing is also very useful to figure out how your body reacts to different situations: different kinds of food, various lengths of sleep, stress levels, etc.
I am not diabetic, not even prediabetic; it just seems that so much of our health depends on a good metabolic system that I wanted to see what was going on.
Also, FWIW I don’t track my weight at all, because that’s not a data point that I find at all useful.

(Bob M) #14

Taking blood sugar only in the morning is not a great gauge of your blood sugar level. Can you get a hemoglobin A1c test?

This is some data of mine taken over about a month’s time period:

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To get US units, multiple by 18. Anyway, my blood sugar is always highest in the morning then goes down all day (and eating of course affects this), but the trend is about midnight is the lowest blood sugar, then about noon or so is the highest. And I’ve tested coffee to see whether it affects this and it does not (that I could tell anyway, as I delayed drinking coffee until later in the morning and still had a blood sugar rise and then no blood sugar rise after drinking coffee).

This is made from hundreds of data points. (I think every 15 minutes, 24 hours a day, for close to 30 days.)

(Full Metal KETO AF) #15

That’s intense Bob. I had the test you mentioned early in September. I had only been eating keto for about a month which I said was a drastic measure to reverse a very high BG fasting level. Like 200! So the test the doctor ordered was supposed to be done this month but they ran it in October because the lab receptionist didn’t read the date. So insurance will pay next month and the doctor is ok with a wait and see.

My main question stems around whether a person can be in ketosis with blood sugar over 100 on the average. Also my ketone levels on my labs always say trace. I’m not sure if that’s affected by my immunosuppressive Meds, but I know blood sugars are higher on steroids like prednisone which I have to take the rest of my life. That’s the cause of post transplant diabetes in patients who never had an issue before.

It may explain my elevated blood glucose levels and my wondering if I am actually in ketosis or just eating less calories since I quit carbs feeling good energy even if I’m hungry without the up and down sugar and carbs cycle. Whatever is going on I like it and how it’s affecting my life. I’m sure my body will work it out in time, I did my monthly this morning and am going to be happy if my current downward trend continues even if I’m still not right in the normal zone. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Jane) #16

Congratulations on getting your fasting blood sugar down. Keep up the good work - it will improve with keto!!

I have never been diabetic so didn’t have any data on my blood sugars except for my annual physical. I got an early Santa present of a KetoMojo along with 50 extra test strips for glucose and ketones. I’ve enjoyed pricking my finger for data!!!

And was surprised to see my blood glucose rise over 20 points overnight with no consumption of calories the previous day (fasting) or before bedtime. Dawn phenomenon only. My ketones were slightly up from bedtime reading.

Our bodies are amazing machines with an astonishing ability to adapt!!!

(Edith) #17

I’m not diabetic or even pre-diabetic, but I also enjoy taking data. I test my blood glucose and ketones in the morning when I wake up. I have found the amount of protein I eat really affects my AM blood glucose readings. Too much evening protein results in blood glucose readings over 100 mg/dL and ketones out of nutritional ketosis. Smaller amount of protein yields blood glucose below 100, sometimes as low at 80 mg/dL and ketones of 0.4 mmol/L or higher.

(Bob M) #18

I commonly have blood sugar over 100 and am still in ketosis by blood readings.

Also, that data I showed above was taken by a continuous glucose monitor called the Freestyle Libre. It has a sensor you attach to the back of your arm and it reads blood sugar every 15 minutes. You pass a reader over it and get up to 8 hours of data (wish it was 10 or 12 hours; what if you sleep 8 hours? You lose data). I then use a computer to gather data for a while and then select how I want the data to be presented.

I don’t know about how the drugs you are taking affect ketosis. Probably no one other than people like you and who are doing a keto diet would know.

If you had a level of 200 and you’re down to 135, I’d call that impressive.

And I wouldn’t get too concerned about morning blood sugar levels. I’ve seen people say they have morning blood sugar levels that I only get if I fast multiple days. I can’t be concerned with something I can’t achieve. I just keep plugging away, trying different things, and getting to where I get to.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #19

So upon checking I was off a bit with the data that I posted. My glucose level last month was 130 after a 12hr fast. Today was 140. This was my first backward trend. I know that I’ve lowered protein, cheese and overall quantity of food consumed. Baffling

(Ceci N'est Pas Une Capybara) #20

You do the glucose test in the morning right after wakeup? If so, test it in different moment, like right before lunch, or in the afternoon. Right after wakeup you have high glucose levels because your body is start the engines to wakeup U.