Need to gain weight

#61

If that were true, then Keto wouldn’t make it easier to lose fat, and PSMF’s wouldn’t work as well as they do. It would also mean that. Calories matter, but a calorie isn’t a calorie, either. They all have different effects on us, just as carbs can put fat on us faster if they’re abused or the wrong ones are on, fat is less likely to do that when the carbs aren’t part of the equation. You can absolutely fatten yourself up on keto, but people with working satiety signals will many times under eat because of fat being satiating for many, as is protein.

That’s why unless you’re one of the blessed ones that can actually intuitively eat and get away with it, tracking accurately is mandatory unless you don’t like having a way to troubleshoot your progress, whether it be gains or loss.

#62

To pile on to this, there is a reason even in a clinical study, doesn’t matter if it’s done in a perfectly controlled way with people locked in metabolic ward, they go out of their way to have control groups, randomize people, switch the control and intervention groups half way through and spend extra millions doing so, it’s to TRY to escape placebo effect. It’s INCREDIBLY powerful.

(Joey) #63

I remain a big fan of the placebo effect, as you note it’s incredibly powerful.

The challenge is that it’s extremely difficult to create one’s own placebo.

I’ve had some limited success by employing what I know (at some level) are mistaken belief systems… in fact, a little OCD can sometimes go a long way in creating good health habits (diet, exercise, relationships, spirituality) :wink: .

Too much OCD is la-la-land.

(KM) #64

Yes, it’s also the reason for double blind studies - difficult to do with food, but not impossible. When no one knows what’s supposed to happen, the placebo effect disappears.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #65

Well, I, for one, believe you. So my question is, if the effect of coconut oil is that unpleasant, then why aren’t you avoiding it? And what do you expect me to say, other than “avoid it!”?

I have no magic way to prevent the consequences of consuming something that has a bad effect on you. If I did, I’d apply it in my own case, and be out getting drunk, right this very minute. But as it is, if I don’t like the puking, the blackouts, the hangovers, the alienated friends, the alienated co-workers, the reprimands from my bosses, being divorced by my husband, and so forth, then I’d probably better not have that next drink, huh?

(M) #66

the other fats cause acid indigestion.
the coconut oil causes nausea but not reflux so much.
avocado is the best but more than half causes formal bloat

So it’s between nausea and acid reflux or nothing (and my weight getting worse).

Most of the time I don’t know which to pick, the acid indigestion and reflux or the nauseating coconut.

#67

Are you okay with fat from your fish? What about when you ate other meats? Other fat sources you can add more? You need to get enough fat somehow, you can’t just die of starvation, even being underweight more and more is a big problem :frowning:

(M) #68

fat from fish doesn’t hurt me. beef fat caused reflux a bit.

I eat early dinner snack and then fatty fish plus avocado and nuts omad. when I add oil it causes problems with digestion of fish. avocado and 1 - 1.5oz nuts don’t. but adding more avocado and nuts at night causes bloating and discomfort. I am wondering if putting olive oil on greens and eating a midnight salad of easy to digest greens would help rather than just straight olive oil which doesn’t feel good. coconut oil doesn’t feel good with anything, alone or on top of anything. I guess all I can do is keep trying and experimenting.

(Joey) #69

To put a finer point on it, the placebo effect very often does not disappear at all.

During many studies, both the treatment and control groups both experience improvements in their targeted conditions.

Statistical analyses are then structured to detect extent to which improvements within the treatment group were significantly better than the improvements within the the placebo control group. This is to see how much better treatments were to placebos. Sometimes, the improvements are roughly equal.

And so the key takeaway shouldn’t be lost on us … i.e., the placebo effect is real and it works.

Participating in a treatment study helps many participants feel better and even improve in other measurable physiological respects.

The mind is a terrible thing to waste.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #70

Of course, in a proper double-blind study, neither the researcher nor the subject knows if the pill or injection contains the medicine or not, and people get better from the saline injection or the sugar pill. To be judged effective, the medication must help significantly more people than the placebo.

But experiments on the placebo effect have shown that you even give people a sugar pill, tell them it’s a sugar pill and not a medication, and many of them will still get better from taking it. Fascinating!

(KM) #71

Yes, better said.

(Mike W.) #72

What are you trying to do by what sounds like drinking oil? Eating at midnight isn’t good for anybody.

#73

What is actually a typical days food and drink. Are you super skinny? What’s your weight height etc?

#74

While midnight eating isn’t necessarily a problem (and better than starving), why this late eating? I did hear it’s better for most people to eat earlier.

And yes, I would think oil with vegs are nicer than just drinking it…

I wonder if I talked about cod liver in one of your topics before, I think I did…? But don’t remember your stance on it. That’s great stuff (at least I find it super delicious) and super fatty.

You need to find some fat source, the one that bothers you least if there is no ideal one but something is needed…

How very true. I should use mine much better too, sometimes I remember this.

(M) #75

Oils mess with my digestion with dinner. I already have slow transit from adhesions. Avocado doesn’t but oils do for some reason.

A lot of people eat cookies before bed. I figure it’s like my keto cookie.

Cod liver not safe for me anymore.

#76

It doesn’t matter though when we make our decisions about our health… I have a friend who does horrible things to their body sometimes and the argument “many others do worse” always fails to persuade me that it’s fine.
But I really don’t worry about your late eating, I worry about your inability to get enough food, it’s just horrible. At lunch, I told my SO it’s so lucky he can eat… He needs a lot of energy, he would lose fat so quickly with little food and he only could afford a tiny loss…
I can’t get your situation out of my hand for long, I really hope you can find something that works…

(M) #77

Thank you shinita. I’m not trying to make health worse by eating before bed but merely trying to get more fat in without harming digestion at dinner and not having it go in my nose ears and eyes. My sphincters both upper and lower were damaged by tubes and my reflux goes up to these areas. I don’t eat the oil by itself during the morning because I can’t bend over without it going in my ears. I sleep half way sitting up in a special chair so at least at that time period any oil is staying somewhat further down. During the day I can garden and do activities without worrying about it.

(Edith) #78

I read something several years ago written by an allergist who believed that a telltale sign of an intolerance or allergy to food is how much our pulse rate increases after ingesting a certain food. What you are experiencing could definitely be some kind of reaction to eating the coconut oil. Do you react the same way if you eat coconut meat or drink coconut milk?

Also, it is possible that eating straight coconut oil is just irritating to the digestive tract in general. There is very little in nature that is pure fat. It could be that your digestive system just doesn’t like pure fat. Can you handle nuts or peanuts? If you mix the coconut oil with something else that has a little carbs and protein, maybe your stomach won’t complain so much.

#79

And fat bombs (mine always had coconut oil and peanut, sometimes coconut) are way more enjoyable than any kind of oil drinking alone!
The little nut already in @KetoPescatarian’s diet could go into it, it would be a great solution if worked.
Maybe even with other oils, it depends on someone’s taste and the type of fatbomb, I liked savory ones, it’s different than making a sweet one using olive oil, that probably would turn off most of us…