MAY 2019 IF/EF Chat ALL WELCOME

(Herb Martin) #41

I was keto before carnivore, starting (this time) since Thanksgiving 2017, losing weight but getting stuck and with some backsliding until early July 2018.

In July I switched to permissive carnivore (anything animal) and maintained that until starting fasting in mid-Feb 2019.

In the last 75 days or so I’ve fasted about 50. (2/3).

All combined, I’ve lost 75 lbs depending on how much water I’m holding, but my fat is down more than that even appears.

As to carnivore, it’s paradoxically easier to maintain than 0-carb.

Fewer choices, no counting carbs, and less cravings with no plans to quit or stop.

Moving on and off a fast to carnivore is also trivial since you always start out carb clean.

My plan is to try “beef-only” for 30 days instead of permissive just to see.

That’s how I started: Someone got me with “I can do anything for 30 days”.

I tried it and never bothered to count the days except to report the results.

(Faith Reynolds) #42

Ive started fasting M. T. TH, F. So M,T down, ate today and back fasting until Sat Morning. I went low carb 3 years ago and lost 50# but nothing since. I’m hoping this will spur the other 35# away!

(Kelly Silverman) #43

Are you getting all your vitamins and trace minerals from the meat as well?

(Carol) #44

Hello May fasters! I’m currently at 33 hours into an undetermined fast length. I usually do a water/tea fast but am trying something new this month. Because I have weak bones (bad to the bone?) I’m going to have collagen/peptides and coconut oil with my coffee in the morning and a cup of bone broth in the evening. I am curious what difference this might make for me. Hopefully, eventually, it will be good for my skeleton. :skull: :slight_smile:

(Herb Martin) #45

Yes, that works just fine. Many carnivores do precisely that and even on nothing but beef.

I went 6 months that way out of curiosity, but also like to do “mega-vitamins” unrelated to ordinary ‘essentials’ so I’ve returned to that regimen much of the time.

There is no issue with scurvy or any other essential lack for anyone (I’ve heard of) on a strict or permissive carnivore diet.

(Jennifer) #46

I need to get my head back in the game. I’ve had a lot of home and work stresses (Nothing terrible, just feels like death by 1,000,000 paper cuts or something like that. :rofl:

When life is that way, I tend to “cheat” more… I open my fast way too soon… I don’t eat low carb… Then my stomach hates me (digestive issues and all that). I need some sort of accountability partner that I won’t yell at if/when I get called out for cheating, lol. (Hubby refuses to take on this task - HA!)

(Jody) #47

So I watched this last night. The first 30 to 40 minutes was really good. Then it got rather dramatic with the eating disorder gal going to some horrible fasting facility and then a guy with no shirt walking around and running… then the end was an infomercial.

I recommend the first 30 minutes.

(Khara) #48

Completely agree. That’s what I’ve been telling people too. The only thing about the end though is that I do think the woman’s message is important. She said she knew she should end her fast between weeks 2-3 and she pushed through anyway (albeit at the “guidance” of experts). But I think her experience is good to learn from. I hear a lot of people, even here, talking about starting a 30 day fast. I think it’s important to know that pushing too far can have ramifications. The first 30 minutes are really what pertain to most of us here but I think they did a good job of showing all sides of the topic.

Actually, after watching it once, I requested that my SO watch the movie with me in hopes that we could get more aligned with our eating. He’s not keto and I wanted to get back to intermittent fasting. Anyway, I told him, you only have to watch the first half hour! He did, and was sold. :+1::nerd_face:

(Jody) #49

YES, I thought the same, I just wish the movie makers had picked up on that!! I am also recommending to my best friend. She’s younger than me and I know she wants to prevent the mid life mess.

(John) #50

Just about to end my first longer-than-48-hour fast. 62-hour mark and to be honest could keep going. I feel fine and though utterly empty of food, not especially hungry.

But nah, no need to overdo it. I generally only do a short fast once a month, and this one covers both April and May.

Headed out to run some errands and will probably stop off someplace while I’m out, unless I just really don’t feel like eating.

(Mame) #51

Apparently spouses make horrible accountability partners for most people. [based on Gretchen Rubin’s work] This is certainly true for my wife. I am not a good accountability partner for her at all. I think the theory is that spouses are too close?
On the other hand, I do think support from spouses is amazingly helpful… it is for me.

Happy Thursday. I am very happy my headache is gone. Right now 41 hours fasted, GKI = 1.16 this morning, and next meal late afternoon 4 or 5 pm today.

good wishes to all!

(Herb Martin) #52

I am sure many of us have been there – I certainly have.

It just felt like that at the time.

The best encouragement I might offer is that getting your diet right – the way YOU envision right – and getting yourself healthy is even more fun and more powerful once you get it moving in that direction.

It’s not always easy to remember that when you aren’t in that mode yet.

Also, for keto and fasting there is a euphoric level that is fairly easy to achieve that helps with much of life’s small tribulations at least while helping to make us healthier, and perhaps slimmer and more fit.

(Jennifer) #53

The problem is that I’ve been half assing it for a while, so I’m having my “rough” time while I’m trying to get back on track. There’s going to be a lot of “hunger is not an emergency” being said internally. Right now, I’m really struggling. I’ll drink some warm salt water soon (I find the pink salt helps with hunger, and it’s almost like drinking broth. Not really, but it does hit those same spots.

(Mame) #54

Yay me! I made it through my second AD fast for the third week in row. Only Friday to go this week! No easy euphoria levels but I am mighty happy when the fast is over.

GKI = 0.68 at 5pm, broke my fast with some homemade mushroom-ham-cheese soup with zoodles and outer aisle flat bread, yum. I also tasted some Rebel butter pecan ice cream that I bought for my spouse. as I feared it tasted way too sweet for me. I just don’t like things to be sweet at a ‘normal’ level, I have been off them too many years. But then I am the weird one to whom braised cabbage and baking choc now tastes sweet! I also bought some smartcakes for the heck of it. I bet those will be too much for me as well. :slightly_smiling_face:

Still rather fun to experiment. And when I have more time I will make my own again…

I hope everyone feels like their week is going all right.

(Ashley) #55

What do you have on a fat fast? Been looking at doing this some as water fast hasn’t been easy lately for me for some reason!

(Mame) #56

mine are bacon, egg, avocado and olives but different people tweak it.

(Ashley) #57

Just curious if there’s a set amount or if just enough to get you through is fine? Im used to water fasting but haven’t done for a bit as I been stressed and that may be why it’s been harder overall

(Mame) #58

on a fat fast you usually don’t limit the amount, eat as much as you want and usually by day 2 or 3 you are stuffed and want to fast :slightly_smiling_face:

(Eric - The patient needs to be patient!) #59

So I was flying from Richmond to Cleveland today with a change of planes. I’m attending a conference and was planning on OMAD today for dinner and then just fasting till Saturday morning. That would get me another 34 to 36 hrs of fasting in this week plus a OMAD.

So I got the ticket counter to check a bag in and said “I’m heading to Cleveland via Atlanta” and gave her my name. She looked me up and acknowledged my million miler status (Delta) and said: “Mr. Palmer, you are flying to Cincinnati.”

Oh shit, I’m thinking, I’m losing my mind. So I’m like, get me to Cleveland even if I need to fly 1st class. So she makes a phone call because of my million miler status and gets me a really great rate for changing the ticket.

My heart is pounding because my developer I’m traveling with is at the gate, going to Cincinnati. I get in touch with him and get him tickets for Cleveland and then wamm, I’m hungry as a bear. Stress oh gosh. So a naked burger and a nice side salad before the flight and I’m good.

Long day because of different flight times but I’m in Cleveland and fed. Going to fast till at least Saturday AM. Conference food == bad, fasting == good.

(Herb Martin) #60

Four days of this fast completed and it does seem even easier than the last 3 (12, 14, 21) so far.

This might be partially due to starting this fast even more ketogenic (didn’t drop off completely from the last fast) even though I have been consistently doing carnivore on the off-fast days.

(Except for the olive oil in the sardines and salmon which may have caused discomfort & inflammation after the last fast.)

This is not likely to be an very long fast, 7-10 days, but I might even stop tomorrow night at 5.

My current thought is to come off 3-5 days and then back on while maintaining higher ketone levels.

My current goals are still weight loss and cleaning up issues such as insulin resistance, fatty liver, and fatty pancreas.

My fat percentage suggests my goal weight (15% body fat) is still/only 25-30 lbs away which would leave my weight 5-15 lbs higher than originally predicted. (This will mean about 100 lbs of weight loss total.)

Blood Glucose 68 (low for me), Ketones 6.9 (high for start of 5th day fasting).

GKI 0.55, DrBozRatio 10

For those new to autophagy and long extended fasting Dr. Siegfried’s table below may be interesting but should NOT be taken too seriously as we don’t know that it is (completely) accurate or valid for all people, diets, or situations:

GKI (Glucose Ketone Index*)

  • 0-1 very deep autophagy
  • 1-3 deep ketosis - therapeutic autophagy
  • 3-6 moderate keto - functional weight loss
  • 6-9 low keto - weight maintenance
  • 9-12 (or higher) - no ketosis, highly anabolic (fat or muscle depends on demand)

Calculate GKI: Glucose / Ketones / 18.016 (in typical US meter units).

That 18.016 divisor is to convert the US glucose to the same units as the ketones. Europeans etc. will need to check and adjust.

DrBozRatio just omits the divisor and simplifies to 20 point ranges with anything below 20 being deep and over 80 being unlikely there is any significant (increased) autophagy.

Note that autophagy is a normal process happening all of the time throughout our bodies so the above discussion is about stimulating significantly increased autophagy.