Hello! New to this forum, looking for feedback please : )

#1

Hi, new here and excited to get some feedback and inspiration from experienced Keto folk!
I’m 52 from UK.
Started Keto back in March this year, can’t say I’ve been totally consistent, occasional slips with wine and crisps (potato in any form my absolute downfall). But these slips are rare now.
I have lost 20lbs so far and maybe another 10lbs to lose would be ideal which would take me to 10 stone. But what has been the most motivating is the good energy and elevated mood I experience now.
But last few months I’ve been experiencing muscle cramps and my muscles seem to be easily pulled. I am a gardener and cleaner so my work is pretty active and I am also menopausal. I drink electrolytes (Dr. Bergs at great expense, any other options welcomed?!) take a B complex and a trace mineral complex. Eat lots of home grown fresh veg/salad.
I drink distilled water, add sea salt and lemon juice to it sometimes. There seems to be some controversy over distilled water that it may deplete minerals in body but others say it only removes the inorganic minerals the body cannot use …anyone got any thoughts on this? I couldn’t go back to drinking tap water now I’ve seen the crud on the bottom of my distiller!
Next question…is it dangerous to eat too much fat? what is the top amount one could have? I eat approx 30g carbs, 75/80g protein and 120g fat on a good day, but my fat can be higher as I’ve got into eating butter with everything…is this not good? it really keeps the hunger at bay but I used to be a bit of a binge eater and Im worried this is what I may be doing with the butter…,I struggle to get my protein high some days…

I have more questions on fasting but will leave it there for now, sorry if post too long. Thanks if anyone feels like answering!

#2

I only adress the fat question. This is individual. Too much fat is bad, sure as overeating always is. But if it’s needed for energy or satiation and you feel okay, it’s fine to go somewhat high. Of course, it may interfere with fat-loss (it always does in my life), some tweaking may be needed there, using more satiating items, changing timing, whatever. I am doing that now. But first you just eat as you feel like on keto and see if it gives you the right results, it’s common to be true, not for us though.

How higher? I like 120g fat but sometimes it’s 160. 200. 360g was my top… Not a big problem occasionally but with my smaller energy need, 200+ isn’t the right intake for me, even 150+ all the time isn’t something I wish for…
Some people experiences higher fat isn’t good for them but it’s really very individual.
Our body may want a specific fat/protein ratio, maybe it’s our taste, maybe something else… If I needed more energy than what 30g carbs, 80g protein and 120g fat could give me, I would raise both protein and fat, personally as that works for me but if just extra butter is fine for you and you feel no problem and avoid eating way too much, I don’t see a problem with that.

Maybe it’s all the vegs and added fat, you get satiated before you got your protein…? I don’t work like that but I can imagine it happens to others. Focus more on protein rich items then. It may satiate you too easily but if your body is normal and wants its energy, you should get enough…?

Oh and good luck and sooo lucky already to get more energy, I never had that.

(Marianne) #3

IMO, this is fine, especially in light of the other liquids you may have been drinking pre-keto (pop/soda, juices, etc.). I think with your electrolytes and sea salt, water in any form is the best thing you can drink, hands-down.

Whatever you consume, eat consistently and to satiety and don’t worry about it. I love butter (I use ghee now), and put that or bacon grease on our meat, which is primarily what we eat now. When I was eating veggies, I would put them on our veggies along with salt and it was completely delicious. Don’t sweat it.

My best tip - don’t worry about the fat or protein and keep the carbs (total if you can) as low under 20 as you can go.

There is nothing that says you need to fast, and I wouldn’t recommend it at the beginning or until you are fat adapted. I did it in the beginning but stopped because I didn’t like it. It wasn’t difficult, but it made me anxious and unsettled for some reason (and it wasn’t because of hunger that I was ignoring), so I stopped. The key to success and contentment on keto, to me, anyway, is consistency and satisfaction with what you are eating. For me, food became just fuel (but was still so satisfying). I’d eat, feel restored, and move on with my day without thinking about it.

Good luck to you!

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #4

The muscle cramps suggest that you do need a bit more magnesium, but your electrolytes will stay in better balance if you are getting enough salt, which has been shown to be quite a bit more than the government thinks we need. Aim for 4-6 g/day of sodium intake, which is 10-15 g/day from both added salt and salt already present in food. If sodium is in the healthy range, then calcium, magnesium, and potassium stay much better regulated, and we don’t need to supplement quite so much.

The main problem would be only if you are drinking so much as to deplete your electrolytes. Drink to thirst, not to some arbitrary number of litres recommended by a sport drink manufacturer. I drink Seltzer water, which is merely carbonated water, and I experience no ill effects.

No. The key to a well-formulated ketogenic diet is to reduce insulin by reducing our carbohydrate intake. Carbohydrate is nothing more than glucose molecules bonded in various ways, so it has a direct effect on our serum glucose level, thus requiring an insulin response. Fat, in contrast, has no insulin response, beyond the bare minimum required to sustain life, so it is a safe source of energy. It is also much more calorie-dense than carbohydrate, so it takes less than half the amount of fat (in grams) to replace the calories of a given amount of carbohydrate (in grams). This is why we advise keeping carbohydrate low, getting a reasonable amount of protein, and adding fat to satiety.

Elevated insulin interferes with the appetite hormones (among its many effects), keeping us more or less permanently hungry when we eat too much carbohydrate. Lowering the carbs allows insulin to drop enough for our appetite hormones to eventually start working correctly in most people. Without elevated insulin to keep us in fat-storage mode all the time, we don’t need to worry nearly as much about the number of calories we are taking in, as the body is perfectly capable of ramping up the metabolism to cope with the increased intake (and also of lowering the metabolism to cope with famine-level intake, which is why weight loss on conventional diets is so problematic).

So you aren’t likely to want fat past a certain point. If you stop eating when you stop being hungry, then you should be fine. If you, like many of us, have emotional connexions with eating that make you overeat, there are strategies to deal with that. However, with the constant hunger from elevated insulin out of the picture, dealing with emotional eating becomes a great deal easier.

#5

I think this is a fear that pretty much everyone has when they move from a ‘standard’ way of eating to keto : ) It’s rammed down our throats constantly to beware the dreaded fat! Meh. We have to let it go ; )

There is of course such a thing as too much in that it’s possible to take in so much fat on a daily basis that we simply store this rather than ‘eating’ our reserves, but I think this is probably quite hard to achieve for the average person, at least.

#6

Fat is very easy to overeat for me, no matter my actual woe but it’s probably way easier with certain items. One shouldn’t worry about fat first but if it’s get overeaten all the time, it’s good to figure out what causes this problem. Fat doesn’t satiate all of us or maybe it’s just for certain fats in certain items. We need fat, sure as we need the right amount of energy intake but eating much extra fat doesn’t necessarily bring any extra satiation, I already learned that. Especially without enough protein and it’s individual what is “enough” for someone. Calculations may not give us the right number.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #8

Caloric surplus is not so much of a concern when we are in fat-burning mode (i.e., low serum insulin). Dr. Phinney has data to show that fatty-acid metabolism increases on a low-carb, high-fat ketogenic diet, enough to metabolise both dietary and excess stored fat. Of course, there are limits here, but fat is generally satiating enough for most people that getting too much fat would be a real challenge. That is another reason that the advice is to “eat fat to satiety” (i.e., satisfy your hunger and stop eating), not “cram as much fat down your gullet as possible.”

Also, if you were to swap carbohydrate for fat on a calorie-per-calorie basis, it takes only 133 g of fat to yield the same number of calories as 300 g of carbohydrate. So we need less than half the amount of fat to obtain the same amount of energy.

#9

Party pooper ; )

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #10

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

#11

Happy anniversary, btw!

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #12

Thanks. Hard to believe it’s been five years since I joined the forums!

#13

Many thanks Shinita for your input, yes tweaking required I think, although I am losing weight still so maybe Im not eating as much fat as I think…probably have gone up to 200g on occasion but not regularly. Yes more protein. And good luck to you too! ; )

#14

Many thanks gingersmommy,

#15

@gaz still wrote the truth. It MAY cause overeating. It doesn’t do to most people, apparently (not without eating fat because “it’s keto and I need to eat tons of fat”) but some of us easily and massively overeate fat if we aren’t careful with it. I always found fat not really satiating. Hard to tell as I always eat much fat and it surely helps with satiation as it gives me energy but if I add 100g or ever 200g extra fat, my satiation doesn’t necessarily change. Fat is great at boosting my calories while feeling just nicely satiated. I thought the type of fat matters and only added fat (including cream) is non-satiating but I have this with fatty meat too, it triggers massive overeating if I am not careful (and have more than one meal. I usually have).

I am sure most people don’t have it as bad as me (I try to minimize my fat intake since 11-12 years, I try to focus on the leanest meats I like, more egg whites thank yolk if possible, I try to avoid added fat and cream etc. and I STILL eat too much fat on most days, even on carnivore. I am not very controlled, that’s true…) but getting too much fat on keto is surely not uncommon. Some of us should be more careful than others.
Maybe it’s a tiny minority but it exists and one shouldn’t think fat never can be a problem. Maybe not for them if they experienced that.

#16

Re the fasting…I sort of naturally started doing it as my appetite reduced, I was only doing 16-18 hours by just not eating breakfast, although I was having a coffee with a bit of butter in to see me through the mornings work so I suppose i wasn’t fasting at all with that in me! I was interested about the health benefits of autophagy etc but it seems that only happens on much longer fasts from what I can gather. I also tend to get a headache when I broke me fast so not sure what thats about.

(Allie) #17

I can easily overeat fat as it is not at all satiating for me, can also easily overeat protein too and have tracked days where I’ve eaten over 400g, but these days don’t happen often and I don’t think it’s something I could ever do every day. I also have extremely rare days of being satisfied on one small meal with limited protein so my body does seem to regulate itself, but I still prefer to give myself limits using IF rather than counting calories because the mental effects of calorie counting seem to instantly make me feel deprived which makes me want more food. It’s easy for me to resist, but the stress it causes cannot be a good thing.

#18

Thanks PaulL.
Re the salt; I use Celtic Sea salt and pink himalayan and as I cook everything from scratch mostly its just what I add to my food and water…so are you saying 4-6g (approx a teaspoon) a day is enough ?
Actually I possibly was drinking too much water as I was aiming to drink about 3-4 litres a day and could easily do so in the hot weather …but actually i am a lot less thirsty now i don’t eat carbs!

Interested in those strategies if you’d like to share any if thats appropriate on here? there is an emotional connection to eating for me but as you say greatly diminished on keto.

#19

Yes its hard to let that belief go when like you say we are still told to avoid saturated fats etc …i guess as Im still slowly losing weight I ain’t going overboard on the fat! Thanks for the comments.

#20

Haha yes his supplements are V pricey, will look elsewhere. It was DR Berg who got me started on Keto so thats been helpful with his short videos…I know he’s not a proper Dr of course and sells a lot of products but also the info he posts has been helpful.

#21

Meant to ask what is it about Keto that makes you need more electrolytes?