Hi guys,
This question is for the fat adapted among you (i.e. for those of you who are not only making ketones, but able to use them).
Did the change to being fat adapted happen all at once?
Did you gradually, day-by-day have better energy and clearer thinking?
Were you fat adapted one day, back to keto flu the next… and so on for days or weeks until the good days outnumbered the bad days and eventually the bad ones disappeared?
Thanks!
Fat adaptation is a process, not an event. It simply means that your cells and organs use fatty acids and/or ketones ‘efficiently’. My opinion is that this occurs gradually over a minimum of several months as cells and organs get more efficient doing so. In the case of most metabolic disorders caused by eating SAD for many years, the process can be slowed.
Some people report subjective experiences that lead them to think they’ve become fat adapted at some specific time. I think they have simply reached some % of efficiency that triggers these experiences. Since no energy conversion/usage is 100% efficient, there is really no such thing as ‘fat adapted’ in the sense of 100% efficiency, which is what many seem to think it means.
It is important simply to realize that by refusing to eat carbs in anything more than incidental amounts you force fat adaptation and it generally gets more efficient over time. After some point it’s good enough that whether for you that means 60% efficient or 98% efficient doesn’t much matter.
Great question. My answer is that it always depends on the person…
But in general, you have the following shifts:
I use walking. I recently walked 28miles in a day, while fasting. Drying electrolytes, water, coffee…
Walking 10 miles in a day ramps up my ketone production as though I did an extra day of fasting.
Going from Keto to Carnivore gave me a 2nd phase of Keto Flu, but made a huge difference in my health. I am still 99% Carnivore!
It happens in phases, clearly. I found that if you track your MORNING Blood Ketones/Glucose levels, you can really keep an eye on where you are at. Calculate your GKI… Watch Dr. Boz on You Tube…
Read my article: The Levers of Power (What to Measure, What to Control) to avoid stalling/stalls
Good Luck!
Thanks for the reply, Michael.
I guess I should have specified that I was referring to subjective experience, not technically now effient my body is.
Personally I experienced some days when my brain was clearly working more efficiently, my body moved more quickly, and my hunger disappeared. But those days were intersperced with days where I was sluggish.
Today I was tired but functional in the morning, then felt zippy keto adapted for a few hours, then extremely exhausted. I’m surprised by this back and forth. Just wondering if this is how the transition goes for other people.
The problem using subjective experiences to ‘judge’ fat adaptation is exactly what you describe. The experiences vary a lot. Then folks get all worried about it. My advice is keep your carbs sub-20 per day to remain in ketosis as consistently as you can. Fat adaptation will take care of itself. It’s not a merit badge.
Do you think we make ketones for several weeks without using them…?
The effect was sudden in my case and mostly affected my hunger and satiation. My energy and thinking never changed except I actually get up in the morning on keto (if I have an alarm, at least), I didn’t need fat adaptation for that and it’s not enough, I need to be in ketosis.
I never had keto flu or bad days on keto. Okay, sometimes I feel less great, I am a human, after all but no big problems and not because of keto.
If my changed hunger and satiation is the sure sign of my fat adaptation, I don’t think it ever can go away. I have a hypothesis that longer term high-carb will ruin it (I started to feel my old hunger coming back when I ate too much carbs for too long) but I never will go back to high-carb. A high-carb day or two surely couldn’t take the changes away. Or some higher-carb months (still low-carb). No idea what exactly happens in my body though… I just have the signs and symptoms. The happenings inside me obviously can’t be that sudden and simple.
And my hunger and satiation continued to change, I got fat adapted years ago and I feel differently, both in ketosis and out of it. So even for me, it’s not a switch, it evolves. Maybe it’s not my fat adaptation, OMAD had a serious effect too but things definitely change as I get farther and farther from my old carby days.
No, but we waste most of them for a while. Bikman contends that ‘wasting’ ketones is actually part of the mechanism of losing fat on a ketogenic diet. Fatty acids get converted to ketones which in turn get ‘wasted’ in both urine and breath.
I know that but I wrote because of this:
Everyone is able to use them, maybe not effectively enough but it wouldn’t make sense for the ketones to be there without using them at all. It was quite odd so I believe the OP thought about ineffective use but the words above painted a different picture so I asked my somewhat rhetorical question (we so very obviously use ketones pretty soon).
Fat-loss due to ketone waste? That’s knew, is it that significant for some of you? It didn’t happen with me, I only lost 4lbs water, nothing more and I didn’t eat any more than before keto, barely at maintenance. Maybe my body was slightly more effective, genetics or because fat was always my primary energy source, ketosis is different but maybe it still matters…? Recognizable fat adaptation hasn’t happened earlier than usual.
For me, it seemed to happen all at once (after about 4.5 months in of strict keto). I definitely could tell a difference. Day-by-day, my energy would get better, however, what was different once I became fat adapted was my stamina. Not only did I have lots of energy, but I could sustain strenuous activity without being winded or needing to take a break. Much of this time was without having eaten (OMAD or 48 hour fast). Didn’t have any impact on my energy or stamina.
Unfortunately, I’m not really sure I ever experienced the clearer thinking that others speak of - and I could use it!
I have found taking 2 tablespoons of MCT Oil a day on my eating days has been helping me a lot with this =).
Thank you - I have been putting about 1-2 tsp. on our meat, after it’s plated, but I don’t know how else to use it (?).
I stand at the sink, and pour 2 tablespoons onto the spoon (one at a time) and just eat it directly right before my lunch). I do it over the sink in case I spill, but I usually don’t, just be being extra careful haha.
Hmmm, sounds kind of gnarly, but I will give it a shot. I actually don’t mind the taste of it on stuff. It has a slightly sweet flavor and seems to be thinner and cleaner than a conventional oil.
I buy the one at Costco called Nutiva Nurture Vitality Organic MCT Oil -unflavoured, -it has C8, C10 and C12 in it -they are 2 –
591ml bottles for $30 but I wait for them to go on sale and buy a couple packs at once.
Um, a shot glass is what I used!
Now I have my own bottle and I squirt some in when I need it.
How PRISTINELY clean is your diet? (any artificial sweeteners, nightshades, dairy?)
The fog is caused by inflammation IMO. When that goes way down, the fog goes away.
Are you getting headaches/migraines?
Does your Nose start running when eating some foods?
I started out on Atkins and moved to keto once I discovered it was a thing. By the time I joined here I was fat-adapted but had no idea what that meant. I just know I fit the symptoms of high energy, low hunger - just didn’t know what it was called.
Since I didn’t know about it, I wasn’t looking for it LOL so I don’t remember when it happened… but was gradual at first and then one day I discovered it was 2:00 pm and I had forgotten to eat that day. FORGET TO EAT??? How is that possible??? ME??? Who lived to eat? Ha.
Reminded me of the old Hemingway description of how his bankruptcy happened: “Slowly at first, and then all at once…”.
That was my experience of fat adaptation. In my case though I did 84hr fasts once a week all month at the beginning of keto. The first one was hard, but my body got the message immediately. It was smooth sailing by the second one.
I would say my diet is very clean - except for the nights I have champagne. Regarding what I eat, it’s just meat and very little vegetables. I have half a packet of Splenda with my one cup of coffee per day. For dinner, I will make steamed broccoli with butter or mayo/vinegar/MCT when I make cole slaw. We eat the same things very often and I still find them delicious. If I am hungry during the day, I will have a few pieces of bacon or pepperoni - maybe it’s the sulphates in those? I don’t get headaches, however, now that you say, my nose does drip on occasion and I’ve wondered why. It can come out of the blue. I just chalked it up to fighting a bug. Will have to pay more attention to that when it happens.