Longo's Longevity Diet

(David Pegg) #1

Hi everyone,

I just flicked through Valter Longo’s book, The Longevity Diet. I am sure the topic appeals to us all because living well and longer is what we want to do. This doctor has dedicated his entire life to this one topic and how to apply it to humans. He has published studies with his experimental work on yeasts, mice and epidemiological studies with human populations. He has travelled all over the world to study and interview blue zone populations and can give many accounts of centenarians lives.

He is on board with our (ketogenic) views on time-restricted eating, elimination of simple carbohydrates and sugars.

But he says that there is simply no evidence that a ketogenic diet will increase lifespan. He says that it might help with glucose control etc, but there is no group of centenarians or clinical studies which show that a ketogenic diet increases lifespan. He says it is unwise to follow such a diet. Instead, he advises that the science clearly shows “vegan diet with 2-3 serves of fish” (and then calls it a pescetarian diet) is what all data points to.

Specifically, he says (contrary to our understanding):
Limit protein to a maximum of 40-50grams a day (plant based)
Exclude all animal products except fish
Avoid saturated fat
Limit eggs and dairy, especially regular cheeses

So he connects his cellular lab work to mice studies to human populations that ALL confer that low sugar, carbohydrate-based, low protein, low saturated fat will fuel the body the best for the longest.

I can’t dismiss an extremely well educated, passionate and dedicated man who has been working obsessively in this field for their entire life by saying “No he must be wrong because keto has got me off my medications and I feel better” and then not engage with this argument.

I believe he said in an interview: “the Masaii and Inuit had good health but poor longevity, so why would you follow a diet that may limit lifespan?”

I am not sure how to answer this. What are your thoughts?

#2

I have anedoctical proof that he’s right because my mom, who’s 84, is the healthiest person I know, and very clear-minded too, she looks and behaves like someone healthy 20 to 30 years younger, and you could say her diet, or better said, her lifestyle, is very similar to what you mentioned.
But, and this is a big but, she’s never had metabolic syndrome. If you have or have had metabolic syndrome, you need to lower your insulin and keep it low, first and foremost. Only when and if that is achieved you may look elsewhere. Nothing trumps the insulin factor, imo, and I am not thinking of body weight, but of overall body health.

#3

David, thanks for raising this. I’ve been wondering about Longo’s views on diet since I actually really like his fasting research. I don’t have any helpful insights but hope this will be a fruitful discussion and am following with interest.

(Nathan Toben) #4

A Furnace & A Bridge

For many people, it seems like keto is a furnace and a bridge.

A Furnace that burns off the Standard American Diet (SAD) and its correlating harms.

And then

A Bridge to greater diversity of foods. People can then reintroduce nutrients with learned awareness of their metabolic affects.

One of the surprising things I’ve noticed in this community is there is very little dogma and proselytizing. I think this is complimentary of the culture and evidence toward keto being a healthful choice. Whether it is the absolute optimal way of eating for longevity, I default to smarter folks than myself. But currently, I’m keto-ing on because it is healing many disparate mental illnesses of mine (addiction, depression, BED) and improving my capacity as an endurance athlete. Both of which result in an overall reduction in Allostatic Load (total life stress).

Keto improves my quality of life. Quantity of life is yet to be seen.

(Eric - The patient needs to be patient!) #5

Thanks for posting this.

I have metabolic syndrome and was prediabetic. Now not prdiabetic (A1c 5.9 -> 5.4) going keto lite (<50g carbs) for 3 years and now 7 weeks into full keto (<20g) and feeling so much better. I’m even close to fat adapted in the last week. Seeing some signs of major progress per fat adaptation.

I’m 64 years old and have two primary life goals about longevity:

  • I don’t want to run out of money and still be alive.
  • I want to die in my sleep and up to that day be mobile, have good to great cognitive skills and have a supportive social network.

I don’t want to live an excessively long time. I enjoy food and the social aspect of meals. I don’ t think I would enjoy vegan + fish.

I’m certain keto will help me reduce my chances of all cause mortality given my past and current health history.

I am not going to ignore the science and will read and think about it pro and con keto. I am not religious about keto. I think there are people that can do something different in terms of diet successfully. But I was carb sensitive and am certain my insulin and leptin response was, and is likely still somewhat, deranged.

KCKO

BTW - I love this forum for the balance of information and the supportive nature of the comments.

(Bunny) #6

Fascinating; going to get the book!

#7

I agree wholeheartedly. By controlling our insulin levels, we do extend our life, which will aid in longevity. Uncontrolled or barely controlled DM will certainly lead to a short life span.

@Nathan_Toben, I agree with your stated benefits of the keto WOE. And I believe that quality of life is more important than quantity of life,

@daddyoh, I’ve been vegan, vegetarian, macrobiotic, etc, and did not do well on them especially vegan. Too much denying of foods that I like to eat.

#8

I think you hit the nail on the head. Elevated blood glucose correlates with or exasterbates so many chronic conditions: diabetes, heart disease, Alzheimer’s, cancer, arthritis, PCOS, autism, MS, epilepsy, Parkinson’s, ALS…

Where present, addressing insulin resistance is a top priority on the journey towards optimal health. Unarguably, diet is the best, first (and hopefully only) intervention. There is a segment of this population (10-20%) whose bodies will not respond well to a HFLC diet. I’ve heard Dr Attia and Dr Cole talk about this on podcasts. Other doctors have shown proof that some folks respond well to a LFHC plant based diet.

Bottom line: There is no singular, best diet that suitable for everyone. So find the one that’s best for you.

(Michelle) #9

It’s interesting, and he is brilliant.
But without data on causes of mortality in the Inuit and Massai, I’m not comfortable attributing that to diet. A quick Google search tells me that in the 1950s, 60% of all deaths among Alaskan Natives were caused by injury and infectious diseases (as with most Native Americans, Westerners are to thank for that). Followed by poor maternal care and infant mortality. The results from Russian data in the 1830s are similar. I would need more information to make an informed decision. But, then again, it wouldn’t be the first time I learned that everything I thought I knew was wrong. :grinning:

#10

I’m very interested in this discussion. I have heard Longo interviewed and am now reading his book. I find it odd how, on one hand, he is so completely founded in hard science, yet he then bases dietary recommendations at least partially on epidemiological studies. He says saturated fat is bad, and that sugar is”the central source of energy” for the body. I would like to hear a conversation between him and Nina Teicholz, who, in her book, The Big Fat Surprise, noted that Native Americans often lived into their 90s (I think it was actually to 100), before white settlers arrived.
I am reading his book very carefully (and BTW, proceeds from the book and from sales of ProLon up to research) in an attempt to understand what is foundational for health, and because I want to avoid becoming fanatic about any one approach. Unfortunately, while I am learning about longevity, I am also disappointed that he apparently has some pretty big blind spots. We all have blind spots, but his are significant. I understand that he has studied long-lived groups who eat a certain way, but that’s just those groups. His offhand discounting of the Inuit and Masai, for ex, is very disappointing. I had hoped he would be more aware.

#11

Does Longo allow dairy in his way of eating?
The term pescatarian usually means vegetarian + fish, rather than vegan + fish.

As for his suggestions…
I want quality of life over length of life.
And by that, I mean I want to live well and comfortably and die withut lingering chronic misery. The length of my life is much less important than those things.

  • and living a vegan + fish diet, with periods of severe food restriction on Longo’s Fasting Mimicking Diet, would be (for me) the very definition of lingering chronic misery.

So I will pass.
And while we are at it, please pass (to me) the whole haunch of spit roast wild boar with a side of venison. In butter.

#12

To my knowledge, Longo is for a vegan lifestyle+ fish three times a week. So, no cheese.

(Maha) #13

Just adding my two cents. From what I understand, our health is about what we don’t eat, not what we do eat. Meaning, if I drink 6 cokes a day for 30+ years and I eat loads of vegetables, I’m probably still doing awful things to my body. If I don’t drink the cokes (and eat processed foods, and other junk), then I’m likely to be healthy no matter whatever else I eat as long as it’s whole foods. I’m sure there are segments of people who live long on a vegan plus fish, but my guess is there are an impressive number of people who live long while smoking or drinking, and for them, their genes likely play a big role. The fact is, we don’t really know which ‘healthy’ diet is best for longevity as a one size fits all approach. We do know that certain lifestyles are going to reduce our longevity for the average person, so we avoid those in our bid to live long and healthily. IMHO, it’s a better approach. I mean, if I live one day less because I eat non-grass fed rib eye steak, vs. going vegan, then so be it. But no one can say with certainty that I lived one day less because I ate that rib eye steak.

(karen) #14

I hope this isn’t racist, but I couldn’t help noticing that the diet Longo promotes is exactly the same as what his own grandmother would have eaten / served him. - In other words, although I really appreciate his work and do respect his opinion, I can’t help but wonder if there isn’t a slight bias towards his own roots at play here. When it comes to what foods are ok and which are suspect, I don’t see much of anything promoted that he wouldn’t have known and eaten as a child.

#15

Italians aren’t usually vegan, especially the old generations. I don’t know specifically about the granny of Longo, but you’d never convince an oldie to eat tofu or beans instead of meatballs. Especially in some regions, they do eat fish often, that’s true, but my Norwegian MIL eats as.much fish as my Italian mother. No, I wouldn’t say his indications are so terribly Italian.

#16

Also, Weston Price, American, noticed too that the healthiest people he’d studied were the ones who ate a lot of fresh fish.

(karen) #17

Does he advise tofu? I thought he was big on fish as the protein, if one was having protein. Maybe I am racist … maybe just seeing the diet as “Mediterranean” and associating it with him.

ETA: I went and read up. Only listened to him speak before, where it seemed his advice was veggies, some pasta, some fish, olive oil, olives, red wine, maybe a little bread - I think he was talking about what he personally eats, which is in keeping with his advice to “eat foods from your ancestral homeland”.

Still not loving his advice, lol. Like other people here, I’m having a hard time reconciling a positive feeling about his very-well-researched view on fasting (a Longo EF was what landed me in a ketogenic diet in the first place), and his view on diet advice, which seems based less on experimental data than personal opinion. (?)

#18

The Mediterranean diet is not how Italians eat. I don’t know if he suggests specifically tofu, but if you’re to eat fish three times a week, the other four days you’ll have to eat proteins too. And he says vegan, a part from the fishes.

(CharleyD) #19

I don’t think he’s necessarily wrong, but I think in order to exclude things that many people are sensitive to, his Longevity Diet looks pretty restrictive.

So if you have bad FTO gene SNPs you may want to avoid huge amounts of certain types of fat. Similarly to your APOe status.

If you’re sensitive to Casein A1 or A2, you’d want to just avoid dairy products unless you can guarantee no milk protein at all.

Ditto Lactose, if you don’t have the lactase persistence SNP.

Regarding meat, unless you’re familiar with its source, you’re really relying on labeling to tell you the status of grass fed/finished, hormone/antibiotic, humanely treated, etc. So depending on your level of paranoia, you’ll abstain or not. Eggs’s omega 3 levels are influenced by the hen’s diet, so if you don’t believe the cage-free label, you may abstain there too.

Fish can be used to provide the bare minimum essential amino acids and fats, after that, I dunno, you can survive, but hope you’re not an athlete. Autophagy can reclaim much.

It just seems meager to me. And if you’re restricting the starchy vegs and legumes, my impression is it’ll be rough if you’re used to ad lib keto unless you load up on salads, riced cauliflower, etc.

(karen) #20

You just made me laugh at myself, thank you. For all my handwringing about My Hero Dr. Longo failing me on diet advice … when I look at what I’m actually eating, with the exception of a little HWC I’m actually pretty much on track these days. All hail salad and cauliflower. :roll_eyes::blush: