Newbie with strange keto figures

#1

Hello again. I am a newbie to this forum (and fairly new to the keto diet), though I am experienced in intermittent fasting.

I bought one of those keto breath meters (not keen on pricking myself all of the time, or on the cost of doing so). Machine says:
from 0 to 1.9 = no ketosis
from 2 to 3.9 = very early stage of ketosis
from 4 to 9.9 = light ketosis
from 10 to 40 = optimum ketosis

I measured my keto level yesterday morning, and I was at 18. This followed a very fat meal the evening before, after getting home after an all-day fast (OMAD) and being measured at 8. So I had one day of fast which brought me at 8, followed by a very fat dinner which brought me at 18 the following morning.
I fast again all day (another OMAD), and get back home yesterday evening thinking that my ketosis would be well above 18. The result was 12, repeated twice. No coffee etc in the 2 hours before measuring in the evening, measurements in the morning are first thing.
The question is: how does this keto thing work exactly during the day? Is it possible to fast more than 12 hours from a measurement and see the level of ketones going… down? When I fast, I fast. Zero calories, water and black coffee. Nothing else.
Many thanks for your kind answers!

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #2

Relax!

Ketone levels fluctuate throughout the day; this is normal and not a problem. You may notice that ketones are lower in the morning and get higher throughout the day.

Bear in mind that breath meters are measuring excreted acetone, and there is some question about how well excreted ketones correlate with actual ketone production. The measurement commonly used in research is serum β-hydroxybutyrate, and even that is not a measure of ketone production, just a measure of the gap between production and consumption. I would also expect some lag in measuring breath acetone, since it takes time for the acetone to make its way through the blood stream and into the lungs to be excreted.

I guess what I’m saying is that you are doing fine. Keep calm and keto on. :bacon::bacon:

#3

Many thanks Paul L! I just did not know that ketone levels fluctuate during the day! I think I will relax as you say and keep piling on the bacon :wink:

(Alec) #4

Paul is spot on… there are plenty of us (maybe even the majority??) who have never tested our ketone levels. Ketones are a by-product of what we are doing, it is not the purpose of it. They are a nice by-product. But the principle of the keto diet is simply eating very low to no carbs.

When your liver burns fat for fuel, one of the by-products is ketones, and our bodies uses those ketones for fuel. One of the key benefits of this very low carb ingestion is low insulin, and it is this that is one of the key drivers of health benefits, along with lower inflammation generally in the body.

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #5

Yeah, when first starting Keto I thought it was an ‘On’ / ‘Off’ switch. Either in Ketosis, good, or not in ketosis, very bad. I don’t think that’s quite how it works.
As Paul said, relax. You can’t break anything lol

#6

All that stuff is made up marketing, you’re either in Ketosis or you’re not. Dont waste effort into caring about ketone levels. Breath ketones also dont last for long, then its down to blood, but still useless. As @Alecmcq said, they’re a by-product, nothing more.

Fasting for Ketones either way is just faking numbers, it’d be like an uncontrolled diabetic going for a glucose tolerance test, and during the wait injecting some Insulin. They’ll pass the test great, but it wasn’t real.

Also, fat has nothing to do with it, ketosis is from a lack of carbs to burn as a primary fuel source, not because of eating high fat.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #7

I’ve been working to try and formulate this, because it might be important. As I figure it, the actual point of a ketogenic diet is to lower insulin, because chronically elevated insulin damages the body, as does elevated glucose. This means that lowering carbohydrate intake is necessary, so that insulin can go down. From this perspective, the ketones’ importance is that they show that insulin has dropped low enough, and they are much easier to test for at home. No one has yet come up with a cheap and easy at-home insulin test.

However, there are other considerations. Fructose is a metabolic poison; it damages mitochondria, which affects every cell in the body, but particularly in the liver. Too much glucose can, under certain circumstances, be converted by the body into fructose, as well, not to mention that glucose itself causes damage to the mitochondria and other parts of cells. It can generally gum up the works by attaching itself to other molecules (glycation), and it also promotes oxidation. (Note that when insulin is elevated it turns off the body’s natural oxidation defences, which doesn’t help.) When glucose glycates haemoglobin, it literally becomes stickier and readier to clot. The body can handle a certain amount of glycated red blood cells, since they require glucose to live, but there is a limit to what is okay.

So in one way, it’s the lowering of insulin that is important, but the removal of metabolic toxins from the diet is also extremely important. Add to that the fact that the three ketone bodies, on top of being fuel sources for cells, also have potent hormone-like effects on the body, and you have another major benefit, right there. When you think about the complexity of what a ketogenic diet does, it becomes clear that fat loss, while very nice to experience, is the least of what is going on.

#8

Many thanks to all again, particularly to PaulL. This forum is a treasure trove. I will be sure to stick around!!

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #9

I’m new here and I’m finding this forum an amazing resource… with very help members