Loose Skin autophagy vs muscle loss


(Karim Wassef) #141

? Accidental reply ? :slight_smile:

(mole person) #142

I agree. I think it breaks down completely with the metabolic shift. I’ve been doing OMAD for the better part of two years almost every day. According to this formula I can only access 650 calories from my fat daily or suffer metabolic slowdown. Yet I need about 1300 a day just for my RMR and generally at least 1700 for maintenance. So if the formula worked I should have had a reducing metabolic rate and a loss of lean mass over the the last two years but in fact I’ve had the exact opposite.

(She Talks2angels2000 ) #143

I have personally used IF for the loose skin throughout my journey. It is slow but working! Especially around my stomach. My arms though is much slower. I was told by a doctor they wouldn’t even consider surgery until I had been at my goal weight for two years. Then I read an article that said if you continue IF approx 2 years after reaching goal weight you could lose all the loose skin. That’s what I’m working towards but like you I am just about ready to start building a little muscle now,

(Jane) #144

@x-Dena-x I replied thanks for the link months ago and then promptly forgot about it! I’m glad this thread was bumped and I read back through it. The set of brushes for face and body that was recommended in the link was less than $25 on Amazon so I just ordered them.

(Little Miss Scare-All) #145

You will NOT regret. Makes a huge diff. When I had my accident and couldnt brush my lower half for a month, my legs got dull and more rough. As soon as I started again-back to smooth n glossy lol.

(Jay Patten) #146

You plan on a 24 day fast?!

(Hyperbole- best thing in the universe!) #147

I also thank @x-Dena-x… I just dry brushed for the first time tonight, inspite of the recommendation of doing so in the morning because of the energizing effect. Well, I won’t argue energizing, but I’d add that it is relaxing as well. Anti-stress I would say encompasses both energizing and relaxing. And my skin does feel nice.

Now that my hair is closer to the very short bob rather than pixie length, I’m once again considering going native and showering at night rather than in the morning. Especially since this fancy apartment I’m in now has (can you believe this) hot water in the kitchen, not just the shower, so I can easily and comfortably deal with any bed-head situations that may arise. Since there is no way I’m taking the time to dry brush in the morning, night showers would also lend to incorporating this into the routine. It may also incentivise me to take the time in the evening when I do have the choice ranter that showering in the morning, when it is the imperative.

We shall see! Regardless, it was some nice self-care tonight.

(Little Miss Scare-All) #148

@Ruina that’s awesome! And truth be told, I shower at night on gym days, and dry brush then. I dont find it to keep me awake, but then again, nothing seems to do that lol.

(Karim Wassef) #149

I need to shower twice a day every day. First thing in the morning and after lifting.

God blessed my wife with a strong sense of smell … so maybe 3 times a day? With lots of brushing for loose skin, I should be done in no time.

(Jane) #150

I got a ship notice and they are supposed to be here on Friday - YAY! If they aren’t delayed that means I can take them with me to Chicago and brush my skin next week.

The set has a long handle brush that you can swap out the brush head on. A softer one and a firmer one. They recommend starting out with the softer one until you are used to it. Then it also comes with a smaller one for your face.

(Little Miss Scare-All) #151

@Janie that’s perfect! Definitely start out softer, but you may find that you can graduate to the harder one pretty quickly. And of course, always brush towards the heart. :heart:


I read the Fung article last week and have been on a hurt for info every since. The idea of giving yourself a lot of protein makes sense and is what I have been doing. But the idea of not giving yourself enough protein, so your body uses the protein from your skin, is also very intriguing. But even if you use Fung’s advice, the problem is he never says how to interpret that <0.6g/kg number when you are fasting. Let’s say you eat every other day. Do you eat, for example, .5g/kg on the eat days, which results in an average of .25g/kg? Or is he talking about an average of <.6g/kg, so you could for example eat .8g/kg on eat days which would be .4g/kg average per day, which is <.6. You see the problem.

Any chance someone could ask this on IDM? I tried on the non-IDM facebook group but nobody knows.

(Doug) #153

Aside from non-voluntary starvation, do we really know how much muscle can be lost?

There is a strong strain of very prevalent fear about this, that never goes away. Yet in reality, we do know that growth hormone secretion is drastically increased during fasting, as Dr. Fung makes no secret of. We know that protein is recycled.

I have no personal experience other than being a repetitive faster who doesn’t feel like he’s lost any muscle at all (and I realize that may be faulty). Some people say they have gained muscle while fasting, or at least gained lean mass. Here too - there may be measurement errors.

When it comes to autophagy, some fast-acting things have been observed, in vitro rates as high as 1.5% of cellular volume consumed within an hour, and in a Petri dish, as with cells that are just bombarded with Rapamycin - as high as 4% per hour. No shortage of protein for muscle maintenance/growth?


Muscle gain or loss isn’t my question right now. I’m comfortable that I gained muscle while fasting (and without calorie surplus, which some say is impossible). My issue is what the topic says, trying to get loose skin to shrink.

(Doug) #155

It’s a very individual thing. Some people essentially lose all their loose skin, others lose none at all. My opinion - it likely pays to push the boundaries, regardless of one’s individual case, but there still are no guarantees.


Sure, but again, the question is which is better:
#1 Eat a lot of protein so there’s a lot available for collagen to be made?
Or #2 Eat little protein so your body has to break down that protein in your skin for other areas, causing skin to shrink.
(Which one someone does may be the factor that explains whether people’s skin shrinks or not.)
And if #2 is better, how little is little?

(Jane) #157

I say zero. Water fast for multiple days. Eat extra protein when not fasting. The water fasting has worked for me, but it is s VERY SLOW process that takes months to see any results.

(Eric - The patient needs to be patient!) #158

Same for me so far. Got some loose skin again because of recent weight loss. I have faith in the process.

After an initial stall, more protein seems to have improved my weight loss. Of course there are so many factors I can’t be certain.

(Davey) #159

What do u mean with WOE?


WOE = Way Of Eating