IF and 5:2 Fasting Questions

(Chantay) #1

Hi All! I’m reading through Dr. Fung’s awesome book The Obesity Code – starting two weeks ago I went to a 5:2 fasting schedule in addition to trying to keep to my 16/8 IF schedule (so, 5 days a week, I try to skip breakfast, eat late lunch and dinner, but don’t sweat calories. 2 days a week, I limit to 500 calories or less.)

I’ve LOVE the way this makes me feel! SO MUCH ENERGY! Even with intense lifting workouts or doing the occasional HIIT cardio session I just feel like I could go for forever.

I do have two questions, though.

  1. I’m not finished with The Obesity Code yet, but I’m curious if this method would help reset my metabolism?
  2. Do the 2 days of low calories hurt insulin sensitivity if I spread the food out, or would I still be better served by sticking to 16/8 eating windows?

I track calories as a side-effect of keeping an eye on carbs, but I’m trying not to care about it (had 2700 calories on Friday. It was marvelous, haha!) I also still don’t have a scale to test my weight, since I was weird and obsessive about it. I just want to know I’m doing the right things to help my body heal from being calorically abused.

Thanks ladies! (and those non-ladies who respond as well)

(Kevin) #2

I’m not sure all of what you mean by resetting your metabolism, but it sounds like you are doing very well with the changes in diet that you’ve made - so, whether really “reset” or not, you are on a good track.

For insulin sensitivity, it’s better to have fewer meals versus more. Gives the body more time in the “fasted state.”

(Doug) #3

Says that “time-restricted feeding” has benefits for most of us if we’re obese. Not enough data to say if that’s true for nomal weight people.

Humans are highly heterogeneous with regard to their genetic composition, epigenetic landscape, and the environmental factors to which they are exposed throughout life. It is therefore likely that there will be considerable variability among human subjects in the responses of their cells and organ systems (and overall health) to different eating patterns. Although there is sufficient evidence to suggest that CR and IER can improve health indicators in most or all obese human subjects, data are lacking with regard to normal weight subjects.

(Chantay) #4

@OldDoug Yeah, this is the problem I’m finding. Lots of studies on obese individuals. I’m overweight, but I’ve probably only got 15-20 pounds to drop. However, as much as I’d like to shed the pounds, my main motivation is neurological - I have MS, and I want to keep my brain healthy. Fasting is so beneficial for those with epilepsy and other neurological disorders, I figured it would be a good thing to incorporate.

@KetoGolem, I have read that long-term calorie restriction down regulates your metabolism, and I just finished the Obesity Code, but I don’t see anything about REPAIRING that. At one point, Dr. Fung says, “You can’t just start eating more or you’ll gain weight”, but then he doesn’t really say anything along the lines of, “this is where you should start if you want to upgrade your metabolism” (unless I missed it.) I thought the 5:2 fasting might be the way to go.

(Doug) #5

Chantay, I think you’re good, then, since your primary aim isn’t to fix blood numbers or metabolic conditions. I’ve never seen anything to indicate the benefits for the brain and the whole neurological system aren’t available to all. I’m sure there is debate over just how good fasting is for us, there, too.

Indeed, one of Dr. Fung’s generalized points is that fasting does not lower one’s metabolism like calorie restriction does. I’m not so sure, since some people have done very well on 800 calories per day or less. That total fasting would not lower our metabolism like calorie restriction can, makes sense to me - so I’d say the worst of all worlds is something like 1200 or 1500 calories per day. My opinion. Purely anecdotal - on quite a few days I’ve had around 500 calories, like 300 from tuna and 200 from sardines. I never felt like anything was slowing down, and weight dropped off fast, although that was probably due at least in part to it being the start of my weight loss, and having over 100 lbs. to lose.

If you’re feeling so much energy, do you think your metabolism is too low? To speed up a slowed metabolism, I’d think that eating more - at least to a little above one’s caloric usage, and possibly exercising - would be where to start.

(Chantay) #6

@OldDoug Thanks for the feedback, Doug! Energy wise, I feel great! I like the idea of 5:2 (or even something more like ADF) because it allows me to cycle days where I’m STARVING and need all the food, with days where I can coast on 400-600 calories and be fine.

I get about 20k steps a day thanks to my little under-desk peddler, and I do heavy-ass free weights four times a week. Even on fasting days, I’ve felt really good!

I was diagnosed with PCOS a long, long time ago, and at one point (over a decade ago) was pre-diabetic. I’ve lost a ton of weight since then (not keto, just not being a fat little piggy), but there’s always lingering worry that I’ve done some metabolic damage. Just want to make sure I’m taking the right steps. :smile:

I’ll probably try to keep my fasting days to one meal in the evening, just to make sure I’m doing what I can for insulin. If there are days I just can’t wait, I won’t feel bad about it!

(Retta Stephenson) #7

@Chantruese, really enjoyed reading your story, and encouraging to see such progress. Thought you’d like my favorite quote from Dr Fung’s website (paraphrased just a tiny bit):

"The secret of success is not to limit SOME of the calories all the time (deficit dieting) which lowers metabolism.
Rather, to limit ALL the calories some of the time, which is called Fasting."

(What The Fast?!) #8

This is a guess, based on the reading I’ve done…

I would spread out the 500 calories so that your body doesn’t register it as a meal and stays in fasting mode. Like Fung says, your body is either in intake or output mode (paraphrasing). I believe that keeping those calories super low on your fasting days, you keep the body in output mode.

(Chantay) #9

This is an interesting thought!

I had a BodPod appointment tonight, and my bodyfat has gone up 3% (from 30.0 to 33.4) in the last four months, a weight gain of 10 pounds (8 fat, 2 muscle). I’m going to try to do alternate day fasting, and for the first month, I’m going to eat my 600 calories on fasting days all at once, right around my lifting time.

The second month, I’ll spread the calories out. After the end, I should have good numbers to see which is more effective for me. =)

#10

How did your testing turn out?

#11

I am a 53yo woman who only had 10 pounds of excess fat to start with. I had been doing 16:8 IF for a couple years and no matter how few calories I ate, I couldn’t lose any weight. I believe my metabolism slowed due to calorie reduction for too long. Then I started longer fasts. First some 36, then 48, then a couple 86 hour fasts. I lost 5 pounds of fat in about a month or two. Now I am also actively building muscle so I am on a 3 day schedule where I fast day 1 (skip a whole day so it ends up being about a 42 hour fast), work out and eat plenty on day 2, eat plenty on day 3. (Also with plenty of protein on day 2 and 3.) Then repeat. I am continuing to get stronger and lose fat. So for me it holds true that longer fasts are better than calorie reduction every day. I also think you need to change it up or your body gets complacent, so I might skip a fast, do a longer fast, do some days of OMAD, etc. Once I ate 500 calories of avocados per day for 4 days. I don’t think there is a single anwer, so play around with it.

#12

I’ve read a lot and I would say the opposite of what Andrea said. Most believe eating the 500 calories at once is better than spread out.