Is Keto a gateway drug to health or disordered eating?

(Jack Bennett) #10

I was getting into twitter again the past couple of weeks (an addictive and compulsive behavior that I should probably stop).

There was one thread where people were listing doctors and health care personalities that they deemed “quacks”. One woman insisted that Dr. Fung was a quack and that any form of fasting for health was, by definition, an eating disorder. I asked a few mild questions for clarification and got blocked. Apparently people take this stuff rather personally or seriously.

I believe that people with a history of eating disorders should probably tread lightly and check with their doctors before starting fasting. It makes sense that it might trigger old behavior. But I don’t see it as unhealthy for people who don’t have this background.

Of course, the “Intuitive Eating™” people seem to see any form of restriction (time, type, or quantity) as undesirable manifestation of “diet culture”. To them, intermittent fasting is an eating disorder, keto is overly restrictive, and wanting to change your diet for health or weight loss reasons is toxic behavior. I find it rather extreme.

(Troy) #11

Haha
Thanks @FrankoBear
Much appreciated👍

(Full Metal KETO AF) #12

Don’t do that Jack, Twitter is for people with short attention spans. :laughing::joy::grin::cowboy_hat_face:

(Empress of the Unexpected) #13

No, I had no health issues. Just saying I need skin tags cut off each year. Keto doesn’t cure skin tags

(Jack Bennett) #14

@David_Stilley you’re absolutely right.

If this forum is like eating healthy, filling meat, going on Twitter feels like eating a pack of candy bars. It’s fun at the time but it leaves you jangled and craving more at the same time.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #15

I’ve seen tons of people here claim it does.

(Empress of the Unexpected) #16

Ok. So I lied.

#17

Great stuff David. I get an involuntary shiver when I see you enter through the ropes with your Mexican wrestler outfit and a bundle of sharp questions in your grasp.

Because it Is, it has those biological mimicking effects. I was always fascinated why we have plant chemical receptors in our brain and body, or at least cell receptors that are a lock and key fit to chemicals found in plants. But that is an extension on the thinking of what we’re discussing. But it does allude to drugs/ pharmacology and the hazy border between pharmacology and food where the (evil, obviously) food scientists troll around looking for the next addiction.

That could be read as antiestablishment propaganda.

Ah, a reframing move wrapped in a false dichotomy followed by…

This is intricate manoeuvring. And I’m still recovering from the food poisoning thing :wink:

I’m suggesting food is nutrients and food is pharmacology. And we’re swimming in the food is pharmacology pond. Food is therapeutic. Not eating is therapeutic. Food is addictive. Not eating is destructive. None of it should get a free pass and be let in through the gate to wreak potential metabolic mayhem.

I’m suggesting initial scrutiny then imaginative application of knowledge gained or wisdom received.

Please do not eat FrankOBear.

(Troy) #18

TAG…your it!:smile:

Slightly OT
But, yeah Dr. Berry just was talking about this

If MY freaking eye lid ST eventually falls off!
SOON hopefully

Just not a night, then, what falls in my eye😩
Gets stuck, then what …help
I can’t then see
Oh well

Enjoy

(back and doublin' down) #19

The ones in my armpits have almost all gone away, there’s one on my abdomen that hasn’t changed. But I haven’t gotten any new ones.

As to the OP, the first time I did an extended 4 day fast, I went back to work and told colleagues “now I understand how not eating gives a client with anorexia a sense of power and this could be a dangerous slippery slope for me.” The new awareness I have of food, and owning my history of binge eating means I already had habits of disordered eating. Keto is helping me reverse elements physically and emotionally that prompted that DE.

That said, I seriously doubt it would be unhealthy for me unless I was still doing long term fasting after I’d lost all my body fat, which I don’t see happening. Or if long term fasting starting causing health issues. Considering I have at least 40#s to lose, I’m safe for awhile. Given that just this past week, my PCP adjusted my meds again with the statement “I think keto is healing you” proves to me it’s just the gateway drug I need.

#21

These ones.

#22

I do like the way your clear observations and contextualisation cut through to the points @SkyStars

#24

Crikey Regina the hard held on to skin tags are at risk.

I remember Jimmy Moore getting excited (as he does) about disappearing skin tags as his metabolic health improved.

But let me dry off the rain dance a bit. When one is in, or cycles through*, Keto purgatory (that zone unmeasured where people think they are in nutritional ketosis because they are sure they are eating Keto but not actually keeping track of blood ketones), those skin tags can return. They are messengers like the crows in Game of Ketones.

I wonder in the research if a level or depth of nutritional ketosis, or circulating insulin, is the threshold for seeing these skin tag harbingers of metabolic syndrome?

*sounds like a dodgy package tour

(Paulene ) #25

That is interesting. I only started getting skin tags when I was pregnant with my first, and got more with #2 & #3. I was very healthy during pregnancy otherwise, no gestational diabietes, no pre-eclampsia. Actually, I was in mild ketosis every time the Dr. checked urine, which prob explains why I was back at my pre-pregnancy weight within a month of giving birth.
I am only 3 months on keto so am going to take photos of skin tags now for comparison photos later.

#26

wow lol
I wanna jump into the conversation in some way but I am mixed up in a way also. hmmm, not sure what to type on all this just yet :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

(Empress of the Unexpected) #27

Still curious whether having skin tags always points to insulin resistance. Or whether it can be just heredity.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #28

So a :heart: brought me back to this thread and so adding more before this topic is dead. Regina I have often thought of the nature of things blamed on heredity and it’s quite a puzzle. Some things it seems people just give in to. Because for instance,

“Mom and Dad are diabetic and I am headed there too, I guess it’s genetic.”

It seems a mystery to me. Some things are definitely passed along with genetics, appearance, male pattern baldness, variation in the ability to utilize certain nutrients because of an enzyme variation…etc. Personally I don’t believe that’s the case with metabolic syndrome issues and other man made diseases. I believe that our parents feed us the way they eat and that can have more influence over us than genetics. You aren’t destined for diabetes because of genetics but because we grow up eating the same garbage diet our parents ate to get messed up. Kind of like child abuse going from one generation to the next until we stop that cycle. We don’t blame family history of child abuse on genetics and I refuse to accept a disease is inevitable because of my parents. So yeah, teeter-tottering on the edge of KETO and not fully recovering from metabolic issues, and bouncing in and out of ketosis triggering old metabolic issues as FrankoBear suggested makes a ton of sense to me.

Interesting question with what I believe has a simple answer if you’re not too dogmatic to consider evolution. If we evolved from vegetarian lesser primate these are just leftovers from DNA of previous genetics of other animals. We have reptilian and amphibian and fish DNA that is dormant but still passed on. We have an endocannabinoid system that carries on countless functions in the body. We adapted to produce endogenous cannabinoids we need. My theory is that cannabis was an important food source for some distant ancestor species and our DNA adapted to produce those important required compounds. Maybe that’s why many find cannabis so effective for different medical conditions, because of that built in system. We have an omnivore capable metabolism, but I see plant foods as a necessary backup for survival purposes, not necessary the optimal one. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Empress of the Unexpected) #29

I love it. Thank you for the reply @David_Stilley. Having read all that, still going to derm to have them frozen off. I’ve got about 10 I’m picking at, at 27 had like 30 removed. Hopefully, continuing keto, won’t get any more.

(Empress of the Unexpected) #30

You didn’t know my mother. Meat, salad and green and yellow veg at dinner. No snacks. Once a week pasta. Yes, cereal at breakfast. I was allowed my first seven up at 15.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #31

Not what I would call a hard fast rule, we still control our destiny somewhat. Did your mother have any IR or metabolic issues? Did she have a problem with skin tags? :cowboy_hat_face: