Increase in LDL

#1

Been on keto for about a month. Checking my ketone levels with breath monitor and urine strips as well as tracking macros. Feel good and everything seems to be going as expected based on what I am reading. Just had my blood work redone and my apoB and LDL have increased quite a bit since March (124 from 96 and 194 from 133, respectively). I’ve read this is not uncommon, however I am still worried. I’m wondering if these number will remain high or do they eventually decrease? Or do people take medication to control these numbers? I’m waiting to hear what my doctor says, but I suspect she will think this is also concerning.

(Megan) #2

Hi Darbunk, many people advise to wait about 6 months before getting a blood panel done. There are a ton of postings about lipid test results. The search engine will give you enough returns to keep you busy for a long time lol. Search for triglyceride to HDL ratio posts too. Aparently this ratio is very important when it comes to how we’re doing health-wise. All the best! And welcome to the forum.

#3

Thank you. I will take a look.

(Robin) #4

For many of us, our LDL will remain high, much higher than yours now. At the same time, every other factor in your health will improve.
You may need to decide if you want to trust conventional medical “wisdom” (Drugs instead of lifestyle change) or your suddenly healthy happy body.

#5

Thank you for the reply. I appreciate your honesty.

(Alec) #6

I was debating whether to reply to this or not. I will.

My opinions only (but based on a lifetime of cholesterol research):

  1. ‘High” LDL does not cause CVD
  2. So your “high” LDL level is not a cause for any kind of concern.
  3. If any doctor tries to persuade you to take a statin, I would strongly recommend you decline.
  4. I have been told by 5 doctors through my life that I need to be on a statin, and each time I have declined.
  5. I have familial hypercholesterolemia, and I am carnivore: my LDL is 450 (or over 11 in new money). I have had high to very high LDL for all of my life (or whenever I have been tested).
  6. I had a CT scan done 12 months ago to measure whether I have any calcium or soft plaque in my arteries ie to measure the actual disease, not a long discredited proxy marker like LDL level. Result: 10, meaning I have a small degree of calcification (not that surprising at my age of 60), but this is very low, and I was essentially given a 10 year guarantee of very low risk of a CVD event. So, despite a lifetime of sky high LDL, I don’t have CVD.
  7. If you are worried about CVD for any reason, go get a CAC or a CT scan done ie measure the disease, not anything else. These things are not that expensive, and well worth it for peace of mind.
  8. When you look at the actual data, the lower your LDL and total cholesterol level, the higher your All Cause Mortality. So, taking a statin will lower your LDL level, and it will also shorten your life. The reason for this is that cholesterol (and I do mean cholesterol here) is a basic building block of many of the body’s systems, not least the immune system. Cholesterol is so important that the body makes its own, and it is excellent at making how much you need today. Don’t let anyone try to convince you that your body doesn’t know what it is doing cholesterol-wise. It knows much better than any doctor or medical authority.
  9. Did you know that there has never been a RCT (randomised controlled trial) independently run (ie not run by a pharmaceutical company) that has shown any benefit of taking a statin in preventing CVD or death. None. Zero. Zippo.
  10. The reason the current medical establishment (including all the doctors who are under strict orders to follow the rules) still tries to lower your LDL despite there being no evidence that it helps (and lots of evidence that it harms) is because there is literally trillions of dollars being made by Big Pharma selling these drugs. It is a gravy train, and the medical establishment have been captured by Big Pharma. The conflicts of interest here are just horrible.

In summary: cholesterol is vital for life, your body knows how much you need and doesn’t waste resources making too much, and any doctor telling you that they think they know better than your body on cholesterol is just wrong.

#7

Thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to answer.

(Joey) #8

So glad you did. Priceless feedback.

(Central Florida Bob ) #9

It’s worse than that. In older populations, higher LDL-C has been linked to longer life, so prescribing a statin can reduce lifespan.

The findings, which came after analyzing past studies involving more than 68,000 participants over 60 years of age, call into question the “cholesterol hypothesis,” which previously suggested people with high cholesterol are more at risk of dying and would need statin drugs to lower their cholesterol.

Gee, I wonder if prescribing statins could be considered attempted murder…

Note: yes, it’s just a correlation study and not a decades long RCT, like the vast majority of health headline studies you see. It’s just that while correlation cannot prove causation, a lack of correlation does prove a lack of causation. This study doesn’t correlate high LDL-C with a shorter life, so it proves high LDL-C cannot cause a shorter life.

(Alec) #10

Indeed. That was what I was trying to say in my point 8. I would contend that it is not just over 60 year olds… I reckon it is for everyone. But evidence against statins is deliberately and professionally buried in an awful lot of confusion.

There is a fundamental truth that people need to understand: pharma companies are NOT there to make you healthy. They are there to make money. Pure and simple. In fact, if they did make you healthy, they would be reducing their profits.

So, who’s job is it to keep us healthy? Well, obviously us, but also the authorities who are supposed to regulate and control the pharma industry to make sure they are not doing things that make us less healthy. These authorities are funded by Big Pharma. Any ideas why they are not doing such a great job??? It is astonishing that the people who have set this up (the politicians) don’t see how corrupted this is… unless they are also corrupted??? And I think we know the answer to that… go look at who provides the most funds to politicians and you will find Big Pharma near the top of the list. It’s called politics, but I call it corruption.

(Joey) #11

Essential point. Investment capital deserves to be fairly rewarded, and there’s nothing wrong with capitalism. But consumer protection also clearly has its place when the risks and benefits of a prescription are not self-evident - which they rarely are.

(Alec) #12

Consumer protection is crucial on things like pharmaceuticals. Alas, the current consumer protection on drugs is worse than on washing machines.

(KM) #13

Am I out of line to suggest there are a few things, oh, say, human life, that might be best left out of the purview of capitalism?

(Central Florida Bob ) #14

Part of that is that it’s far easier to run hundreds or thousands of cycles on a washing machine than to test pharmaceuticals. You can do things to the machine until it breaks, unlike the people.

(Alec) #15

All the more reason to be cautious with drug safety. It is hard to do rigorous testing, but rigorously test we must, and the confidence levels of safety must be high, and there must be no real, potential, or perceived conflicts of interest. First do no harm is a meaningful intent and it must be followed.

Alas, currently the medical establishment fails on all these basic requirements. It is a sh1tshow.

(Geoffrey) #16

My latest blood work showed that my total cholesterol was up to 329 and my LDL was up to 251. I’m not the least bit concerned because I know it’s nothing to worry about. I’m a carnivore so it’s only natural that my cholesterol will be higher because as a carnivore all of my energy comes from fat so it only makes sense that cholesterol will be abundant in my blood. Sure, my doctor keeps wanting to put me on a statin but the fact is, statins are worthless. They can only extend your life 3-5 days and that’s only if you’ve previously had a heart attack. Definitely not worth the side effects.
The only cholesterol markers I’m interested in is my HDL to Triglycerides ratio as that’s the true maker for CVD. Mine are great at .75 so I’m happy.

(Central Florida Bob ) #17

Every so often you see someone kinda wistfully say, “remember when pharma tried to cure things and not just treat them?” It’s a totally different philosophy. Yeah, treating infections carelessly led to antibiotic resistance but curing these rampant metabolic issues sure would be wonderful to see.

And, for what it’s worth, the average doctor could use an engineering level class in feedback and control systems. Our body is about 90 billion times more complex than a calorimeter.

The insulin-glucagon control loop is one thing, but then we find Glucagon Like Peptides that are another layer deep.

(Alec) #18

Below is a very interesting brief essay by David Sackett, one of the Fathers of evidence based medicine. It is a criticism of general preventative medicine, and specifically HRT… but I see parallels with statins, and I think his general points are relevant to taking statins.

sackett-2002.pdf (231.6 KB)

(KM) #19

Interestingly, much of the second page argument for who’s most to blame (self promoting researchers/physicians) works equally well for Ancel Keys and the last half century of “heart healthy diet”, perhaps the worst preventative “medicine” we’ve ever been subjected to as a society.

(Alec) #20

Please listen to Ivor from 23:45… what he says at that point is stunning. After listening to that bit, you might want to watch the rest. But it is an amazing commentary on Big Pharma, their statin research, and what they do to fix the results. I don’t trust anything Big Pharma does any more.