Postparandial insulin response

(Kathy L) #1

I’ve heard on KetoTalk that you can test a food (or sweetener) to see if it causes an insulin response. If your BG drops after eating a food - that means it caused an insulin response (undesirable)

My question is-how far would your BG # fall to signify this? A couple points? A lot?

My experiment this morning had my BG fall from (fasting) BG of 94 to a 1 hr. postparandial of 89. Does this mean I had an insulin response & should avoid the food? In this case it was powdered swerve.

Thanks everyone!

#2

I’m no expert, but that seems like a null response to me.

(Richard Morris) #3

yeah that’s close to the limit for noise I would think.

(Stickin' with mammoth) #4

Um…I usually get something akin to a reactive hypoglycemic crash after eating ANY food in amounts greater than a few mouthfuls, regardless of previous hunger or ensuing satiety. Yet, fasting feels worse. It’s a little unnerving.

I’m batting around the idea of going no carb to combat this but then how the hell do I get in my fiber? My bowels are already holding me at gunpoint.

(Kathy L) #5

If you aren’t eating “carbage” you don’t need fiber like you used to. Fat keeps everything well oiled. So increase fat? I very seldom have a problem there -(not saying never tho)

Thanks @pilotbob & @Richard - good news to me!

(Stickin' with mammoth) #6

Ooooh, yes I do. I’ve never used so little toilet paper in my life. I’ve tried oils*, fats, water, salt, exercise, and coffee. It’s gotten uncomfortable. I don’t use medications as I prefer to find my way back out of rooms I’ve gotten myself into. Besides, anything in a pill bottle reminds me of doctors and sends me into a rage spiral like a rabid honey badger.

*The one thing that used to work was an inordinate amount of bacon along with its delicious lubricant but that volume makes me throw up now, literally.

(Larry Lustig) #7

Establish a baseline by measuring the effect of any equivalent amount of pure fat. For more meaningful results you should repeat the tests multiple times and, ideally, have someone give you the food prepared in such a way that you don’t know what you’re eating (granted that’s hard to accomplish).

(Ross Daniel) #8

MCT oil. Especially the generic stuff that has more than just the C8’s. Disaster pants…

(Arlene) #9

Magnesium powder. This stuff works VERY well, so be careful. Start with half a teaspoon before bed. It also helps with sleep. It dissolves quickly in a little water. I have never seen anyone that this didn’t work for.

(Stickin' with mammoth) #10

That’s a great suggestion, but unfortunately magnesium aggravates muscle cramping for me. I know, I know, the reverse should be true and it was for a long time but when I went keto, I had to ditch the mag and up the salt. Personal ratios, ya’ll.

(Barbara Greenwood) #11

OK, I’m interested in the insulin response from low carb meals…

With the Freestyle Libre, I’ve discovered that when I eat ANYTHING there is an initial drop in BG, for about an hour. It can go down by 1 mmol/l before it starts to rise. But when the meal is very low carb (less than 10g, say), the subsequent rise is not much more than the drop was, and sometimes not even that much. In other words, 2 hours after eating, I can be lower than I was before eating.

So - I can see the value of this for finding out whether an alternative sweetener causes an insulin response, cos that would be a reason to avoid it. But if any food is producing an insulin response… I can’t avoid all food, can I? It’s almost as though I’m having reactive hypoglycaemia, although not actually going hypo.

Would be interested in @richard’s take on this

(Richard Morris) #12

Fascinating observation

There are non stimulatory secretions of insulin. The hypothalamus can do it, send as message down the vagal nerve … “Food incoming stoke up the fires”. The Stomach can trigger some insulin release too responding to the stomach distending.

Part of the reason for this pump priming is some nutrients can hit the circulation early. So for example glucose in the mouth can cross straight into the blood vessels, and throughout the entire length of the gut that is true - even though the top of the small intestine is supposedly the major absorption site for glucose. Simple starches can be turned into glucose in the mouth too. More complex starches have to wait until lower down in the process. Proteins also have to be broken apart by stomach acid then pancreatic enzymes before they can enter circulation to stimulate insulin release.

So I suspect for a keto meal with protein and most carbs being complex, your body is just assuming your could be eating a high GI meal and just being conservative and assuming if it gives you too much insulin your liver will make some glucose.

It just occured to me a comment that @amber made during the podcast that she gets hungry most AS she’s eating might be related to this pump priming of insulin dragging BG low as you are beginning to eat.

(Jamie Hayes) #13

Kathy,

Have you tested this against a control? Say drinking water?

(Kathy L) #14

No I haven’t-but will try that… I guess I just assume water is a null event…

(Stephanie Hanson) #15

After reviewing my own glucose response testing, I also have this pattern. With a few exceptions. I wonder if this is also an indicator of IR. I had labs drawn and my HOMA-IR is 1.9. Not optimal and not horrid either. My A1c is 5.7 even after 8 months of Keto.

(Michael Wallace Ellwood) #16

Trigs to HDL ratio ( >2.75 in men and >1.65 in women) is supposed to be a surrogate marker for IR, as is Waist to Height ratio (> 0.5 ). Even plain old waist size (>35" women >40" men) is supposed to be significant.

I’m not sure I’d go by any one of those, but if all the ducks are lining up, as it were, it might be suggestive.