Food tolerance test says NO EGGS, NO DAIRY, ... struggling to stay on Keto

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(karen) #1

Hi. I’m new to Keto and after the first psychic trauma of convincing myself that eating fat was really okay (after years of weight watchers, low fat diets, etc.), I was doing okay on a diet mostly involving eggs, bacon, avocado, salmon, butter, soft cheeses and dark green veg. On it for about 2 weeks, ketones and BS all over the place, but I’ve lost a couple of pounds, was feeling okay and getting better.

At the same time, I’ve long had autoimmune and stomach issues, and had made an appointment with a functional medicine doctor. She had me tested for “food sensitivities.” Last week, she showed me the results and concluded that I should not eat any eggs, dairy or peanut butter for a year, also, no shrimp and no almonds for 3 to 6 months. She also recommended a slightly higher carb, lower fat diet with mostly white meats and was not a fan of pork. So, like, NOTHING like the diet I was following.

I admit - I’m really thrown - figuring out what to eat has become hard. And I suddenly feel a drastic sense of deprivation, which I didn’t before. I finally found a system I thought I could follow relatively happily. But now, I’m just a total mess.

I have a lot of questions.

  1. Can I actually get into ketosis on a diet that looks more like a Paleo diet but without the sweet potatoes? I guess I can ramp up the avocados, but I can’t figure out how to get significant amounts of healthy fat. I am not keen on taking spoonfuls of coconut oil (I want to just eat normally - this is meant to be a life-style change not a drastic diet), but maybe that’s what’s needed? Any ideas?

  2. Are these tests really meaningful? Am I giving up all this stuff for nothing?

  3. Is there an in-between, like maybe I eliminate this stuff for a few weeks and then reintroduce it?

  4. What is the main component to reaching ketosis? Decreased carbs or increased fat or both?

  5. Is there an “ideal” proportion of fat to carbs to protein to reach ketosis? What happens if you shift that a bit? Does it just slow things or make it impossible to reach ketosis?

Thanks so much, all. I’m hoping you can help me get my keto mojo back!

Karen

(Running from stupidity) #2

Good

I’d say if you’re feeling OK, you’re feeling OK, no matter what some functional medicine “doctor” tells you.

(karen) #3

Thanks! - But let’s say for the sake of argument I want to try to adhere to the no eggs no dairy thing - how can I reconfigure my diet to be successfully in ketosis?

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #4

You can, and the other alternative is to go carnivore/zero carb, which is a meat and water diet. It’s actually quite enjoyable, and not as restrictive as it sounds. Dr. Georgia Ede and L. Amber O’Hearn are the two most visible advocates of carnivore, and they both ended up eating that way because of food problems. They both have fascinating lectures available on YouTube. Amber’s Web site is www.empiri.ca.

Whether the doctor’s tests are meaningful, I couldn’t comment. My mother’s allergist discovered that her weird symptoms at the time were all food allergies; she gave up those foods and was fine. Whether the tests you were given are the same as the ones my mother received fifty years ago, I couldn’t say.

On these forums, the usual recommendation for an elimination diet is more like six months before reintroducing something. On the other hand, if you give up a food and nothing changes after a week or two, then the problem wasn’t that particular food.

The essential to nutritional ketosis lies in reducing carbohydrate intake to a level that lowers insulin sufficiently, since carbohydrate greatly stimulates insulin secretion (protein not so much, and fat barely at all).

There is no ideal proportion of fat to carbs, there is an absolute limit to the amount of carbohydrate you can safely eat without stimulating too much insulin secretion. Your limit is individual to you, but unless your metabolic derangement is significantly worse than most people’s, staying under 20 grams/day should do the trick. Once you are adapted to burning fat (usually takes six to eight weeks), you could experiment to see where your carbohydrate threshold actually is. Above that threshold, your insulin level will be high enough to halt the production of ketone bodies in your liver.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #5

Eat plenty of meat—beef, pork, duck, goose, lamb, goat, chicken—and cook it in fat—tallow, lard, butter, bacon grease. I’d ignore the doctor’s dislike of red meat and pork as the result of conscious or unconscious vegan bias and/or fat phobia. We evolved over a two-million-year period of eating meat, so anyone for whom meat is not a healthful food has long since been eliminated from the gene pool.

The same, however, can not be said of eating plants. Fortunately, we don’t need any carbohydrate whatsoever—the minimum daily requirement is 0 grams. Our body absolutely requires a minimum level of protein, however, and the fact that the effect of fat on insulin secretion is negligible means that fat is a “safe” source for the majority of our calories. It is best, however, to avoid vegetable oils, because they all have excessive amounts of ω-6 fatty acids, which in quantity cause systemic inflammation, which is part of what you are trying to avoid. (Avocado, coconut, and olive oil, however, are low in ω-6 fatty acids).

A well-formulated keto/carnivore diet should go a long way toward resolving your gut problems, perhaps even eliminating them completely. It will encourage the growth of good bacteria and the death of bad ones, the β-hydroxybutyrate produced by the liver will help restore tight junctions between the cells of your intestines (thus alleviating any leaky gut or irritable bowel you may have). Insulin is also cause of systemic inflammation, so people eating a well-formulated ketogenic diet find that inflammation generally resolves, and β-hydroxybutyrate reduces oxidative stress. Nutritional ketosis generally also greatly lessens autoimmune problems, though it does not always fully cure them.

Start by greatly reducing your plant consumption. Eliminate peanut butter altogether, since certain toxic molds that can grow on peanuts often survive the roasting and other processing unscathed. Since an allergy to shellfish usually results in anaphylactic shock, I’d take that one very seriously and eliminate the shrimp right away, as well.

You can wait to see if that is enough to resolve your difficulties, but people do sometimes develop allergies to eggs and dairy proteins (quite apart from whether or not they can handle lactose), so you may end up having to eliminate them as well.

I hope all of this helps. Bear in mind that I am not a doctor, and while these recommendations are based on what has helped me and others on these forums, there may be unique aspects to your case. If at any stage things either fail to improve or your symptoms worsen at all, see your doctor immediately.

(karen) #6

so very helpfu!! thank you very much. It would make me miserable to live completely without dark leafy greens, but I will work harder to keep carbs to below 20 g/day – have been averaging around 35. Will add butter back to diet, but try to stay away from eggs and other dairy for the foreseeable future. I’ve been skipping breakfast a lot, which makes losing eggs a little less painful.

(Keto Travels) #7

My Dad also has isues with eggs and dairy, and is feeling much better - if butter is hard to leave out, maybe see how you do with ghee, that works well for him as there is no (or next to no) dairy protein left, but ALL the flavour :slight_smile:

(Carl Keller) #8

Feature a fattty protein for your meals and add a cup or two of sauteed, roasted or microwaved vegetables. I regularly eat ribs, steak, chicken thighs, wings, roasted pork and beef, salmon, hamburger and pork chops. I cook my vegetables in bacon grease and sometimes coconut or olive oil. Vegetables are not necessary for ketosis but I enjoy eating them and they give my meals some variety. Seven months of eating this way and I’m still not bored with my food.

(KCKO, KCFO) #9

Which test did she use ELISA tests or MRT (Mediator Release Test). ELISA is known to be not very reliable. It is cheaper and doesn’t cover the variety that the MRT does. Dairy intolerances can come from lactose, casin, or whey. If your test doesn’t break it down, you might be good with hard cheese, but not milk. Also many can not eat cow dairy but goat and sheep dairy is fine. Also coconut yogurt is a real thing and tastes delicious btw. Eggs, some can do yolks, but not whites, so before giving up on dairy and eggs totally you might want to pin point what is the issue for you.

This blog might help you sort out if the test you took is giving you good information:
https://chriskresser.com/are-food-intolerance-tests-accurate/

All the best sorting it out.

Edited to add this thread might interest you as well:
https://www.ketogenicforums.com/t/food-intolerance-testing/31544

(Full Metal KETO AF) #10

Try this^

Ignore this part. :wink:

Keep Calm and Keto On with the non egg/dairy/nut/shrimp options. Meats, fish, fats and vegetables are plenty good keto!

:cowboy_hat_face:

#11

Absolutely. My family generally avoids dairy, eggs and peanuts. We also avoid processed meats, like bacon. We eat a ton of veggies, coconuts, avocados, olives, nuts (particularly macadamia, pecan, walnut) and seeds.

You may want to check into the Wahls Protocol, a low carb diet that emphasizes optimizing nutrition.

You may also want to investigate the Autoimmune Protocol (AIP), which takes an experiential approach to figuring out which foods your body doesn’t respond well too.

Energy deficiency triggers the physiological state of ketosis. The most efficient way to get into ketosis is to fast- not eat anything. When food intake isn’t sufficient to meet the body’s energy demands, it turns to its internal reserves to generate the glucose and fatty acids that it needs. Metabolically healthy people can dip into ketosis in between meals. Some severely deranged people may need 18-24 hours without any food before reaching even a mild state of ketosis.

This varies tremendously across individuals. The objective is to keep basal insulin levels low, which means eating within your personal carb tolerance. There are people in my family that can eat a baked potato and maintain a state of ketosis. Through trial and testing, I’ve determined that my carb tolerance is 50-75g per day. If I stay under that, I will maintain whatever my current level of ketosis is. If I eat above it, the degree of ketosis decreases (as determined by GKI).

There is no single ketogenic diet. It’s not about what you eat, it’s about how your body responds to what you eat. My mileage is not your mileage, YMWV.

(karen) #12

Thanks so much. Really helpful! Feel like once I get the diet a bit more regimented the next step is fasting.

(Kristen Ann) #13

Hi Karen,

I’m also autoimmune and was feeling much better on keto than the SAD. However, 4 months in I felt like chicken and pork were causing me inflammation so I decided to cut them both out of diet. I really struggled staying keto without those foods, and I kept falling off the keto diet. Ironic, because I am way worse off on carbs and SAD than I am with eating chicken and pork on keto. I decided to quit trying to cut out these foods and just focus on being keto for now. I think I was manipulating too may factors that I was making my life more difficult. Maybe eventually I’ll try to eliminate one or the other again in an experiment, but much much further down the line. Hope this helps.

(karen) #14

Thank very much! Definitely helpful – good to know I’m not alone, and also I think you are right and I’m going to add back in a couple of things (mostly butter because I’ve read it doesn’t have much of the dairy proteins that cause problems and also because I love it), and get consistent on keto and then work on eliminating more stuff as needed. I have to view this as a lifestyle transformation and therefore not be so extreme… thanks again!

(John) #15

I didn’t see anything in the doctor’s list that said no veggies. Basic keto is meat and veggies. Meat can be any beef, pork, fish, chicken, turkey, lamb, most shellfish and other seafood. Veggies are pretty much any leafy greens, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts, peppers, squash. Cook veggies in fat and/or serve with fatty sauces or butter. Almond milk and coconut cream can substitute for dairy in some cases.

If the only thing I had to cut out was eggs (ouch), cheese (can live without), peanuts (don’t eat anyway) and almonds (not my favorite nuts), it would barely impact how I eat. Well, the eggs would be a bit of a poser for breakfast, I’ll give you that.

(karen) #16

Thanks!!

(mole person) #17

Humans can live in a state of ketosis without energy restriction. All that is required is a lack of non fat fuels, either carbohydrate or protein beyond requirements.

There are loads of people here in ketosis who are in maintenance. They are all not in energy deficiency.

My own diet is 75%+ calories from fat. My weight is completely stable at approximately 106 pounds and I pee dark purple on urine strips daily after two years in ketosis.

#18

Ketosis only occurs when the body perceives an energy deficiency. More specifically, a lack of glucose. That does not have to occur in the presence of energy/caloric restriction, although obviously it can. There are folks who maintain a sustained ketotic state indefinitely for medical reasons unrelated to endocrine disorders. It’s been used as adjunctive therapy for cancer, epilepsy, and Alzheimer’s.

Weight loss or gain, is determined by many factors. It is possible to be in a state of ketosis and can weight. This happens to me all the time. I know because I check my weight, BG and BK levels every day. All of my immediate family try to maintain some degree of ketosis, none are trying to lose weight, and one is trying to gain weight. This is challenging, but doable by eating at a significant caloric surplus.

(karen) #19

thanks so much! All I know is that it was a test of my IgG responses to food. Will take a look at the materials. thanks again.