How do you 'feel' fat adapted?

(Katie the Quiche Scoffing Stick Ninja ) #1

I have seen a lot of people comment on how they just KNOW that they’re fat adapted by the way that they feel.

How do you ‘feel’ fat adaption?
How soon were you fat adapted?
Did anyone become fat adapted super quickly?
Can you be fat adapted but not in ketosis and vice versa?

I’m still researching the difference about being fat adapted/ketosis.
I ended up buying ketostix and I have traces 0.05mmol in my urine.
So I am guessing I am doing something right. Im on day 5.
No symptoms of keto flu or anything as yet.

Stages of Keto diet?
New guy here (day 8)
Seem to be stuck
(Jay AM) #2

Urine strips are about as useful as a bathroom scale. They measure excess ketones. We want to be using ketones, not wasting them. If you are fat adapted, you’re also in ketosis. You can be in ketosis and not fat adapted. Keto flu is a symptom of low electrolytes (sodium, magnesium, potassium) and you can get it at any time if you are low carb, whether tomorrow or 5 years from now. For some fat adaptation doesn’t change how they feel beyond generally feeling better on keto, for others they feel on top of the world.

There are two phases to ketosis and a ketogenic lifestyle.

Nutritional ketosis is phase one. Your body begins to produce and uptake some ketones while dumping the rest. It will still search for glucose to use as fuel. In this phase it’s not an efficient process. It has to work actively to get rid of stored glycogen, clean up excess blood sugar, and turn on the ability to use ketones.

Fat adaptation is phase two. Your body is efficiently producing ketones from intake and stored body fat and is also using them efficiently for energy. It takes around 6-8 weeks of strict keto to achieve for many but not all. For some it takes longer and rarely it happens sooner (mostly in people coming from low carb high fat to keto or who have little metabolism derangement. It’s rare.)

(Mike W.) #3

When you wake up and you’re not hungry. Now I can go til 3-4 in the afternoon or longer without even thinking about eating. I eat mostly out of habit.

(Katie the Quiche Scoffing Stick Ninja ) #4

Thank you :slight_smile:

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #5

I know it sounds mysterious, but you can tell when the shift occurs. The change in energy level is very marked for example.

I don’t have the zip most people talk about, but that’s because I have some unknown kind of fatigue syndrome. It used to be all I could do to get up and go to work, some mornings, and if I vacuumed the apartment, say, I’d spend the next day in bed recovering (well, maybe it wasn’t quite that bad, but it gives you an idea). These days it’s amazing: I mowed the lawn yesterday, nearly prostrating myself from the heat, and got up this morning with no problem. Haven’t even had a nap, and now it’s time to go to bed. The past twelve months have been very intense; I don’t think I could have survived if I hadn’t been keto.

(Robert C) #6

I like this write-up about the two phases but I have one more thing to add to the mix. In my experience, after doing the keto phase, I am somehow “different” - partially what I think of as “fat adapted”. The nuance here is that fat adaptation has some permanence. If (after becoming truly fat adapted over a 2 month period on keto) I take a weekend trip that involves pizza, beer and ice cream - I don’t have to do 6 weeks of keto dieting (with keto flu) to get back into ketosis. Basically, I am back into ketosis in 3 or 4 days (less if I throw in some fasting). I think fat adapted sort of means it is easy to switch fuel sources between glucose (always preferred) and keystones. If you work at it, I am sure it will just take a few weeks of constant non-keto eating to lose your fat adaptation and make it difficult to switch fuels (so, that should be your plan if you enjoy excess body fat and keto flu).

#7

Someone posted this link in a discussion before: http://www.tuitnutrition.com/2016/02/dont-be-a-ketard3.html

(Katie the Quiche Scoffing Stick Ninja ) #8

Thanks for the link, I shall take a look :slight_smile:

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #9

Not to nit-pick (much), but that word “preferred” sticks in my craw. I think “given priority” might be a little better. I keep thinking of Dr. Phinney’s comment that a high glucose level in the bloodstream is a metabolic emergency that needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible. To me, that makes “preferred” not quite the right word.

(Chris W) #10

I would say that I had no magic spider sense for fat adaption, the biggest change I noticed was while working out and or working in general. I did not need to stop, because of hunger at work, and my bike riding suffered(as does most cardio) then all of the sudden after really cutting back on the biking I could ride almost an unlimited amount after ignoring the limit I imposed. I felt no change in my weight training end, and the only other thing I noticed is that going up stairs did not kill me like it did when I was keto adapting.
I considered fat adaption started at 8 weeks, I considered myself fully fat adapted at around 25 weeks. Its not a light switch moment and it gets progressively better, things I did in the interim was to up my fat load that seemed make things go better.
I have seen people on these forums who were low carbish and super athletic in as little as 2-3 weeks, but that would be an outlier not a norm. Age, metabolic health, intake, strength of ketosis, level of carb intake, quality of diet, sleep, stress and sunlight all play into this.

You can be fat adapted and not be in ketosis, this is not a super big deal(If you over eat protien for instance). However if you have a high enough insluin spike fat adaption will not work much like ketosis shuts down, so you could suffer some. I would liken it to drinking alcohol. The recovery is much quicker, as little as hours for me now instead of days. I have not seen any studies or even research about it but from my understanding the process of fat adaption is more cellular health thing, because we eat so many carbs for so long the process more less decays to nearly useless(think of atrophy). Another thing that happens is that ketones production will go down once fat adaption kicks into full gear. This is why the pee sticks can become useless for some people as you are not making as many, your body is directly using the fat instead of it going to the liver, unlike when you are keto adapting you are relying on your liver for 100% of your energy via ketosis and GNG. I think if anything I lost some of the clarity when I fat adapted, and the more I fasted extended the lower the ketones have gotten on a normal non fasting basis. They still raise when fasting, but not to the levels there were. I Only measure acetone.

Keto adaption phase is being in ketosis and not being fat adapted. But you can only reach being fat adapted with ketones being high enough and insulin being low enough long enough. We are born in ketosis and some think fat adapted.

(Beth) #11

But how do you know if you’re fat adapted??

#12

That makes sense, thanks for the explanation. I was wondering that myself, I’ve only been in ketosis for five days now (total newb), so wasn’t expecting to get fat adapted any time soon, but quietly hoping I would. But it’s true, I must be in the most difficult phase at the moment, don’t even have the energy to lift my legs when walking up the stairs. I’m not usually like that, so I could say I feel worse. I’m going through the keto flu and I think I have a cold, no idea anymore. I just hope it will pass.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #13

The keto “flu” is a symptom of low sodium, which we excrete more once we stop eating carbs (i.e., the kidneys return to excreting sodium at their normal, faster rate), so increase your salt intake. We need far more salt each day than U.S. guidelines recommend, about 12.5 g, so don’t fear salt, any more than you fear fat. And drink to thirst!

(Chris W) #14

Yes by day 2-3 you should up your salt intake under normal circumstances. Low salt intake will effect you a gerat deal the longer you stay with keto. I still average 1 tablespoon a day in total salt intake and about 1 teaspoon directly in my water.

#15

You’re not hungry, even after not eating for a few hours. That’s the best way to tell if you’re fat adapted, in my book.

(back and doublin' down) #16

for me (cause I can eat big meals!) it was when I could go a day or more without my stomach growling! My head might think it was time to eat because of the clock, but my body wasn’t signaling for nourishment.

(Natalie Williams) #17

My cholesterol is better than normal even though I eat a high fat diet. This is how I know I am fat adapted.

(Katie the Quiche Scoffing Stick Ninja ) #18

That is no indication of fat adaption unfortunately.
Reduction of cholesterol would be related to the keto diet.
Though that is an excellent NSV :slight_smile:

#19

When I can easily skip a meal but be brimming with so much energy that I want to run a marathon, that’s when I know, and how I feel fat adapted.

#20

I am starting on week 7. Never felt any change lately. This is probably the third time I low carb and I did not notice anything my previous times either. The big change comes day 4 when ketosis hits and appetite lowers and at that point I can skip meals etc. But I feel good.