Keto the second time around... seems a lot harder

(Michelle) #21

I would throw out the CICO and focus on the macros. When I first started keto, I tried to keep within the “reduced calorie” range to lose weight. Big mistake. Let your hormones heal with Keto, and everything will fall into place. The calories don’t matter so much on keto diet. you will get full before you overeat.

(Patrick B.) #22

I keep seeing people say this and I have to say that I don’t agree with it from my experience. I have lost 40 lbs following what should be a 1000 calorie daily deficit, and doing keto, since October 31st. Two weeks ago I saw someone else say that CICO isn’t important and it’s about the hormones, so I watched my carb macros (20g) and my protein macros (92-100g) and stopped worrying about fat, eating to satiety*. I’ve actually held my weight for two weeks. Now perhaps I am in a plateau or as Richard likes to say, “my body is defending the weight” or perhaps it’s not.

Interestingly enough, the lowest I got a few years ago was 242 because I hit a long plateau and it beat me… I stopped doing what I was doing (CICO only) and went back to eating how I had been… Took a few years but I went back up to 295… Today I am 245.

Maybe all of this is horse shit and I just need more than two weeks at not eating at a deficit…

I know there are anecdotes of people eating much higher calories and losing weight with Keto… but that is a data point and nothing more than anecdotal evidence, which I thought “show me the science” would avoid. Have there been any studies proving CICO wrong?

*Basically going from 1600 calories a day, with the deficit being from fat, and going up to 2000 calories a day because I’m full.

(Michelle) #23

I guess for me, only 2+ months in, had to get my body used to fat burner instead of glucose burner. So, in the beginning, I was regularly over my “deficit” to lose weight by 400 calories or so. I think this is so your insulin, ghrelin, and leptin response all works harmoniously. Once you get your hormones in harmony, then your body starts to get energy (i.e., fat) from food or from fat stores.

Now, does this work for everyone? Nope. I think you have to experiment. I know that when I was trying to go low on calories and do keto, I failed. I was cold and hungry all the time and doing a disservice to my body by restricting calories. My body thought I was basically trying to starve. Not a sustainable WOE and didn’t work.

The only reason I don’t think CICO works for me, is because I tried that all my life and never got anywhere. Gained and lost the same 10+ lbs in a vicious cycle year after year. Eat less / exercise more rat race.

(Stephanie) #24

Hi Syd! Ditto here. Same scenario. I decided to start from square one with keto - again. Focusing on my sugar addiction. It gets me every time. Unlike others, keto doesn’t really make feel satiated, no matter how much fat. I’ll find something else to become addicted to. I want to always snack. Anyway, this time around, I did keto for a week and then fasted for four days. I made sure I ate keto after the fast over the weekend, and for first time, kept off the 6 pounds I lost in the four days. I’m going to fast again during the work week. Four or five days. Megan Remos was asked if this is ok to do (fast for the week, off for the weekend, and repeat) and she said yes, this is en vogue at the moment. Listen to your body. I need to get this weight off. I’m trying this. Fasting today and the rest of the week. I noticed I was able to stay away from sugar during my eating days during the weekend and made sure to eat a good amount of standard keto foods. Nothing fancy. Get back on!

(Tom) #25

Looks like pretty much all the bases have been covered, but I would add that meal timing has affected my progress, especially when I had my main meal late in the evening. You might consider moving your daily meal, even if it’s just a couple hours sooner in the evening. Hang in there!

(Jane Reed) #26

Sounds like a re-do is in order. Click on the menu symbol at the top of the page, click on FAQ, and in Richard’s opening remarks, click on the link to keto in a nutshell.

I read this from time to time myself to reinforce the basics of this way of eating and to get encouragement to be patient with the process.

Also, re-listen to the podcasts, especially those that focus on the science. There is nothing like facts to convince you to change your habits.

(What The Fast?!) #27

I’d love to hear about your keto journey! I feel the same - it’s hardness to let go of CICO but I think that may be the answer to a better metabolism (especially after reading about that in The Obesity Code).

#28

Hey Steph, well done! I’ve been in ketosis consistently since my last post and the scales haven’t really moved at all. I too don’t tend to feel as full as others seem to on keto. Fasting seems to be the way to shake things up a little bit so I’m going to join you and give fasting a shot. I’m 36 hours in at the moment and I’m hoping to make it at least 3 days. I’ll let you know how it goes!

(Stephanie) #29

Wow, Syd! Fantastic! How’s it going? How many days has it been? After the successful weekend, I decided to fast again during the work week. Started Monday and finished 4 days. I feel much better than last week, so I might go another day, but I will definitely eat again this weekend. It wasn’t easy at work. People set all kinds of edibles and goodies down the center aisle, which is in front of my desk. It’s so infuriating. Anyway, so far I’m down 9.6 pounds (3.6 this week, 8 days total fasting). I’ve got a lot to go (maybe another 20), but it would be so neat if this chunking technique worked. Let’s hear from you about your progress. Thanks for the motivation!

(7c5737390103f47baeb3) #30

Syd, I did another 5 day fast and dropped 5 pounds (11 kg) but then over Saturday and Sunday, while eating keto, put them back on again, unlike the previous weekend. What the hell? Seriously? And no, I didn’t consume 18,000 calories over the weekend (not that I believe calories in, calories out). I just don’t understand what happened in comparison to the previous weekend. This weekend I did make the 2 keto dudes old fashioned whoopie pies - even though I stayed in ketosis as measured by my blood meter, maybe the xylitol and erythritol messed me up. I just can’t keep taking all these drastic measures to have no outcome. It ain’t easy to fast all week despite what people say. And this weekend, I had almost NO energy. It felt like my legs were cement. I’ll get back to fasting this week - I mean what choice do I have now? So, let’s see. I’m only down 6.6 pounds (14.5 kg) since I started this journey on 4/17 (11.2 total, 6.6 net). I know Dr Fung says net loss is about .5 pounds per day, but to gain 4.6 lbs (10 kg) in a couple of days seems odd. How’s it going with you?

#31

Hey @ Stemo,

Thanks so much for the encouragement. I managed to make it to 60 hours. Not quite the 72 hour goal I set for myself but none-the-less I’m still flexing that fasting muscle. I feasted for 3 days afterward and now I’m 24 hours into my second fast. Fingers crossed I make it to the 3 day mark this time.

Also, no movement on the scales as yet but I’m hopeful that something will give soon enough

#32

Hey @7c5737390103f47baeb3, I just wanted to clarify and recap. So you lost 11pounds (as opposed to kg) during that second fast? Only to put it back on again? But overall you are down 14.5pounds since starting Keto in mid April?

Can I just say that is fantastic progress in only a few weeks! So well done. I’d kill for a loss like that in such a short time!

Also, Just be cautious with the sweeteners (even erythritol and xylitol) as both of them can still cause an insulin spike. You will only achieve fat loss (and weight loss) if your insulin also stays low so it’s really important that you make note of your response to these things.

I’d say give the fasting another go and avoid the sweeteners when you go back to feasting and see if more of the weight that you lost in the fast stays off. Let me know how you go :blush:

(Adam L) #33

Divide (not multiply) the pounds by 2.2 to get the kg so
5 pounds (2.3 kg)
6.6 pounds (3 kg)

I weigh 242 lbs (110 kg) & have found that a gain or loss of 4.6lbs (2.1 kg) in only one day (let alone 2 days) is not an unusual result for me, it’s basically all water retained or released depending on what & how much I’ve eaten. The fact I drink like a camel some days may not help. Especially after fasting I find that water weight can hop on very quick & then release just as quickly day one of a fast. The thing I find most interesting are the reports on this forum of people fasting then “feasting” for a few days & they don’t gain much or any weight at all - not happening in my limited experience. Keep calm & keto on, all the best.

#34

Hi, Syd! I was wondering how things turned out with this. I had went a little sideways with LCHF and IF for about 6 months and now want to really get back on track. My first experience with it went amazingly! However this time around I am hungry quite often and can’t seem to push trough. Did you ever figure out what was preventing you from losing? Are you still sticking to the routine?
I don’t work out. I don’t count calories. I do try to add butter. I don’t have sensitivities that I know of to dairy.

(Jason) #35

Found this post from awhile ago. Curious how things turned out for you guys. I’m having a similar issue. I’m having a hard time getting into Ketosis as this is my 2nd or 3rd time around over the last 5 years. I keep tweaking things here and there, but not getting much result. Just trying to get some tips. A lot of what was said in this post I’ve done except for the fasting. Not sure that is for me, so hopefully some of the other tips work!