Lectins - The Plant Paradox

#21

Yep, this is true. Peeling tomatoes and de-seeding makes them plant paradox friendly for example. Interestingly enough pressure cooking destroys the lectins also. The book is good, some very interesting ideas and information. I read it twice and have employed much of what he recommends. There are going to be times when you have some A1 dairy or feedlot beef but for the most part just understanding the concepts makes lectin avoidance quite easy. It’s a natural transition from keto anyway in my opinion as we’ve already cut out 90% of the worst offenders. Most keto folks would just need to cut out a few more things to be 100% compliant (seed oils, nightshades and other fruits, some types of nuts and seeds, and A1 dairy).

Did you know that tomatoes are from North America and were rejected by much of Europe until maybe 100-150 years ago? And that most if not all canned nightshades are peeled and de-seeded partly for this reason. I know right, mind blown haha

(KCKO, KCFO) #22

Yes, I am very familiar with the Europeans not liking, actually being afraid of, tomatoes. That was also true for potatoes in many countries. England decided to use it as a food source for the Irish, and up until the famine hit, worked out ok for them.

Italy embraced tomatoes and the New World peppers first, probably because of the trade they did with China and India and had encountered the native peppers from China. Everytime I have visited Europe, the French and Italians were peeling and deseeding the tomatoes still.

(KCKO, KCFO) #23

I have been thinking about this a lot. If pressure cooking can destroy them, wouldn’t long stewing do the same? We have lived off of the plants for a extremely long time before pressure cooking came about, seem like we not have such a big world population if pressure cooking is required. I think long cooking times should do it. Like stewing tomatoes and eggplants for a long time.

It is an interesting topic :slight_smile:

(Todd Allen) #24

There is a growing movement to stop calling it a famine but rather a holocaust or genocide. The basic idea being that at the time of the famine Ireland was producing vast amounts of food, it’s just most of the productive land was under the control of a small upper class of nobility, both Irish and English, and the food produced was exported to the much more profitable English market. I don’t claim to know the facts but it seems believable and there is a fair amount of evidence that has been gathered, much from the British National Archives, records of the companies and ships involved in the food export and the military records of the many British regiments that were deployed all across Ireland to minimize disruptions to the food export by the starving masses.

https://www.facebook.com/irishgenocide

#25

In the book he talks a lot about how various cultures reduced the lectin content in foods (husking rice, peeling and de-seeding tomatoes, fermenting grains, etc). A lot foods that are really high in lectins have only been consumed by humans for relatively short periods of time, and in very different ways from what we do now. That’s how Gundry would explain it anyway. Another good point is that just because humans did a thing for a long time we cannot assume they had optimal health. In fact we know they didn’t in many ways. Plus some of the effects of long-term exposure to certain things like lectins, BG spikes, or chemicals can take decades to manifest, when the life span was 30 or 40 years it’s entirely possible they just didn’t live long enough to get plagued by the preventable diseases we are seeing in record numbers now.

(Tubeman) #26

As I remember, he takes a real mish-mash of ideas, some of which are good, some of which are questionable, but doesn’t provide a lot of good coherent data, and tries to sell you on his system. I think this is the one where he talks about your ‘gut buddies’ which was kind of condescending. Don’t talk down to me man, show me the science!

Nonetheless, I think there’s something behind the idea that plants try to protect themselves, and that many may contain things which are bad for us. I no longer will eat any plants which cause me digestive problems, and using zero carb as a kind of elimination diet, I notice that most veg cause problems when added back.

(KCKO, KCFO) #27

But the poor Irish were supposed to subsist on potatoes, when the fungi hit the potatoes, for them it was indeed a famine. They had poor land to grow those potatoes on and now it was infected. Any decent land was indeed used to feed the English and upper class Irish. Potatoes were what kept them them from starvation in the first place, once they were gone, if you were poor it was a time of famine. I understand all to well how all that worked out over the time of British rule in Ireland.

But my original point was basically they were good enough for the workers, but not the masters.

(Todd Allen) #28

Much of what is good for us is bad for us which is a big topic in science going by the name hormesis. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hormesis
Basically small doses of stressors, things that do a little bit of damage, can trigger responses that repair more than the damage done and provide increased resilience to future stress/damage. But get an amount of combined stresses exceeding your coping capacity and you’ve got trouble. Exercise, fasting and thermal stress all seem to fit this pattern. The right amount is beneficial while too much causes trouble. And the sweet spot varies with ones state of health, quality of sleep and the amount of other chronic stresses sapping ones stress tolerance. Which probably helps explain why some believe going vegan has given them vibrant health while others find it devastating.

#29

This is an interesting idea. I think it’s true on many levels. Exercise is healthy but not because of the calories burned. It seems to be the stress that makes it beneficial. Or cold showers, same concept. All these things are pointing to the idea that modern life with all it’s conveniences is actually harming us. We don’t break a sweat, spend time outside, miss meals, get really cold, etc like we used to. And who know that was a bad thing? Heard Dr. Naiman talking about this the other day. The gist is if you live a comfy cozy life you won’t reach optimal health.

(Jason) #30

Are you still following Dr Gundry’s lectin avoidance principles? Do you use his Lectin Shield?

#31

I haven’t tried his supplements so I can’t comment on their effectiveness. I’m still compliant to the extent that I’m still low carb. I haven’t worried a lot about A1 dairy or feed lot beef but otherwise I’ve been fairly lectin free. As I’ve said before I think the big offenders (wheat, legumes, etc) which are already removed from low carb diets make the most difference. From there it appears to be more individual sensitivities.

(Dione) #32

Hi Rian,

I really appreciate if you can send me lectin information.
I started new to keto but I could not become keto adapted- I also feel bloated especially with the nightshade family…
thank you

#33

Upon hearing about this diet, it sounded like total BS to me with little research behind it. I think it is over-analyzing diet to the point of obsessive compulsive disorder and neuroticism by the author and followers. Unless it becomes mainstream and accepted, I’m going to remain skeptical. Maybe the eggplant lobbyists will prevent it for a while. :eggplant:

#34

Are you skeptical of ZC/Carnivore also? Because the mechanism could be the same and there are too many success stories to argue with there. I think if I had to boil this whole thing down to one sentence I’d say “some plants are bad for all people, all plants are bad for some people, and most people are somewhere in between.” That’s my take anyway. I felt great leaving out the lectin containing foods, but I also felt great eating almost nothing except beef. Make of that what you will.

(Brian) #35

That is interesting about the pressure cooking. I’d never heard that one before.

I suspect our homemade tomato sauce would be pretty friendly since the skins and seeds are removed before pressure canning. :slight_smile: