If fasting OK when starting ketogenic way of eating

(J DAKIC) #1

Hi, newby to both this forum and fasting so hoping this will make sense :slight_smile:

I started with Ketogenic way of eating 6 weeks ago for health and weightloss reasons and took me good couple of weeks to see any weightloss results (5’10) and had over 80 pounds (45kg) to lose. Once my body got into ketosis managed to lose 5.5kg over 3.5 weeks (only about half to 1kg per week in the initial 2 weeks and the rest in next 1.5 weeks) strictly following macros someone had calculated for me (128p/80f/20c) but eating all that protein was making me feel crappy so spple my Dr just in case who insisited I stop this immediately and see his Dietitian about having my diet revaluated. On her order I increased carbs to 50g (was only veggies and dairy and no grains or legumes) and fat wise was on 70 beforehand as never hit 80 as is so stayed the same but it threw me out of keto, stopped weightloss and I even gained back 1kg over 2 weeks

I sought advice from a Cardiologist this week and he is supportive of my being on Keto way of eating and I desperately want to get back into it and want to fast-track it if I can rather than wait weeks before seeing any results.
At the same time I am experiencing this weird need to make a clear break with the current way of eating in a way of a water only fast.
I cannot explain it other than it feels right and like my body is telling me it wants a break from food. I think “obsessing” is the right word as I have just spent over an hour reading posts and comments on the “fasting” threads here and I can feel my body screaming at me that this feels right.

Does this make sense to anyone ?
If you feel drawn to doing a water only fast (never done one before) should you simply do it and if I go ahead will that help or hinder my getting into ketosis quickly ?
Or should I try a fast where maybe I have some broth or something to help ease into it or not do it at all ?

I should also mention that I am currently taking slow release Metformin 500mg every 12hrs as thanks to PCOS and sluggish liver have massive insulin resistance and am pre-diabetic.

I would very much appreciate any feedback and your experiences with this seeing that everyone here has so much experience with fasting and keto.
Thank you :smile:

#2

It sounds like you may be able to water fast. Some people like to jump right in while others prefer to get back into ketosis first. Since you got into ketosis before it might be that you snap right back in this time. Just keep the electrolytes and water balanced. If you don’t feel good you can always eat something and go back to keto first, with lower protein this time.

(Jim) #3

I’m a “insulin dependent type 2” and new to this too, I’d say say do it, just keep some glucose tabs handy, they saved my butt yesterday

(J DAKIC) #4

Thank you for the advice :slight_smile:

It is good to know it is doable - I just wanted to make sure it would not slow me down :+1:

#5

Yes, do monitor your glucose levels in case you run into problems. Metformin is not supposed to cause low blood sugar like insulin, but make sure you do this safely and if a doctor is on board that’s even better.

(J DAKIC) #6

My Cardiologist is on board with me going Keto but have not discussed fasting past 16 hrs at a time - the only fasting we discussed was IF which he is supportive off but whatever I do he wants me on 12hr slow release Metformin regardless

My General Practitioner on the other hand has no clue about any off this as he was anti me going on keto way of eating (he himself is Vegan and not across Keto ant sent me to a dietitian who was as anti Keto as one can get so kind of will be on my own here as not due to see the Cardiologist again for 9 weeks). Until the Cardiologost has had the chance to send his report to my GP explaining he is supportive of my decisions cannot even talk to him about it .

I will listen to your advice and make sure I monitor the sugar levels throughout

(Anderson Herzogenrath Da Costa) #7

List carefully to your body. On the first time I tried to fast it was awful, I was really bad on day 2 so I just stopped the fast.

I tried again 2 weeks after that and fasted for 3 days without any issue and fasting 3 to 5 days are now easy (even fun!).

(Mike Glasbrener) #8

It sounds like your body is communicating with you now that your insulin levels are likely creeping down. If you aren’t hungry much on a regular basis you’ll roll into IF w/o a problem. If that goes well you should be able to ease into longer fasts w/o a problem also. It doesn’t sound like you have any dire health problems requiring a medically monitored fast so I’d ease into it. But that’s only my opinion… I started keto 3.5-4 months ago and eased into fasting this way and have now done a couple of 60hr fasts w/o any drama.

(Dany Bolduc) #9

128p/80f/20c amounts to +/- 38%p / 56%f / 6 %c.

It seems pretty high protein to me.

Fasting while not in ketosis is doable… you will probably feel more hunger as you get back into ketosis.

But if you were never fully fat-adapted, it might still be pretty hard.

Harder, but doable.

Personally I like to make it easy on myself, so I waited to be fat-adapted and spontaneously skipping +24hrs.

Remember, this is a life long change you are making. It’s not a race.

KCKO

(Kathy L) #10

I just completed my 2nd three-day fast (did a two day one too) after 2yrs. Keto. Much easier than I expected & id describe them as an exciting challenge! ( guess an exciting challenge could be described as fun!)

(Doug) #11

Hi Jel. I take 500mg Metformin every 12 hours too; diagnosed as Type 2 diabetic two months ago after being pre-diabetic for a long time. We are all different, and fasting may feel quite a bit different, person-to-person.

Fasting is great for me - no low blood sugar issues and I’ve felt good or “good enough” (to continue) throughout fasts up to 5 days in length. I don’t ease into it or off of it, just Whammo it’s on, water or black coffee and that’s it.

“Taking a break from food” - this really appeals to me too. I feel lighter, not as hot, and peaceful after 18 hours or so. Never have had an insulin test, but from what I’ve read fasting is great for lowering insulin resistance, and if the liver and kidneys are given a chance to “clean themselves out,” then that sounds great to me. Not sure to what extent, if any, that “cleaning out” actually occurs, other than that fat in the liver and pancreas will usually decline when fasting.

Spending zero money on food (I get free coffee at work) and not having to take time to eat can be very nice as well.

(J DAKIC) #12

Absolutely agree on that. That is why I am wanting to do it as everything inside me is kind of screaming / begging for a fast.
These past couple.of days I am finding that come meal time even though I am getting a bit hungry I am just feeling repulsed by the idea of eating and am delaying eating. Funnily enough within 30 to 30min hunger dissapears and I am happily going on with my day without having eaten feeling none the worse for it.
Yesterday brekkie was 1:30pm even though I normally eat 10am.

When I do it the 1st time I will just let my body guide me.

(J DAKIC) #13

Definitely not feeling hungry much and even when feeling hungry come meal time if I do not eat then and there or have a cup of coffee or a cup of hot veggie stock (been using high sodoum veggie stock powder in hot water for sodium supplementation) hunger dissapears and practically have to force myself to eat 3 to 5 hours later.

I am finding that more and more my body is simply not wanting to deal with food which is why I have been wanting to do this. Just feeling like a break from digestion would do my body a world of good and frankly after being mucked about by my Dr and the Dietitian when they made me get out of keto and made me change diets every 3 days (attacking left right and centre how I was being irresponsible having gone keto) as my body was reacting drastically had me in a tailspin psychologocally. I was so preocupied with food and diets and how to deal with my reactions as was experiencing massive food intollerance and almost feel like I need to do this to clear my head and make some sort of a mental break with the past.

I know this probably sounds weird - fasting to officially do away with the bad experience but these past few days have been finding urges to binge of crap food not because I am hungry or because I want them more out of frustration with what has been happening. I have avoided actually binging but even feeling them is driving me nuts.

While I was keto not once did I experience this and had hubby gorge on junk food while sitting next to me, mum come for a visit with the pepperoni pizza in hand then proceed to sit down next to me and eat the whole thing without me wanting to eat a single bite of it.

Yet right now have this excess of nervous energy that is constantly making me crave chocolate (which I nornally never ate anyway as do not even like it), pizza and big fat burgers in even bigger fatter buns.

At the same time I am not even really getting hungry and I am craving for a fast which is why I so much want to do it.

More and more I feel that I just need a 24hr break from food - from eating it or thinking of it. Fasting has come so naturally to me without my trying to do it that I definitely know I can do it and I just want to make sure I do it safely :+1:

(J DAKIC) #14

It absolutely was too high in protein and I felt so full and nauseated most days but I trusted this Keto coach who was saying that for my height, age and health background I had to stick with it if I was to start loosing weight.

This time arround the plan is to go lower and try for 90 to 100g tops as days when I felt comfortable with what I was eating I was arround 90g of protein total.

My main reason for wanting to gast is not so much for weightloss, insuling etc but that comemeal times I am not really wanting to eat and keep on pushing back the meal time every morning. Yesterday planned to eat 10am but did not and come 1:30pm really forced myself to eat as happily could have not eaten even then. My dinner the previous day was 7pm and all I had in between were 2 cups of coffee.

It just feels so natural to not be eating for extended periods of time and at the same time I have tjis inner need to just have a break from food so that I can get back to eating keto and get on with everything :slight_smile:

I understand that I should not push something onto my body if not ready for it so maybe should just let it happen naturally ?
What I mean by that is simply eat when really hungry and if that means I eat after 15, 16, 18 or 24hrs from the previous meal then so be it…

(J DAKIC) #15

Thank you for sharing your experience Doug. It is a relief to know that taking Metformin is not making fasting an issue as that has been one of my biggest worries as was unsure if even allowed to fast on Metformin.

When you do fast do you still continue to take Metformin as per normal or do you skip it on those days ?
That is one thing I am so unsure off and cannot really ask my doctor how to proceed as he is very big on “3 main meals plus 2 regular snacks per day” and was already basting me to bits when I told him I was only having 2 meals per day

(Siobhan) #16

If you are on medications, I would be sure to talk to your doctor about it and keep careful eye on blood glucose and how you are feeling - feel bad, stop.

But if you are not hungry at meal times… then don’t eat. Eat when you are hungry, don’t when you’re not.
I experienced that feeling of “don’t eat” when I lowered protein and I suspect my insulin was able to lower a bit more. Same after feasting on indian food. So I fasted for 55 hours the first time, and then 36 after the indian food.

I believe @richard is on metformin (slow release) and successfully fasts just fine.
Don’t want to give any medical advice… so there is that. But I think he can share his own experiences. :slight_smile:

(J DAKIC) #17

Thank you :grin:

(Richard Morris) #18

I take metformin. I went off metformin for 3 months to make sure I can keep my glucose in control without it, but I make less insulin to do it when take metformin so I went back on it. It shouldn’t affect your ability to fast. It just makes you a little more insulin sensitive.

(J DAKIC) #19

Thank you :grin:

(Doug) #20

Jel, I’m pretty lose and haphazard about it, and not saying that isn’t a bad thing. Some days I’ll take one dose with coffee in the morning. I’ve taken it on an empty stomach, too, though the directions say to take with food. Never had any stomach upset or any regrets about it. With diabetic medication, going too low on blood sugar is a concern, but I’ve never gone low, regardless of fasting or not, and of Metformin or not. When fasting, I probably average one pill a day, so half the normal dosage.