Ozempic/Trulicity method of action

science
(Susan) #25

Thank you. I’ll think hard about it. My husband doesn’t INSIST I do anything I really don’t want to, but he’s a BIG believer in vegetables. He’s okay with just keto veges, but he does insist I eat them daily. I suppose there are worse things a husband can insist on! He won’t want me to go carni, but I just might anyway.
I can even have sweets on carni. One of my meals is often 3 eggs, 1 c heavy whipping cream, flavorings (for me, 2 packets splenda and chocolate or caramel flavored stevia) and a few ice cubes.

(Alec) #26

Susan
My recommendation is give it a try for say 4-6 weeks. Your husband can’t complain about that, surely!? See how it makes you feel, and whether you lose any bodyfat. Then go from there.

I can assure you and your husband that there are NO nutrients you need in vegetables that you can’t get from fatty meat and eggs.
Cheers
Alec

(Susan) #27

@Alecmcq. Good idea. Thanks.

(Bob M) #28

@late_to_the_party I am not taking Pepto Bismol, figuring the inulin might be better for me. (Rather take a fiber than a “drug”.)

I usually put the inulin and allulose in raw milk, but I’ve also put it in yogurt. For the yogurt, I will sometimes add coconut flour. I usually have a “pudding” (Maria Emmerich’s recipes) with allulose in it too.

You could try inulin in the mug cake. It might work, but I don’t know.

I had started with 1 tsp of allulose in my raw milk (along with my normal collagen peptides). That worked okay, but then I went to 2 tsp of allulose. That worked a bit better.

It was after I saw Nick’s post about inulin that I added 1 tsp (only like 3 g of fiber) of inulin.

Since there are no long term studies of this, I don’t know what the long term effects could be. At some point, I’ll go back to not using them for a while. I did this when on vacation too, had a week where I did not take anything.

But I do think there’s some effect, and one that can last even into the next day. Lately, I’m not hungry even later into the day. Instead of getting hungry at 10am or so, I’ve been delaying hunger until 11am, noon, or later sometimes.

I plan on taking some time off to see what happens in a few week. Will the effect last? Or go away?

#29

Seconded.
And we should decide on our own diet anyway… I understand if a spouse goes against something really crazy and bad but carnivore isn’t like that, at all :wink: We just don’t need the vegs, at least most of us don’t, some people try out carnivore for long enough and it never works while keto does, that happens but if we look at nutrients in plants, we can get them all from animal products so there is a big chance that it will work for us. I am all for sane and safe trials :slight_smile: My own body definitely prefers carnivore over keto and low-carb, too bad my mind has some say too… But it still changed my life when I started my carnivore escapades. I never ever would have thought it is even remotely okay for me… Or doable even for a short time. And now carnivore-ish is my chosen woe even if my summers are way carbier… I don’t need the plants at all, I feel that, I have other reasons to eat some. I hope my September will be pretty much carnivore already, I know it would do me good. It’s handy to have a body that tells me right away if it likes my woe.

I call them desserts as they can’t be very sweet. We can’t have sweeteners on carni (I think… people have very varied ideas about the allowed items, I just call mine carnivore-ISH to cover everything but sweeteners are still banned there except the tiny erythritol in my very occasional mustard… still don’t know how to eat most type of sausages without it), sugars are fine though as long as they are animal sugars - but they can cause problems for many so it may be a good idea not to overdo them. Though… IDK about others but I don’t want very sweet things on carnivore. I need my desserts but sweetness is overrated! (And I still have a sweet tooth but different especially on carnivore. Whipped cream is good enough for me there, it’s sweet but not syrupy…)
I don’t think sweeteners make a big difference for the right type of people though, it may work for you, Susan. I have found it useful to avoid them even though it doesn’t mess up things for me. They aren’t food, my dairy items usually give me subtle sweetness and that’s enough… And I like challenge myself. It’s worse for many others.

(Susan) #30

@ctviggen. Thanks for the long, helpful message. I’ve ordered some inulin and will definitely give it a try. I’m not sure I would call bismuth a medication, it’s an element like sodium or calcium. I’m pretty sure it won’t do any harm, and it might help. We’ll see. I’d like to get off the Ozempic. I also ordered a continuous glucose monitor to help go off the Ozempic. FYI - the Freestyle Libre 3 CGM is a quarter the price from Costco compared to my local CVS. I’m 3 hours away from the nearest Costco so I’m getting them from their mail order pharmacy. I’ve already got some allulose and will start adding that now. Thanks again.

(Bob M) #31

If you also are trying allulose, here’s what I’ve been getting:

It’s powdered, though it doesn’t advertise that.

I did not know the Freestyle Libre 3 CGM is a quarter the price from Costco compared to my local CVS.

How much is the Freestyle Libre 3? This is over the counter (don’t need a prescription), but it’s $100/month:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/other/dexcom-launches-first-over-the-counter-continuous-glucose-monitor-heres-what-its-like/ar-AA1prT3K

(Bob M) #32

Update. I ate lunch from 10:52 am to 11:31 am (lunch = first meal; workout was from about 6:15am to 7am, body weight training, only coffee and tea for “breakfast”). I had 2 tsp of allulose and 1-2 tsp of inulin. I can’t remember, since I put this in the container last week and ate OMAD yesterday. I did have some stomach/digestive upset (growls), though, so I’m thinking 2 tsp of inulin. I’ve been trying to increase it, but I may have to stick with 1 tsp for a while longer.

It’s 3:41 pm, and the anti-hunger effect is finally kicking in to a large extent. Takes a good 4 hours or so to kick in. Will it last through dinner (not until about 7pm tonight), that’s the question.

(Susan) #33

I’ve always had a serious sweet tooth. My parents let us eat Fruit Loops for breakfast (90% sugar) and got us ice cream when we did something they wanted to reinforce like learned our times tables. Sugar because rewarding for me as a young child. I’m getting a continuous glucose monitor that should be arriving soon, so I can really test what impact the flavors and sweeteners have on my blood glucose. I went off all sweeteners for 2 weeks a few years back and it made no difference to my weight. I wasn’t trying to get off sweeteners, just see if they had an effect on my weight, blood glucose or ketones. Nothing changed so I felt safe going back to using sweeteners. There’s so many good options these days and fortunately there is no aftertaste to them for me.
In any case, I’ll start carnivore soon and watch my glucose when I have anything that’s sweetened. Thanks for all the good advice.

(Susan) #34

I needed a prescription for the CG Monitor. My local CVS was charging $263 for 1 monitor (14 days). For some reason, my doctor called in for 6 monitors and at Costco online pharmacy, they had a special coupon which was automatically applied and the monitors were $50 each. I’ve heard from the pharmacist at CVS that Dexcom costs a lot more. The price you quote, however, is the same, $100 a month. I know there’s a percentage added to everything that is shipped or (more likely for something like this) air frated to Hawaii, but not 6 times more!!
I read the short article you cited. I know Dexcom is a very good brand, but because of the price, the Freestyle has been much more popular (at least among people who talk about it on YouTube. I guess YouTube will eventually tell us if this OTC monitor is as good as the others.
I’ve ordered allulose from RxSugar. I don’t know how long it will take, but I prefer to get what I can directly from the company rather than using Amazon for everything.

#35

No, but while you’re on them you’re insulin sensitive and your appetite is controlled, which lets people (that aren’t lazy and doing it right) to very rapidly start correcting everything, and doing that does fix it as it pulls you out of the negative feedback loop you’re in.

People that want to still eat like crap and use it as a cheat are still screwed if they get off, but even right in the literature for them, they’re supposed to be used in conjunction with a good diet, everybody that takes it knows that. But at the same time, when people start seeing actual results, in many cases it motivates them to do it right as well.

If it were a “normal” drug, or a Peptide like Semaglutide, even if they were going to be lazy, if you’re gonna get stuck on something longterm, it’d be the peptide every time.

(Susan) #36

@lfod14
I hate to tell you this, but not everyone loses weight on strict keto. It’s not always because they’re lazy. I’ve been keto for 4 years and brought my HbA1c from 7.9 to 5.6. I no longer test my ketones but assume they’re okay since my A1c is so much lower. I generally have less than 20 grams of carbs a day and ‘cheat’ by eating the equivalent of a half a slice of bread about once a month. My problem is that I also have major depression. The genetic kind that shows no rhyme or reason as to when you feel depressed and has nothing to do with what’s happening in my life. There was no improvement to my depression in the weeks after I went keto and was measuring my sugar and ketones daily and definitely was in ketosis. This disease is not your run of the mill ‘I feel blue.’

When I’m depressed (not right now or I wouldn’t have the where-with-all to answer you) I don’t care how much I eat. I’m botomlessly hungry, even on Trulicity and keto and don’t care if I live and therefore don’t tolerate very primal hunger. I can eat 3 x a normal sized meal and still be hungry. It does go away a few hours after I’ve eaten double or triple what should be ‘enough’. I’m 2mad with a 16:8 eating window. I’m not sure how I have the will to stay keto when I’m depressed but can’t ignore the hunger, but I do. Thankfully. I’m off my diabetes meds and no longer damaging my body with glycation. No blindness or kidney disease for me!! I’ll just keep calm and keto on. I walked away from doughnuts that someone brought to work today and had a piece of cheese when I was hungry instead. Please don’t assume everyone that doesn’t succeed is lazy.

#37

Well I hate to tell you this, but I never claimed otherwise. I’ve gained weight on keto, a lot actually. Eating Keto doesn’t equal weight loss by itself, don’t think anybody has ever claimed that. Eating to much for your metabolism sure as hell will. Also feel free to quote where I said YOU or anybody specifically on this forum was lazy, and good luck with that. I was speaking in generality, which you knew by the context, but instead felt the need to offend yourself. Somebody that takes the weight loss peptides and chooses to ignore the part about fixing their diet IS lazy! They’re using it as a cheat and a way to avoid not eating crap all day.

On the bottomless hunger, Trulicity is a very weak GLP-1, “functionally identical” is complete BS. That’s like saying a good night sleep, coffee, and methamphetamine are all the same because they give you energy. Both targeting GLP-1 doesn’t make them the same any more than Tylenol and Percoset are. They both make pain go away…NOT the same! It can’t be compared to Semaglutide, Tirzapatide (stronger) or Retatrutide (strongest). You wouldn’t be a bottomless pit on those, I don’t care how depressed you were, you’d be throwing up at the thought of trying that. There’s a reason people go from Obese to wasting away on them if they don’t pay attention and get sucked down so low they invent stupid terms like “Ozempic Face”.

I say that as a binge eater of decades that binged my way to 300lbs, so nice try. You’re FAR from the only person here that’s been huge, the overwhelming majority of us were, or Diabetic, or Depressed, or BiPolar or insert metabolic issue here.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #38

That may or may not be true. People who have not experienced clinical depression simply are not capable of understanding what it’s like. Also, many of the drugs prescribed for depression cause people to get fat. Add the effects of the new weight-loss drugs on top of that, and the results are unpredictable.

What concerns researchers such as Benjamin Bikman is that so much of the weight lost on this type of drug is muscle tissue, and it is appearing almost impossible to rebuild after the drug is stopped. Also, the effect on peristalsis in the intestines that causes the longer “dwell time” appears to be permanent as well, which also increases the challenge of getting proper nutrition after stopping the drug.

Please try to remember that your views are shaped by your experiences, which most of the rest of us do not share. You will notice that I, too, have trouble understanding certain things that I have not personally experienced. Sometimes one simply has to live it to get it.

If we all share our perspectives, while realising that they are not the complete story, we are more likely to be able to combine them into a more-rounded group understanding which, in turn, is going to help people more effectively.

(Robin) #39

@PaulL @lfod14
Agree… and on this forum it’s important to remember EVERYTHING about our experience is personal. But we can’t take ANYTHING personally.

(Susan) #40

@PaulL. Thank you.

(Betsy) #41

Thank you for the video links. The videos by Nick Norwitz are very interesting, and move quickly so they aren’t boring.

I ordered some allulose and inulin and received them today. Can’t wait to try them.

(Betsy) #42

One interesting thing about GLP-1 is that the enzyme DDP-IV rapidly breaks down GLP-1, reducing its half-life to 2–3 minutes.

DDP-IV, dipeptidyl peptidase-4, is an enzyme that can help digest gluten and casein. A digestive enzyme called dipeptidyl peptidase IV, also abbreviated DPP-IV, is able to break down casein and gluten . This enzyme is naturally produced in your intestines.

So eating gluten and casein stimulates release of DDP-IV, which lowers GLP-1. On a ketogenic diet, gluten is avoided, but not casein. But if you are interested in the action of Ozempic, you might try to avoid casein, too.

(Susan) #43

@betsy2. Thanks! I already don’t eat wheat and I don’t have much cheese anyway, so yay. Thanks for letting me know. I’ve decided to do all the things that are recommended to increase GLP-1 and stop taking Ozempic. Allulose, inulin and peptobismol.

(Susan) #45

@Kinnessa Any idea if ‘impact’ means raise or lower? Both in the same direction or one up and one down?