Newbie with questions as prolific as bacon in a Keto diet!

[JackieBlue]

Hello!

Hubby and I just started Keto on 8/25/18. He needs to lose a fair amount of weight and get off the path to diabesity both his parents paved for him. I could stand to lose a few pounds, as well, after having 5 kids and leaving my career to stay home and chain myself to the stove for our anaphylactic food allergic children (3 of them!! how does that happen?!).

However, my main motivation in starting this WOE is to lengthen my husband’s life (he doesn’t get a break from raising 5 kids any sooner than I do!) and to address my own increasingly aggressive arthritis symptoms/inflammation.

One of our children developed epilepsy as a toddler and I researched the Ketogenic diet for him back then. We started it and his seizures did stop, but then one of the other children developed anaphylactic allergy to dairy and we had to eliminate dairy for the entire household. (They’re like shark embryos, these children).

Over the interceding years, we’ve been no strangers to extreme elimination diets, gut healing and clean eating with the entire top 8 allergens removed. I knew we could handle hubby and I going Keto.

We cook Keto main dishes and let the kids eat carb-y side dishes along with the meals and we’ve got a great support system in a more experienced couple who re-introduced the diet to us.

I joined this forum and read through most of the material for newbies, including the FAQs. Many of my questions have already been answered thanks to this wonderfully thorough and user-friendly site! Thank you!

Here’s where I’m at and hoping those who are more experienced/knowledgeable can help me with:

In this month of switching to Keto within our loving union, hubby and I:
went through keto flu together starting on day 2,
faithfully avoided all sugar and any carbs past 18 grams daily so far
gagged down greasy fat and mounds of meat until we started to love it,
dragged ass through the fatigue during back-to-school-season with 5 kids (imagine being staked naked and covered in honey to a fire ant hill if the fire ants were fed crack first) that lasted about 2 wks,
entered ketosis (day 6 for me, 2 wks for him) and verified it with pee strips and a friend’s blood meter,
and celebrated renewed and increased energy and mental clarity together (3 wks for me, 4 wks for him)
also - my joint pain is at an all-time low and my endurance for intense exercise is already markedly increased.

Now hubby is testing our marriage by losing weight without me.

I have gotten quite discouraged at every weigh-in, but I just remind myself that I am sleeping better, having less joint pain, more mental clarity and energy…but still, I want to know why it isn’t working for me! Must be the ‘J’ in my intense INTJ! So, here is the only background I can guess might be relevant:

I know i’ve been in ketosis for over 3 wks as I test with the pee strips and my friend tested us with her blood meter. I always show up as ‘moderate’ with a nice raspberry color.

I lost 5# the first week, but knew it was water weight. Hubby’s weight loss continued consistently after an initial 4# loss, but mine abruptly turned into gaining 3 of the pounds back, despite devoted ketoing.I stopped any intense exercise until the last week and a half, when I went back to intense bike riding up the small mountain we live on. (high intensity for maybe 30 minutes about 3-4 days/wk)

My friend did look at my macros on the Keto app (KetoDiet) and realized my allowances were way too high, so I adjusted that about a week and half ago and now my numbers are drastically reduced.

We’re almost a month in now and hubby has lost 10# without even tracking his macros (just cut out the sugar and almost all carbs) and I have still barely lost 2.

Body composition-wise, he’s a tall teddy bear and I’m a brick shit house - can that have something to do with it? in other words, I’m a muscular build and he’s fluffy. If I gain weight, I just get bulky with very little jiggly fat, he’s all jiggle. He could probably stand to lose about 50#; I could probably still hold a dress up if I lost 25#.

Or can it be that not having dairy in our diets for so long and now suddenly eating it like it’s the last food on earth is objectionable to my body? (Obviously my body is smarter than his, that goes without saying and is not his fault, poor dear).

Or…can it be that this diet is screwing me up hormonally? I did read only 2 negative things about this diet that appeared to hold a grain of scientific truth to my untrained mind:

1. It can cause hormonal problems for women with underlying thyroid issues. I don’t have any of those but I am a woman of a certain age with a certain life change allegedly looming and I suppose if that isn’t already an endocrinological system in an uproar, I don’t know what is! To clarify: my cycles were fairly regular before, but just starting to get less so this past year and when I started Keto, I was due for my special lady time 2 wks after starting this WOE (some woe with my WOE, if you will, ha!) Well, my special lady time has yet to make its appearance! In its place I’ve been having special hot flash time. Especially every time I eat! Hot enough to wake me up at night sometimes. I was thinking about making an appt with my Dr., but I don’t know how Keto knowledgeable she is and don’t want to get scared off before I’ve given it a fair shot.

2.That going Keto can cause kidney stones. Not that I’ve ever had one or think it’s an issue in my failure to launch, but hubby has a history and I just want to be prepared mentally if he’s going to strip naked on the floor and roll around again, moaning in a cold sweat and vomiting while pretending he is even close to being in the kind of pain that comes close to childbirth.

I also have a hard time getting all my fat macros in, but my protein is gone before dinner. And I’m not ready to fast yet, I’m still pretty hungry at the three mealtimes.

So, to sum it all up, what I’ve gleaned here is that maybe I should give it a little longer, esp. with my macros needing to be adjusted. Maybe I should try to incorporate some fasting, if I might be the type not to lose easily on Keto. I should definitely try to eat more to my fat macros and stretch my protein more.

Assuming you wise ones agree with those conclusions, here is what I still need guidance on:

Can dairy be holding me back b/c I eliminated it for the last decade and my body wants it to stay that way?
Are my hormonal experiences normal for we more seasoned women, or cause for concern?
Does body composition come into play with regards to initiation and/or rapidity of weight loss?
Do ppl who have more to lose, lose more sooner on this WOE?
and
please tell me
what do you reach for when you have fat macros left to eat, but no protein and not many calories? (cutting out carbs is not a problem for me, eating the fat is! So far I go for avocados and make a fat bomb mousse out of heavy whipping cream and sugar free pudding packs, but I need more ideas!)
Thanks!

[Stabla]

I don’t do dairy. It seems problematic for me. You can go off dairy for a couple of weeks then have a dairy day. Note how you feel after. Also see if it knocks you out of ketosis. Pee strips can be inaccurate. Don’t weigh for a while just keep track of how you feel, look or clothes fit. A pound of fat is much larger than a pound of muscle so you may be adding muscle while losing fat therefore gaining weight. I listened to a doctor on a podcast and he said if you want to age lose muscle. My point is weight can be a deceptive marker. From what I have read and experienced hormones tend to get better on Keto diet. That being said women’s bodies can be tricky and that may not be true for everyone. I also went through some hot experiences for a couple of weeks but they did finally level out. I personally would not drop my protein down. Many women get far too little. There is a great YouTube talk from Dr. Ben Bikman about the subject. You really should give this a couple of months during which time you learn all you can, make the most nutritionally dense choices of food and simplify your eating. After that you might want to invest in some comprehensive urine hormone testing.

Podcast are great to listen to and there are tons to pick from. You can listen while driving, cleaning,cooking, etc.
here are some of my favorites:
Low carb cardiologist
Naturally nourished
The Keto diet
Keto talk
Keto geek
Paleo solution

I find the more I know the better able I am to stay focused on my goals and to adjust my diet. I think it is important to keep your diet growing in healthy ways that are individually good for you.

[Happyheart]

Don’t forget 2 keto dudes and keto Woman podcasts.
It really does seem to be a n=1 experiment. I agree drop the milk and see if there is a difference.
Perimenapause is a very unique time and I’m sure messes with hormones and weightloss in different ways.
Sometimes time is all that is needed to see the loss. I’ve been lucky. I’m 53 post menapause and have lost PRETTY consistently for the past 8 months. There have been weeks where I was the same, or bouncing around the same, for 1 or 2 weeks or even a bit longer, at the same weight, but it’s headed down eventually.
For me I find my appetite is usually pretty light and I sometimes had to eat a little more to see a change after a “stall”.
Men and women are just different so don’t expect the same results. My hubby is not keto and is heavier than me but is losing weight in spite of the fact he eats sugar and ice-cream pretty regularly. Not fair but it is what it is. I still hope to convert him to this way of eating for his long term health. (He still has some fat to lose so maybe. He’s said he’s concidered it. )
Anyways those are my opinions on this. Sorry it’s more of a response to JJ and Stabla.

[dlc96_darren]

I lost 5# the first week, but knew it was water weight. Hubby’s weight loss continued consistently after an initial 4# loss, but mine abruptly turned into gaining 3 of the pounds back, despite devoted ketoing.

I think what your obviously pointing out here is men are superior to women. It’s best if you just except that, now.

Seriously, @JackieBlue, by your sense of humor I can tell you are a wonderful woman. I certainly believe you’ll find the answers your looking for on this forum.

A couple of things that came to mind while reading your post. Keep in mind, I’m not an expert and I don’t know if this is the case with your stall, but maybe you’re not fully fat adapted yet, so your body is still trying to figure things out. This could take little more time. It’s easy to quickly notice all the changes when you switch to eating ketogenic, that it’s hard to believe it takes awhile to get fully fat adapted.

Also, it sounds like there are a few (5, maybe 6) sources of stress in your life. Don’t forget the connection with cortisol and weight gain.

Stress and Weight Gain

Originally published at: https://obesitycodepodcast.com/{0eb281111a263d82d3fea6fde634cdebe92eb16973b39eb5d07b6c86ca51e6ba}postname{0eb281111a263d82d3fea6fde634cdebe92eb16973b39eb5d07b6c86ca51e6ba}/ [image] Published: Dec 12, 2017 Powered by PodetizeIDM patient Cheryl learns to manage personal and professional stress to overcome obesity and depression Links: BOOK: “The Big Fat Surprise” by Nina Teicholz BOOK: “Always Hungry” by David Ludwig STUDY: Mindfulness Intervention for Stress E…

Exercise hinder weightloss?

Hello Keto fam, I’m not new to Keto (2+ years), but this seemed to be an appropriate section for my question. Work has been a bit dull lately and I have a gym in the same building. To help kill some time, I’m tempted to start walking for 45 minutes or so on the treadmill everyday. I know of course about the small health benefits of exercise, I also know that Weightlifting or HIIT are superior, and lastly I know that exercise is pretty much useless for weight loss which is my current goal. With…

Those are just a couple of thoughts that come to mind.

This seems to be very common. My wife, Lisa, has pretty much stalled after eating keto for about 20 months, now, and I keep loosing. (like I said, superior) And we’re still trying to come up with different ideas to break that stall. She’s not on the forum, but when I read how someone broke their stall, I share it with her.

I know it’s frustrating, but always keep in mind (like you’ve already pointed out) there are multiply benefits to this WOE/WOL that go far beyond just weight loss, so don’t be disheartened, if it takes awhile. KCKO

And good luck with those shark embryos!

[Lou52]

You are hilarious and I laughed out loud reading your post. Especially the kidney stone part I don’t have any genius advice other than I too am a “seasoned” woman who got the delightful hot flashes with this too and am enduring a slow weight loss. Thanks for the laughs, hang in there, mountain mama!

[Ilana_Rose]

Your post made me laugh out loud!

First of all, don’t worry yet. There are a lot of tweeks that can be made. You asked if ppl who have more to lose will lose faster and the answer is absolutely. If all you have is an extra 25 lbs or so than it will take much longer to lose than for someone who has 75 lbs to lose their first 25 lbs.

It’s hard to give advice without knowing how you’re eating now. Maybe you could give us a bit more information about your physical stats, what macros you’ve settled on, and what a typical day is like meal-wise. What do you eat and when? I’m concerned to see your answer because you shouldn’t be running out of your protein macro before dinner.

However, without that I can offer a few suggestions. First, you said you just changed your macros significantly a week and a half ago. That’s not a lot of time, give it a bit more before you are sure that it’s not kicking in for you yet.

Try to spread the protein across all your meals and top each with plenty of fat to make them satiating. You don’t want to be eating the fat by itself at the end of the day.

Also, you do not need to be finishing off that fat macro. Fat is there to fill you up but shouldn’t be eaten if you’re not hungry just to satisfy the macro. Think of it as a top end, but not a target. The only target number on this way of eating is the protein macro.

Although dairy might be a problem, and is for some, another problem for MANY is eating anything with artificial sweeteners. I’d try giving those up first.

I was in a very similar place to you when I started. In my early 50’s and with 25 lbs to lose. I had to make several tweeks to lose them all. And I am still gaining and losing the final 5 lbs endlessly…lol.

Don’t lose heart yet. There is a lot to try still.

[JackieBlue]

Thank you! I listen to books constantly - I look forward to putting Neil Gaiman"s latest on hold to check these out!

[JackieBlue]

Thank you for the encouraging reply, Darren. I hear what you are saying about men being superior! I hear it while you get on the computer for your wife and do the legwork and research and report back to her all the info she needs to succeed at Keto. You put the ‘Super’ in Superior for sure!
(Please ask your wife to send more tips on how to keep morale and self-esteem up in our inferior mates - she’s obviously a pro!)
I’d write more, but I’m currently experiencing a failure to launch with Keto and hubby needs to log some serious time on the forums to figure it out for me!

[dlc96_darren]

(Please ask your wife to send more tips on how to keep morale and self-esteem up in our inferior mates - she’s obviously a pro!)

She is indeed!

I’d write more, but I’m currently experiencing a failure to launch with Keto and hubby needs to log some serious time on the forums to figure it out for me!

That is wise.

[JackieBlue]

Ilana -
Thanks for the reply. I would love for more experienced eyes to look at my macros and stats and tell me what they think. B/c I do not trust this damn app. I’m certain it is stealing macros from me. I blink, and Boom! I’m down 80 calories. I haven’t caught it in the act yet, but when you know, you know.

So, stats: Brick shithouse isn’t detailed enough, I suppose? I’m 5’ 3" and 162#.
It’s very evenly distributed weight: half is in my left boob and half is in my right boob.
I have no idea what my body fat composition is, but apparently it brings rage and shame upon our family name, in the eyes of our 18 yo bodybuilder son. (Funny how bearing him is what blew up my body and I don’t begrudge him one single pound or stretch mark and now that he’s an Adonis carved from marble, my Oprah arms are a lost cause he shakes his head mournfully over!)

How I’m eating now is devotedly, despite my confusion and discouragement. I haven’t thought about backsliding or cheating once, even when I shop at Costco and the pizza looks like limp greasy sex to me. (Think of the limp and greasy as how you feel after the sex, not during - and that metaphor works a little better!)

My first Macros were so high, I was dreading mealtimes. I thought maybe you had to cram all this extra fat in to rev up your metabolism or something. It’s a miracle I stuck with it, b/c I was eating 3 avocados dipped in bleu cheese a day and an omelette loaded with bacon and sour cream and almond butter fat bombs and steak and cheese…

So my friend looked at them and her hair stood on end. I went back and redid the goals thing, but all I really changed was how chubby the outline of the woman was. I actually picked the next chubbier outline than I did the first time (b/c apparently I WAS the only person in the history of Keto actually getting chubbier on it!!) and yet the macros came out almost cut in half. She also said I should not input how much exercise I get, which is sporadic as it is based on the weather and my joint pain, anyway. So with those adjustments, the numbers now are:

1411 Calories daily 120 grams of fat daily 18 grams of carbs daily 66 grams of protein daily

I almost always have carbs left over - that part is not hard for me. Today I have 11 grams of carbs left. But protein is always gone between lunch and dinner and fat is gone with dinner. Today I went a little over them both, as well as my calories. How do these numbers seem to more experienced ketoers? I did coincidentally just get Invisalign and the constant retainer thing in my mouth might be making me feel extra hungry until I get used to it. I’m one of those ppl that could never chew gum b/c 10 chews into it, my stomach thinks food is coming and I’m starving.

I try to eat an avocado every morning to start getting my fat in. Sometimes I put bleu cheese on it. I get recipes from Keto sites and cookbooks and I make these tuna melt muffins that are only 1 carb each. Those are a staple almost daily.(omg, they taste just like Red Robin cheesy biscuits!!) I make a loaded salad with butter lettuce and rotisserie chicken and bleu cheese and colby jack shreds and boiled egg slices. We have a shrimp and green bean and zucchini stir fry with avocado oil that we do for dinner a lot. We get Costco rotisserie chickens and we make steak at least once a week, sometimes twice if we can convince the kids that Spam is way more desirable. Hubby makes 3 egg omelettes and I will eat a boiled egg with bleu cheese if I don’t have time to cook. I’m not eating a lot of packaged/processed food, but I am using Stevia in recipes. I have never consumed coffee and quit chai teas cold turkey when I started this WOE. Honestly, I didn’t have a lot of bad habits or cravings to give up. I never drank soda or ate chips or junk food or many sweets. Except coconut milk truffles, which don’t count if nobody sees you eating them. We were already forced to eat pretty clean for our kids’ food allergy issues. What got hubby is eating crap at work all day.

What got me is the frantic hoarding mentality of living with 5 skinny kids who never stop eating. The oldest is a body builder and his trainer told him he needs 6,000 calories a day!
If I was there, I swear I would have cut that man.
With a rusty spoon.
Slowly.

We are all going to look like the stick figure family everyone has on their cars soon, except for one golden, gleaming, musclebound boy. By the end of the week, when groceries are running low, I fear for neighborhood cats. Every time someone posts in the neighborhood forum that another cat is missing, I look at him askance. There’s no stopping them from eating everything in the fridge when they get this big and strong. If you slap them, it only hurts your hands. You’d hoard truffles in your underwear drawer, too. Don’t judge. You should have seen his face light up when we brought dairy back into the house for this diet. He’s been melting cheese on top of his cheese.

I do drink the powerade zero drinks as they saved my life during keto flu and I can still tell when I need more electrolytes. I don’t think the artificial sugar is holding me back, but i’ll cut that out before I cut out dairy if things don’t pick up.

I am still pretty darn hungry. I definitely feel like I’m not getting enough to eat with these macros, but I’m trying to keep myself busy and distract myself from thinking about it. The hunger is not the same kind of shaky, frantic carb hunger I have always known, but it is a clean, strong, hungry-like-the-wolf-without-the-weird-stripy-makeup-and-lots-more-clothes-because-boobs hunger. if I let it go too long, I will end up headachy and feeling nauseated.

What someone mentioned about maybe not being totally fat adapted yet makes sense to me. I have a terrible lemon addiction. I can eat 2-3 a day. I eat them like peeled apples, with salt. It’s what I decided today I have to give up next. Too many carbs! I ate 2 last night and when I peed on my morning stick, it was bone white, no keto whatsoever. I carried on and ketoed on and by 10 am, it was dark raspberry again. I plan to get the meter soon, but the strips seem accurate enough so far. This is the first time it’s been negative for keto - can that indicate I’m still adapting to fat?

Also, this is slightly off-topic, but do many ppl find their dreams become very vivid and intense on this WOE? I’m sleeping better and feeling more energized and almost never like a Mombie since getting into ketosis, but the dreams are like going to the movies every night when I fall asleep! Last night I dreamed I was lounging on a couch in an apartment over a bar and a man came in and shot me in the shoulder. Very rude, to say the least!

Also, is there anything at all I can eat when I’m still hungry and I’ve used all my numbers up? Like packing peanuts, or anything at all? If I absolutely have to have something, is it better to go over with the fat, or the protein?

Thanks again for the help!

[Natasha]

Goodness, you are hilarious! I’m laughing like I laugh at @celestebarber!

[atomicspacebunny]

To clarify: my cycles were fairly regular before, but just starting to get less so this past year and when I started Keto, I was due for my special lady time 2 wks after starting this WOE (some woe with my WOE, if you will, ha!) Well, my special lady time has yet to make its appearance! In its place I’ve been having special hot flash time. Especially every time I eat! Hot enough to wake me up at night sometimes.

Usually this will return to normal!

Related:

1. “Amenorrhea occurs due to the drop in levels of many different hormones, such as the gonadotropin-releasing hormone (GnRH), which starts the menstrual cycle.” …Here’s the good news: Once your body gets used to being in ketosis, your period will likely return to its regular routine, according to Perfect Keto. …More

2. Dried Urine Test for Comprehensive Hormones (DUTCH) (If you really want accuracy about your progesterone estrogen ratios and other hormones)

3. 12 Tips to Balance Estrogen Levels Naturally - Dr. Jockers

4. Tip: What board certified gynecologist and endocrinologists are learning about herbs whether they like it or not (because it really works and they can’t sell it) to balance out estrogen and progesterone levels naturally and detox the liver and gallbladder: Milk thistle, cysteine, glycine, inositol, taurine, MSM Sulfur, Vitamin B6 & 12, Vitamin C, biotin, selenium, zinc, dandelion root, artichoke extract (seems to be the best one) and beet extract.

[Jacymac]

Love your posts.
You mentioned still being hungry - It is fine to add more fat so that you are not hungry. Especially in the early stages.
Eat fat to satiety - this means have enough fat with your meal so that you can go a few hours until your next meal without snacking, and not be hungry. This self regulates pretty well so as you become more efficient at using your body fat, you will reach satiety quicker.

[Ilana_Rose]

lol…you are absolutely hilarious. I want to get you sorted out just so we can keep you on this forum. Selfish, I know!

Ok, so your macros look fine to me for now, but you don’t seem to be fat adapted yet. You can tell you’re fat adapted by the feeling of regular hunger leaving you. It does that when your body is easily attacking it’s fat stores when food isn’t coming from the plate. Until that happens I wouldn’t worry about exceeding your macros a bit on either fat or protein. But, while you are in that phase you can’t really expect to see losses. It’s like a period of priming the pump. It takes fat adaptation for some people to really start losing weight.

BUT, I do see an area of concern. Although you SHOULD eat to satiety WHEN you eat, you should also be eating more rarely. The reason why the ketogenic diet works is that it keeps insulin much lower all the time and much, much lower in the longer windows between meals. For some people, those longer windows are crucial to any success at all. I’m not going to suggest that you cut out breakfast when you still say that you are feeling a lot of hunger, but you should cut out all the snacks. Only eat at meal times and give your body a chance to get into a reduced insulin state so that it can start chewing away at you fat stores. At first you will feel a bit hungry but just eat to satiety when your meal time comes and those feelings of hunger between meals should dry up fast.

Also, count your carbs very carefully. Those lemons have six net carbs each, so two will go through 2/3rds of your carb allocation. On top of that every ounce of cheese has at least one, every egg has at least one, every tablespoon of cream has one, and a good sized salad will put a major dent in it as well. At first it’s a good practice to enter every quantity of every food in a tracking app to find out where you may be running into trouble. I’ve found myself failing to meet 20 grams of carbs just from overdoing cream in coffee. It’s very easy.

Also, you don’t need to bother measuring ketosis in the morning. Most people show no colour then and it’s not due to a failure on your part but rather a morning glucose response of the body. I only check the pee sticks once before bed as there are other activities that can mess up the reading, exercise is one. If it’s nice and pink once a day, all is well.

So those are my recommendations for now. Again, there are still loads of tweeks that can be done, but first you need to get properly fat adapted. Also, keep in mind that fat adaptation doesn’t mean you never feel hungry, it just makes the feelings very different. You may feel a belly rumble or niggle but it shouldn’t make you feel you have no energy or like a raving lunatic who MUST HAVE FOOD NOW! However, when our bodies are used to getting food many times a day it’ll continue sending out hunger hormones (ghrelin) at those times of day to let you know it’s feeding time. If you get those at snack times, just ignore them, food is just a couple of hours away and then you can eat to satiety. THEY absolutely will stop after just a bit of time, you just need to train your body that it’s not getting food at those times anymore. Also, when you are only eating at meal times then you no longer have to worry about what you can grab to eat in between meals that will fit your macros.

I hope this helps, keep asking questions if you have more and good luck!

PS. I haven’t noticed the dream thing. But I envy you, I usually love my dreams when I remember them although I’m rarely shot in mine!

[dlc96_darren]

even when I shop at Costco and the pizza looks like limp greasy sex to me. (Think of the limp and greasy as how you feel after the sex, not during - and that metaphor works a little better!)

I’ve read this line about 20 times, and I still can’t tell if you’re describing this as a good or bad thing.

But for some reason, I have an intense urge to smoke a cigarette.

[dlc96_darren]

PS. I haven’t noticed the dream thing. But I envy you, I usually love my dreams when I remember them although I’m rarely shot in mine!

I’m sure if you were shot, they’d be easier to remember.

Great advice @Ilana_Rose! I agree, let’s get @JackieBlue sorted out, so she’ll stick with the forum. #helpJackieBlue

(God, I’ve been reading too many of @juice’s comments. )

[JackieBlue]

Ilana,
Thank you for the wonderful and thorough response. That makes a lot of sense to me! I do track all my
Macros very carefully, (all the way into the red as I pass them by, ha!) as well as build all my recipes in the app before I even let myself start eating. I will probably walk off a cliff one day as I am tracking and then all my rants about Pokemon Go and why my kids can’t play it will be but a searing hypocrisy to carve on my headstone! Please promise to make me a memorial thread here called, “She was only tracking her macros, you family of Harpies!” And don’t forget to add that I was doing it faithfully even though I had a rotten thieving app that stole extra macros from me at every meal. I’m starving away and my app is growing an ass like Jabba the Hut…

Your description of the difference in hunger cues is spot-on and helps me pinpoint a snag for me: it’s
Definitely the Invisalign! Having all this stuff in my mouth is triggering the digestion process for me right now constantly.

I was very athletic in my vigorous youth and trained myself to fast and go long periods b/t meals. I also dabbled in Keto for our epileptic son about 10 yrs ago. You reminded me of that hunger-is-my-friend-and actually-makes-me-feel-more-alive feeling I should be achieving.

The fact that I am still having that hunger-like-I-have-a -bellyful-of-air-and-need-to-fill-it-up-with-something-like-the-house-cat in the mornings more than any other time after sleeping all night with these things in my mouth is my biggest clue. Plus I have the constant urge to remove them.

I am hoping I adjust to them as my body adjusts to this WOE. I am going to try the old WW trick of drinking a liter of water b/t meals when the hunger starts sharpening its claws. Will drinking a Powerade Zero at these times be counterproductive, do you think?

[JackieBlue]

Oh, Darren, Darren, Darren.
I love your wife even more now if you really can’t tell the difference b/t good sex and bad. The woman is a saint.
Now allow me to do her a good turn:
Greasy and limp during sex = not so good
Greasy and limp after sex = good
Cigarette = No carbs = can I eat it??

[dlc96_darren]

Now allow me to do her a good turn:
Greasy and limp during sex = not so good
Greasy and limp after sex = good

Got it! Thanks for clearing that up for me. I know I can be slow sometimes. Honestly, I think my mind stopped processing after the word “sex”. Go figure.

On to my second cigarette.

[Ruina]

I’ve noticed remembering my dreams again. Not that I can think of any right now. I had been wondering if something was wrong with me because I wasn’t remembering dreams for a long time. When I was younger I had vivid, sci-fi quality, like Brazil, type dreams that I could control. I missed that. But now if I oversleep I can remember dreams from the time after my alarm tells me I should be up (so bossy!) You give me hope that I can have some weird things going on that I only figure out aren’t real because they defy the laws of physics and the known color spectrum again.