Need a direction


(Charles Hiller, Jr.) #1

So, I have been in a bit of a stall for about eight months same weight +/- 5lbs. I started strict keto May of last year at 385, and I am currently at 324. My highest was 425, and I used the Precision Nutrition system to get down to 375 over a year, I found that method was not sustainable, and that is what led me to primal and then keto.
I have done 3 to 5-day water fasting; I do IF 20/4 or 16/8, I track macros and tape measurements at 13 points. I switched to zero carbs about two months ago. The only thing that has kept me sane is that the tape measure still shows minor progress. So, I went seeking the advice of the experts and joined the Heal Care Clinic, and I am working directly with Dr. Westman. I have noticed less fluctuation in weight week to week under his program, but in the end, my body does not want to move from this weight, and it is annoying. My goal is not a weight, but a BF% (12%) and I am far from that. Using the NAVY method, I am at 33%, at 6’2”.
So I have had every test imaginable done in the last few months, started with Dr getting scared of cholesterol levels and an A/V block on the EKG. This led to a CAC test being done with a score of zero, a stress test being doing and no issues were found, and then a cardiac and pulmonary MRI with no problems. So after all of these tests the Primary Care Physician (PCP) and the Cardiologist are finally done talking statins and are not worried about the A/V block ( have known about it for 12 years and no issues). Having the heart issues sorted the PCP was finally willing to run other labs for me.
HA1C 5.2, I test blood sugars at home since diabetes runs in the family. I average 100 in the morning when I get up and 76 mid-evening. No issue with sugar.
Fasting Insulin came back last week at 12, just over the high side of normal
Ketones, I know don’t chase a color, so I check for reference just to see if they are present. Blood with Keto Mojo averages 1.1, and the urine strips show a light pink.
So this morning I tracked down a place that had the Korr system and had my RMR tested. That showed an RMR of 2491 (under all of the online calculators by about 600) and a TDEE of 3497.

My question, I know finally, do I base the calorie deficit (20 to 30%?) on the TDEE or RMR? Do I target protein requirement on LBM in kilograms or pounds? Using 0.8 as the multiplier that is 76 grams for kilograms or 168 grams for lbs. Carbohydrates will be under 10, to allow for the trace carbs in the organ meat and eggs I eat. What do you use for fat if doing meat and eggs only diet? My go-to foods are ribeyes, lamb, bacon, and sardines. Dairy is limited to Kerrygold butter, Dubliner cheese, and HWC. As per Westmen, I do not exceed a total of 4 oz of dairy for the day.


(Rob) #2

Well, you know that many people here are not big on calorie restriction but if you must try it, I would be cautious… 30% off the RMR is near starvation rations. Probably enough to damage you, but not low enough to trigger metabolic reset type functions (like a PSMF or Newcastle Diet etc.). TDEE is hard to accurately calculate but if you trust the Korr reading, I would use that as my baseline to base a deficit from. However, see next…

I plugged you into the RMR calculator at Bodybuilding.com and got 2431 so those other calculators seem very high. If you used them as a guide you may have been overeating so just going down to your TDEE (or a smidge below) may be all you need to do to start losing again? CICO isn’t a good basis for decision making but if you are getting an excess of dietary fat, it would explain why the body doesn’t feel the need to dip into body stores at your new set point weight (325), regardless of calories. You can count calories to keep score but remember, that score is not how the game is played. My advice would be to play with your macros rather than your calorie count and let the calories fall as they may.

The science is based on KG (what scientist uses lbs? :roll_eyes:) so 0.8 would a pretty low protein level for your weight. Using lbs just multiplies it by 2.2 so it becomes almost 2g/kg - a very different (though not necessarily bad) proposition. Protein levels are a real n=1 situation. Maybe start low and if you don’t do well, up the protein, though many ZC advocates would go the other way and start high unless it has a negative effect.

Well eggs are inherently 65% fat by calories so fry them and they are keto perfect (70%+). Again, your fatty meat and fish choices already have keto fat proportions. Cooking them in butter, bacon nectar etc. should easily get you there if you are ZC’ing. Cheese, is a useful top up. Whipped cream with a little cocoa powder also hits the spot for me (or dump it on sugar-free jello if you don’t mind the sweeteners). In your position, many would consider lowering their fat intake while keeping super-low carb and whatever protein level you choose. Maybe you don’t want to add any extra fat on top of your already high fat foods?

Completely left field… you could try the, also medically proven, super high carb, no fat diet for weight loss (and metabolic healing, incredibly) and go back to fun keto when you’re done. It would certainly shake the hell out of your complacent body :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:


(Charles Hiller, Jr.) #3

Thank you for the feedback, I truly appreciate it.