Protein and fat overdo

(Andzej Nameiko) #1

What if I overdo fat on keto diet? I need 159 of fat daily, sometimes I get more. Is it ok?
And what about protein? I’m weightlifting, my protein suggestion on keto is 129, but sometimes I get more. But as far as I know its ok while You workout with weights to keep muscle and maybe build some.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #2

The way to do it is to eat only when hungry, and to stop eating when you stop being hungry. Don’t eat again until you are hungry again. That way, however much or little you eat, you can be sure you are giving your body enough, but not too much. I find that some days, I naturally eat very little, but other days I’m really hungry. Listen to your body, and you’ll be fine; it all evens out over time.

(Andzej Nameiko) #3

Many thanks for Your answer. But there is one BUT. I do a lot of research about getting enough nutrients while hard working in gym. Especialy on keto. I can get a very intense workout and feel no hunger that day. But its necessary to eat protein, aminos, bcaa in the first 30 minutes after training so anabolic state of muscles gets all it needs and grow. But I’m restricting myself by eating too much. Sometimes that happens but I eat only about 20 g of fat or protein more than suggested.

(traci simpson) #4

I agree with you. I also don’t know if I’m getting enough or too little. I track with that fat secret app and the app says I’m going way over but my calories are way under so in order to at least my daily caloric intake, I have to increase something. I’m not counting calories however in order to keep loosing I don’t want to be in a caloric deficit either. Increasing protein would lead to more insulin since I’m over 50.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #5

Where did you get this idea? I hope you understand that insulin is oversimplified and destructive to the average keto thinking but you would die quickly without it. Storing fat is about 1% of insulin function and it’s necessary for transporting nutrients like amino acids into almost every cell in your body and building healthy mitochondrial amounts in your cells through this action. There’s so much focus with keto on the evils of insulin ignoring all the ways you’re body needs it for normal function. Meat is the safest food for a diabetic. Insulin is necessary for metabolizing protein so your body can use it. The goal is normalization of insulin response, not elimination.

:cowboy_hat_face:

(traci simpson) #6

From articles on the Diet Doctors page. Some people are effected by too much protein.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #7

Why do you believe you are one of those “some people”? I think protein gets blamed quickly for problems when the latest research indicates it’s a non issue up to 1 gram per pound of your goal weight. Protein needs are higher for people as they age to prevent sarcopenia, not less. :cowboy_hat_face:

(traci simpson) #8

because when I got my A1C tested 6 weeks into keto it was 6.0 from 5.4. IMO, there wasn’t anything else that could cause it to increase. Could it have been already high before I started KETO? maybe.

(traci simpson) #9

Not if you are menopausal and start to gain weight even though you are doing KETO strictly. You have to look at hormones and protein.

(mole person) #10

I’d love to see this research. I try to keep on top of this subject but I’ve never seen this. Can you link?

(Full Metal KETO AF) #11

@Ilana_Rose @Diygurl19 Just look up Bikman and Naiman. Protein causes more insulin but also glucagon to counteract that effect. Shawn Baker eats about 4 lbs of red meat per day. There’s plenty of evidence if you look for it.

There’s a start. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Art ) #12

I like this explanation - covers it well.

(traci simpson) #13

Thanks I’ll give it a listen

(mole person) #14

I’ve looked at the research that these talks come from and they just don’t show this. Bikman and Naiman both claim that these amounts are ok but we are not seeing the effects on ketogenesis which is what we care about. It’s just their opinions. I’m not at all convinced.

(traci simpson) #15

What about this guy:

Not sure I believe what he’s saying.

(mole person) #16

@Diygurl19 No, me neither. I didn’t find it convincing at all and potentially harmful if he’s wrong.

I think that a very safe target is 1.5 g of protein per kg of goal weight for any normal person (some athletes may require more).

(mole person) #17

The person that I think has the most actual experience on this topic is Jason Fung. He seems to think that (for people actively losing fat) 0.6 grams per kg of current total weight works well, or 1 gram/kg of “fit” weight.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #18

Dr. Roseberg seems motivated by concerns over shortening longevity by activating mTOR. His protein recommendation, 0.6 g/kg LBM/day, is the bare minimum to replace the irreducible nitrogen loss from the deamination of amino acids.

Prof. Bikman’s take on the data is that mTOR is not a concern in a dietary context where the insulin/glucagon ratio is low—i.e., on a sufficiently low-carbohydrate diet. In that context, he feels, mTOR is not a concern. What is of more concern to him is the body’s increasing inability to make more protein, which is why he recommends an intake in the range of 1.0-2.0 g/kg LBM/day, and more toward the upper end of the range, the older we get:

(Full Metal KETO AF) #19

@Ilana_Rose It’s a controversial subject but not generally among the Carnivore crowd. I use 150g. as a ceiling personally, about 4 lbs away and closing in on my maintenance weight I average over a week 120g. per day sometimes hitting the 150g. mark, usually when a eat skin on chicken. I have trouble eating that amount of pork or beef generally. Chicken also considerably jacks up my fat for the day. I don’t set a fat macro but I average about 100-120g. per day, sometimes hitting 150g. or as low as 90g. per day. Tracking is more of a curiosity for me than something I obsess about hitting. But with variation in my daily diet it hasn’t been a problem for me. I just got a new HbA1c result this morning and it’s dropped again from three months ago into a solid healthy range from borderline. My ketones in my comprehensive blood panel were higher than the whole 11 previous months. I do not test them at home. Still waiting on triglycerides panel but I expect it to be better too. I have seen you post about protein excess causing you weight gain before. I don’t think it works like that for most people. :cowboy_hat_face:

(mole person) #20

You average 120 grams of protein. That’s a very reasonable amount for most men. Is it really 1 gram/lb of your goal weight though? That would have you at less than 120 lbs ???