November 2023 IF/EF Fasting Chat Thread - All Welcome

(KM) #21

Ended it at 96 hours. This was a really easy one.

(KM) #22

I usually do my fasts when Iā€™m alone, because I listen to myself and do what my body asks. (Which is usually pretty low activity. Sleep can be difficult, making it even harder to push the activity level.) Fitting the fasting in around everything else youā€™ve decided you want to do is definitely harder.

(icky) #23

Peri/menopause? Itā€™s tooootally messed up my metabolism tooā€¦ I used to be skinny, no matter what/ how much I ateā€¦ Since perimenopause started, my body glues every single calorie to my hips, butt, thighs, tummyā€¦ Itā€™s seriously annoying

(icky) #24

Iā€™m preparing to start an EF on Sunday and want to go for 8 days. Iā€™ve got a lot of EF experience and in the past, 8 days has been easy peasy, but I have no idea how Iā€™ll go this timeā€¦ So many life circumstances, health issues and other stressors are making everything seem daunting and beyond my current capabilities, but I really want to try to complete the 8 daysā€¦ Fingers crossedā€¦ :crossed_fingers:

(icky) #25

So Iā€™m trying to mentally prepare for starting my (hopefully) 8 day EF tomorrow. Iā€™m not sure what I feel like I need to being doing to make myself feel emotionally strong and prepared going into this.

I think I need to freeze a bunch of food in my refrigerator thatā€™s not going to keep for a week in the fridge. I donā€™t want to throw it away.

Iā€™ve got coffee at home, got broth, got herbal tea, got electrolytesā€¦ In theory, thatā€™s all Iā€™ll need for an EF.

Iā€™m going to clear out all the food (i.e. temptations) from my kitchen today and tomorrow and put them out-of-sight-out-of-mind for the EF.

Wondering what else I can do to provide myself some motivation and encouragementā€¦

#26

We used to have group fasts hereā€¦ They helped me a bit in my mere keto times when I still had plenty of carbs (the more carbs I eat, the easier fasting gets, itā€™s quite logical to me)ā€¦ Now on/near carnivore, I canā€™t do EF ever but I will make it happen, itā€™s not like it seems impossibleā€¦
I usually need a few days to get ready mentally for EF (and eat the not freezable but perishable food I have). I should figure out how to do it, I really miss having just those really short, 48 hour fasts I still had until a few years agoā€¦

GOOD LUCK and if you have any tips, tell me, I donā€™t know how to trigger even a smaller EF :frowning: I am not willing to suffer, thatā€™s clear but otherwiseā€¦ I really wish to get back my very rare shortish extended fasts.

8 days, oh my. I wouldnā€™t even want to go that longā€¦ 2-3 days sounds perfect to me. If I can get my body to be cooperative.

(KM) #27

I made sure I had some optional interesting things to keep me busy, some physical, some mental, but cleared out some of the mandatory todo list in case I felt tired rather than energized (Iā€™ve had both experience.).

Iā€™ve found the first and second days the hardest, after that most of the challenge is mental.

Good luck!

(KM) #28

And this place is sort of like an AA sponsor. If you come here and wail, someone is bound to send a little love your way!

(icky) #29

Haha, thanks Kib :relaxed: :orange_heart:

Well, Iā€™m starting my first EF day with a coffee and then heading out to the local animal shelter to volunteerā€¦

Right now Iā€™m feeling excited and also feeling okay about fastingā€¦

(icky) #30

2/3 through my 1st day and things are going smoothlyā€¦

Having a cup of vegetable broth and then some herbal tea.

I hope the following days are just as easyā€¦

#31

Since I started my ketovore style of eating, Iā€™ve progressively moved from three meals a day, to two and for the past 3 1/2 months Iā€™ve been OMAD. If I do get hungry, and it doesnā€™t pas, I will have two meals in the day, but thatā€™s become rare.
My max so far is about 32 hours. So Iā€™ll need to explore further!

(Geoffrey) #32

It seems to be a natural progression in this woe, or at least it was for me.
I used to eat by the clock, breakfast when I get up, lunch at noon and supper at 5. When I started carnivore I still did this until I started noticing that I was forgetting to eat. I began realized that my hunger signals were my bodyā€™s way of telling me I needed fuel. Therefore I decided to just let my body tell me when to eat.
Our bodies are an amazing machine.

#33

I went off carni, off keto in the weekend. With pretty satiating items so I have super long lasting extreme high satiation now. And Monday is coming so I will try to fast tomorrow and while itā€™s almost sure I will fail, I can expect another OMAD day (today wasnā€™t proper OMAD though, I had a few bites before and after but it was very close to it. carbs make OMAD so ridiculously easyā€¦ I still donā€™t want them for reasonsā€¦). I am super full now and probably wonā€™t get hungry for a dayā€¦ I must use the chance to push it so I will try to fast as long as I comfortably can!

I always had 2 natural proper sized meals, lunch after 2pm and dinner. But I had smaller meals sometimes. As far as I remember, I had 2 bigger and 1 tinier meal on high-carb (and optional snacks, probably. I was satiated but I liked to eat. but most of my snacks happened in the end of my meals. I think I had extra snacks as a kid), I did IF.
I kept it on keto but after a while I went from 3MAD 16/8 to 2MAD 19/5 (I used to have 3 hours between my not quick meals until carnivore where this time got shorter. sometimes. carnivore is a bit crazy if one is me).
Then carnivore was all over the place, okay, normally IF, sometimes not when I got hungry at night (before bedtime, I canā€™t wake up at night easily and I canā€™t eat when I wake up). 2-5 meals, usually 3-5 but lately I can do 2MAD on carnivore. Sometimes OMAD but itā€™s very hard on carnivore and very easy on high-carb as OMAD requires big meals and carnivore food is too satiating for that so I canā€™t eat my OMAD sized meals without extra efforts and focus and I canā€™t have that all the time, my current ā€œfavā€ food item (not what I like to eat most but what satiates me best and give me good macros. itā€™s not expensive and easy to get too) interferes, it satiates me too well - but I need good satiationā€¦ And more experiments I am sure.

I usually go for 2MAD and OMAD. OMAD is very tempting, it would make so many things simpler but itā€™s tricky without ā€œmuchā€ carbs. I could work even with keto but carnivore OMAD, thatā€™s tough.
Fasting until 5pm helps a lot though so that will be my goal, again. (I just love my lunchesā€¦ I cook, hours pass, my SO comes home, I am not satiated anymoreā€¦ Itā€™s hard to say no. I go back and forth about what is better, 2MAD or OMAD, it probably dependsā€¦ But I go for OMAD again. Or at least fasting until 5pm - or whenever I feel the need for food - and what happens, happens.)

(icky) #34

What is it you find difficult about fasting @Shinita? Maybe we can help?

Iā€™m just starting Day 2 and itā€™s going well. Not feeling any hunger at all. Iā€™m more fighting ā€œfeeling bored and hence wanting to eatā€ or " wanting to snack on something tasty".

I just ā€œsnackedā€ by having some of the brine that my Feta cheese comes in, that seems to have helped.

Iā€™m also a bit wary of the vegetable broth stock cubes I picked up from the supermarket last weekā€¦ I had a cup last night and it seemed to increase appetite, rather than to decrease it, which I found unusual. I may have to buy a higher quality one.

(icky) #35

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Just came across this onlineā€¦ Do you think itā€™s an accurate representation? It sounds reasonable to me, but I donā€™t know the science well enough to be able to tell whether these hour values are real or just guesstimatedā€¦?

#36

Not eating when I have an urge I suppose :smiley:
I have a serious food addiction, probably. But itā€™s fine and dandy as long as I have perfect satiation. When well-fasted, I am fine even without satiation. But then I get hungry so I must eatā€¦ But thatā€™s normal, itā€™s a bigger problem that I eat without need. Lunch is very triggering but today I will skip it!
I will work on the mental part, I know I donā€™t normally resist the slightest urge to eatā€¦ And itā€™s a bit much even to meā€¦ I never want to try hard, not eating, not fasting, thatā€™s just not my style.
I can only fight using bigger meals when it comes to the physical part. And hoping my body will be cooperativeā€¦ I wonā€™t stay (really) hungry when I have food, itā€™s basic to me. I can handle a tiny, soft, not annoying hunger nowadays, that is no problem.

Itā€™s a tiny bit simplified but I basically eat all the time when I can. I am only safe when I canā€™t eat because I am that very satiated or when I had my satisfaction, no big need for food either and I want PEACE. Eating can be a chore. I do love fasting too, not just eating and itā€™s simpler, better for lazy me when I donā€™t need to eat for some of my several reasons.
I often think my personality is the worst for fasting. I merely canā€™t eat until 2pm (typically, I have days with noon or 6pm) so I donā€™t do it.

I fortunately can use my teas for that, most of the time (not very often as I get bored of them, even if I have variety). Coffee isnā€™t good as I strongly prefer that with calories. And anyway, I want to quit. Not completely but mostly. I epically overdid coffee for too many years, itā€™s not bothersome physically (it does about nothing to me) but mentallyā€¦ Doesnā€™t seem good.

Broth always makes me want to eat (I specifically use it as a gateway food when my negative appetite makes eating solids impossible but I am very hungry. it probably wouldnā€™t have the same effect when my body doesnā€™t need food, itā€™s too low-cal for it but when I want to push fasting, I wouldnā€™t tocuh it. it has calories anyway) but most people say the opposite, that broth is great when fasting. I can easily imagine that a proper carnivore broth is fine for most people but the carbs in veggie broth may and do trigger hunger or appetite. So I suspect the plant carbs here.

I have bought some stock cubes lately (veggie and beef). They were nice though way too sugary (the vegs are already sweet and the added sugar was very annoying. I HATE added sweetness in my meaty dishes with one exception) and I will make my own from now on. I usually make a normal carnivore broth but stock cubes can be used immediately while getting bony meats and cooking a soup takes time and I donā€™t want to bother with it every time I would fancy a soup. I never saw ready made stock here but I wouldnā€™t buy it anyway, I have bought stock cubes after many years our of curiosityā€¦ These had no MSG and I didnā€™t know about the sugar until my order arrived. I keep forgetting people put sugar into everything, even things that are very bad with it if you ask my taste budsā€¦
Ew.

So, itā€™s Monday and I do my best to last as long as I can! I cooked so had my food joy, even baked! I didnā€™t cook for me yet, to be safe :slight_smile: Only baked but those are my usual things, they canā€™t tempt me seriously when well-fasted. Itā€™s only 2pm, I wait until about 5pm, ask my body and decide if I push for a full fasting day or OMAD will be good enough. If I will find things hard, I come here, sorry in advance :upside_down_face:

I REALLY had enough of my inability to fast properly. Itā€™s not simply my desire or something, my body is compatible with more fasting than what I do lately. And OMAD has advantages let alone a 40-48 hour fast (if I skip a day, it will be that long - unless a miracle happens and it becomes longer).

(icky) #37

Hmm, @Shinita ā€¦ that sounds quite trickyā€¦ Sounds like itā€™s a mental/ emotional thingā€¦

Because there are plenty good tricks (like drinking herbal tea so your tummy is filled with something warm) that usually works very well to quieten down any occasional hunger when fasting and usually itā€™s only a struggle for the first 24 - 48 hoursā€¦ After that the body ā€œunderstandsā€ that youā€™re fasting and switches into fasting mode, which usually makes all ā€œfeelingsā€ of hunger stopā€¦

(icky) #38

Oh @Shinita this could be a very helpful fasting hack for you - the fasting forum Iā€™ve been a part of for 15 yearsā€¦ Nearly everyone there starts a fast by using a gentle laxative (like magnesium sulfate) until your digestive tract is totally empty. You drink a glass of water with some magnesium sulfate mixed in, every 3 hours or so, until all youā€™re pooping out is clear liquid.

With your stomach and entire digestive tract empty, itā€™s a pretty immediate signal for your brain to go into its evolutionary ā€œfastingā€ mode. This is something that can really help regarding cravings or feelings of hunger. It doesnā€™t matter which type of laxative you use - find any type that suits you, all that matters is that your digestive tract is truly empty when you start into the fast.

Obviously, itā€™s also possible to fast without doing that, but especially if youā€™re having trouble with hunger/ cravings, itā€™s definitely worth a try.

#39

I dislike herbal tea (there must be some exceptions but I donā€™t bother to find them in the sea of the rest) so I donā€™t do that. I do have chai tea, itā€™s mostly spices and only a tiny bit of black tea (I almost only drink black teaā€¦ some fruit, some green but mostly black) and today I realized I can drink it SUPER weak (as itā€™s not horribly spicy) without some bland black tea as I run out of thatā€¦ :wink: I drink flavored warm water. Sometimes normal warm water, there is no problem with that, I just tend to want a tiny bit of a flavor in my warm drinks for some reason.
I am fine with drinking black tea or coffee even after midnight so I donā€™t care about that part :slight_smile: I try not to drink coffee in my fasting window, though. I did it today but headache is a serious reason for me.

Hunger isnā€™t emptiness of stomach. Itā€™s my body wanting food. Even if I drink 2 liters of water (itā€™s the amount needed to fill my stomach to its full capacity) or soup, it just makes me miserable as I still am hungry but CANā€™T eat for at least 15 minutes. And thatā€™s a long time for meā€¦
NOTHING helps when I am hungry except food. Itā€™s so obvious to me but I know not everyone works like this.
And lately waiting may help a tiny bit, it is very strange but hunger may go away for a little while, rare but happens. I used to get progressively worse hunger as time passed before (on keto, I think or was it low-carb? probably keto but not carnivore yet).

Apropos hunger! I skipped lunch, YAY! I am horrible at self control when it comes to food so even waiting 1 extra hour when getting kind of hungry is a big feat! :smiley: It was easier today as I deliberately didnā€™t cook foodā€¦ So when hunger came at 3pm (my SO still wasnā€™t at home so I was still safe enough), I saw that not eating is probably the best way to avoid some horrible hunger. Well-fasted hunger tends to be not so bad but after meal hunger is awful. If I donā€™t have at least 1600 kcal fat and protein ready to eat, I should NOT eat or I risk starving or being super stressed to find food to eat. My SO is the same but itā€™s 1000 kcal for him and he can starve better. I whine like crazy, at least inside and work on solving the lack of food problem. Starvation is the feeling here, we are still very well-fed, just had an inadequate amount of food in the previous several hours. We canā€™t handle small meals, fasting and staying hungry is LOADS better than eating too little and feeling a way worse hunger.

No, I wasnā€™t this good, I promptly cooked eggs :smiley: But I postponed the decisionā€¦ I am not good at decisions when hungry, good thing I have habits and lots of experience now. When the eggs got ready, I decided it would be a horrid idea to eat little (as I very well KNOW actually but tend to forget when hungry, I am too optimistic anyway) and my hunger went down too. So I am waiting now. Itā€™s 4pm. Tiny well-fasted fat adapted hunger, no problem. Mentally I donā€™t feel the need to eat something tasty (itā€™s easier after a weekend with lots of lovely food) so all is well.
My weekend was carby so itā€™s hard for me to get seriously hungry :smiley: Hopefully my carni weekends will be helpful too, I tend to have a bigger eating window with more food there, weekend is where I relax my ways more. So Monday will be my ā€œfasting until I kind of comfortably canā€ day. Itā€™s my plan since ages but the siren song of family lunch and other things usually was too strong for undisciplined me.
Fasting can be quite hedonistic though. I really enjoy it while it lasts. Stupid compulsions, I need to get rid of them all already.

Yeah well I am bad at struggling for 10 minutes :smiley: I tend to fast only until itā€™s easier than eating.
But my difficulties come with the time of the day. Not eating until 2-3pm? Trivial. It would be harder to eat.
But when I get a bit hungry, it starts to wear me down and an hour is a huge feat. It depends though. What kind of hunger, am I busy with something even more tempting than eating (this forum is great to postpone eating, I even get food joy here, talking about it. photos are a bit problematic when hungry, nice when just fasting)ā€¦ But hunger is something I still may be able to ignore for 1-2 hours if itā€™s not bad.
But the ā€œneed for fuelā€ urge stops my fast. I donā€™t ever say no there. Itā€™s not good feeling weak and dizzy. I still could ignore it if it was just the discomfort (with some extra determination, not being my usual self) but itā€™s such a clear message from my own body that I donā€™t argue. My body has power. And I have a heart :smiley: I wouldnā€™t torture my body even if it wouldnā€™t fight back.
WHY I have this weak dizziness when I have lots of fat to use? No idea. My body has its temper tantrums, thatā€™s why. It clings to this 40 lbs extra fat I have. Odd as I easily slimmed down further while eating lots of carbs (low-carb but still)ā€¦ But my stress/shock gain I got at some point never left me. Will I be 75kg foreverā€¦? I canā€™t get enough muscle for that to be okay. Oh well. I keep trying. I have ideas, the realization is a bit hard as I must go against my very deep wishes. I already eat way less fat than what I would like but I should lower it significantly, thatā€™s the worst. Theoretically itā€™s not but it is. EF could help me so muchā€¦

I only had one longer (for me) fast, it was 5 days. I ate high-carb at that time so starting was pretty easy when I got properly curious therefore determined. The first day probably was mildly hungry but easy. The second day is always challengingā€¦ But then, indeed, I stopped being hungry. Until day 5 when I got hungry and promptly ate. A few bites as I couldnā€™t more. Next day I ate like before. I did become some food zombie on day 4 so it was high time for me to stopā€¦ Especially that I had no idea about electrolytes so I had zero sodium during my whole fast. It was fun, I would like to repeat it just once in my life (with some salt when I feel the need) but I am not sure I will, itā€™s so longā€¦ I want occasional 48-72 hour fasts. Longer ones arenā€™t mandatory and I never would want very long ones.

I am sorry I am so dismissive, maybe it would help with fasting but I hate laxatives (I had it twice, unintentially. not in big enough amounts to get diarrhoea, thankfully but still. it was a very odd, unpleasant feeling). Nope, not that. I rather choose hunger and mild personality modification. But itā€™s interesting that an empty digestive track works against body hunger (I mean, I can get mentally triggered hunger tooā€¦)! Just because itā€™s the same as what we have after some fasting? But other parts of our body and our mind isnā€™t in that state yetā€¦ :thinking:

4:30pm. It is fun, I have a negative appetite now :smiley: Andā€¦ No hunger? Wow. I get excited, IDK why though 1.5 hour without eating after the first baby-hunger is remarkable from me, not super rare but somewhat unusual :smiley:

Thanks for talking to me, the fasting as topic on my mind really helps. Just like being in the carnivore thread helps me with sticking to carnivore.

I never know how to talk about fasting without talking about food though. To me, the two are very seriously connected. The key to my fasting is eating properly first. After some time it changes, of course but I still need food thoughts or else it would be very odd.

(icky) #40

If your stomach is so big from years of over-eating, then a longer fast would actually be ideal for you. When you fast for 1 - 2 weeks, your stomach shrinks to a much smaller size, making it much easier to feel ā€œfullā€ from smaller portions after your fast. It could be a very helpful ā€œresetā€ for you.