Megan on fasting...longer is NOT better

(Bunny) #21

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Why We Should Be Eating Wild Rice (even if grain free)

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(Doug) #22

Wild rice, the less processed the better > brown & white, for sure, Bunny. :sunglasses: If one is into fiber, looks like the mother lode, there, eh?

Dr. Fung has also said that some people do well, don’t become obese, etc., on a diet quite high in carbs - but they do not snack (they’re not ‘constant grazers’ at all), and tend to eat less frequently, often just one big meal per day with perhaps a small one at the other end of waking hours. This means much more time for insulin levels to decline after eating, and an overall lower average insulin level.

(Bunny) #23

Fung mentioned the wild rice thing in one of his interviews.

‘The reason’ you never really see obesity or diabetes in Asians?

What else is in that wild rice?[1]

Footnotes:

[1] “…Indigenous diets were very rich in the trace minerals zinc, vanadium, and chromium which were natural diabetes preventatives…” …More

(Doug) #24

Likely a good bit of it, though that is diluted wihen they start eating like westerners. :blush:

There’s also the genetic thing - skin layer of fat doesn’t get as thick as easily, even if fat is accumulating around internal organs.

(Bunny) #25

Fat populating around the internal organs is interesting and I think that could be because the adrenaline glands get too taxed (excessive cortisol?), then when you add-in the lack of dietary sources of choline and/or methionine; you get a fatty liver followed by pathological (hepatic) insulin resistants, then diabetes…

(Robert C) #26

I think this is the big tipping point (for gradual easy weight loss - autophagy more like 3 days) - some days do not eat - at all.

Technically a 36-hour fast but, really just wake up, no food, sleep (i.e. two full fasted sleep cycles).

To me, really different from OMAD or 24 hour fasts.

Big dinner Saturday to big dinner Sunday.

“Oh - I did a 24-hour fast, one day of not eating.”

Not really, big Saturday dinner sits inside digesting for a long time.

Magic happens later and big Sunday dinner is too soon.

Regular meals Friday, nothing Saturday and regular meals Sunday seems to have impact and make sense.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #27

Cahill’s “Starvation in Man” is considered definitive, and Keys’s Minnesota Starvation experiments (not fasting, but 1600-calorie diets) also contains a lot of useful data.

(Robert C) #28

Cannot make money (easily) simply telling people not to eat.

Fung’s Aetiology of Obesity Youtube series is really helpful.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #29

Wild rice grows only in certain areas of North America. I doubt that many Asians have ever seen wild rice, much less eaten it. In the U.S., it is extremely expensive, compared with white rice, so it is almost never available by itself. I personally have only ever seen it in blends with white rice.

There are a lot of fat Asians these days. Taubes points out that when the stereotype of the skinny Japanese eating a lot of rice was actually true, back in the 1960’s, their per capita consumption of sugar matched that of the United States in the 18 60’s, before the diabetes epidemic began here. Now that Japan’s sugar consumption matches ours, so does their rate of diabetes and obesity. Dr. Lustig says that they’re doing as many gastric bypasses in Tokyo these days as they do in New York. As a recent study has just demonstrated, eleven percent of the Chinese population is now diabetic.

(Bunny) #30

Say what?

I would assume you believe there is only one species of wild rice? I highly doubt it “only” grows in North America? :joy::rofl::joy::rofl::rofl: It is just more abundant or prominent in North America for that particular species…

Not only that there are many other uncommon edible plants of indigenous diets throughout different regions of the world that have the same or similar nutritional content not just wild rice and that includes zinc, vanadium and chromium etc…

Whether these nutrients go through the animal your eating or through you. The fact remains that all nutrition comes from plants including the air you breath!

BTW: I was not referring to westernized (processed foods) diets of the Asian population… I should have referenced at an earlier time period in more rural and distant places throughout the Asian regions of the world… My bad!

(Amy Latorres Rios) #31

Once you push past day 3, you have broken you sugar and caffeine addiction and, assuming your body has fat to burn, you will not feel any hunger whatsoever. This weekend, I cooked several meals for my family and we even went out. Everyone ate, I’m not gonna lie, it smelled delicious, I wanted some but I really was not hungry at all, I’m still not. Plan on going another week…

(Bob M) #32

With all due respect, that’s poppycock. I have performed many 4.5-5.5 day fasts, and have never not been hungry after day 3. True, the hunger decreases, but it never fully goes away.

(Jennibc) #33

Don’t you think that probably depends on the person? Just because you haven’t personally experienced that doesn’t mean it’s not possible that someone else might. Perhaps it would have been better for her start out her paragraph with “Once I push past day 3, and I have broken…”

I know tone is difficult to ascertain, so I mean no disrespect by post, but there are a lot of us that have had to put up with “Well, that’s poppycock that you stayed within points on Weight Watchers because you are not losing and look at all these people the program is successful for”

(Robert C) #34

Wow

Wouldn’t it be better to state your your hunger levels after day 3 than to tell someone else they are not being truthful?

I too have had big hunger changes at the end of day 2 and into day 3.

(Mark Rhodes) #35

Hey buddy. I am an admin at the other site…Jason Fung Fan Club Fasting support. When I last spoke with Megan at Ketofast 2018 she said that ADF (3X36) was what their clients had the most success with…BUT this was because of compliance. She said that OMAD fails almost everytime after 3 months. that 3 X 36 currently was what showed the best long term compliance.

I have found the best success for myself with longer term fasts. 5-6 days usually as I get bored on the weekends. My last fast ended January 10th and then I have done carnivore up till this weekend going back to keto and I found my BG went down an average 15 points after that fast and jumped back up to 90 dg/l with a couple days of keto( I mean still good but when its 74 everyday). I just don’t like eating/not eating. I’d rather EAT. Then do a stretch of not eating. Currently my 5 day fats are about every 5th week.

All that said the old Hygienist societies fasted annually for 40-60 days for health. I think they screwed up preaching vegetarian ideas, likely the cause of Herbert Shelton’s Parkinson’s.

(Doug) #36

Makes total sense to me, Mark - and I’m the same as you, would much rather fast for longer and with less cycles in a month or year.

Eating once a day - sure seems like one could verge into calorie-restriction pretty easily, there.

(Mark Rhodes) #37

Right? I mean how could you not…how often do I see people ask how to up their calories as they are only getting 1200 in.

Have you joined The Longevity Solution FB yet? Dr. James Dinicolantonio and Fung coauthored it. Dr. Dinicolantonio is very active on the page and pretty responsive to good questions.

#38

I actually set a ‘self-imposed’ limit of 5 days for Fasting, even before I started doing multiple day Fast. I have no set reasoning for this, other than I just didn’t see why I would need or want to do one longer? Plus, like some others have stated, I simply miss eating a good meal. :slight_smile: - I can’t say if this is the best way to Fast or not, but yes (for me) I agree with what you mention above. I myself do indeed lose all hunger whilst Fasting, but this is also usually right out the gate for me? I don’t get hungry when I Fast, and I have yet to stop one because of hunger. (I have for a headache, once?) But to be honest, I’ve always felt that I could have easily have gone on for longer on 4 and 5 day Fast, but just never have.)

But would love to see the science on performing longer fast, if they are indeed more beneficial… :slight_smile:

(Brandon Schultz) #39

I enjoyed a 64 hour water fast last week. I broke it because…I felt hungry and yeah, wanted to be a bit social. So yeah, for me, I still felt hunger even after fasting a few days. It wasn’t a terrible hunger but I felt a bit light headed and that was enough for me.

I Imagine the next time, I’ll make it a bit longer. Maybe 72 hours.

Before this last fast I had done a 48hr water fast.

I am content to take baby steps with the fasting rather than white-knuckle it just to make the fast as long as possible.

Fast had the desired effect, after refeeding still dropped a few lbs, and most of all feel a bit lighter.

(Heather Meyer) #40

Did she specify why OMAD seems to fail after 3 months? Is it a compliance issue?