Fat loss on CICO?


(Siobhan) #81

Hmmmm… fair point. Then it would be a question of: does the same thing happen to people who are fat adapted? Does it only happen to carb burners because they are carb burners? For me, I stalled out when I did not eat enough (and even then it was probably 1200 calories or so), but that could have been because my insulin was too high (which I am lowering with extended fasting). I’ve also seen the “you’re not eating enough” response to people who have stalled before too - though that is anecdotal. So, then, the question is assuming your insulin is low enough could you calorie restrict (not fast, but actually calorie restrict) to lower body fat percentage. I completely misunderstood your question, lol, that is all on me.

It is an interesting one though.
I think, again, it would come down to “it depends on the person” but I am sure there are some seasoned keto veterans who could better answer it.
Sorry for misunderstanding!


(Kel Ta) #82

oh Siobhan I feel like your knowledge and info is so valuable! More info is always better I think! no apologies necessary! What is apparent is that people are trying all sorts of things to find the right mix but like you said it is still a bit of trial and error process. I would be curious for those folks if there is any negative changes in BMR? it’s obscure but not sure if anyone has had experience with that.


(Siobhan) #83

I think on keto people it would majorly depend on many factors, one of which would be basal insulin. Apparently it is common to stall around 6 months into keto, because you’ve eaten up all the fat your current basal insulin allows (combined with your fat cells being more receptive the insulin you’re making already). I think if a keto person tried to calorie restrict at that point then they would run into BMR issues, or just nothing would happen - because they can’t access more of their fat until they lower their insulin more. That’s where I was at. I think that specific situation is where I would not be surprised to see negative results.


(John) #84

I’m getting convinced, I just want to know what happens, every study I read showing that a reduction in insulin reduces fat stored there is another that shows that is not the case. Does it just pass through us? I guess the physics is too implanted, I need to see the mechanisms.


#85

Look up GLUT4 mechanisms. But, get ready for deep dive into biochemistry. I think this is what you are looking for.


(eat more) #86

i’m going to give this one a listen :slight_smile:


(Jessica) #87

It’s really good. Exactly what we talked about. And I’m convinced, the fast starts on wednesday evening :grin::grin:.


#88

Well, luckily for you, there is the perfect show to listen to just out! I haven’t listened myself yet but it looks set to be a corker and I am sure will help.

http://2ketodudes.com/show.aspx?episode=61


#89

For anyone interested, GLUT refers to “Glucose Transporters” and GLUT4 is specifically found in adipose tissue (body fat) and muscle.

Glucose transporter type 4, also known as GLUT4, is a protein encoded, in humans, by the GLUT4 gene. GLUT4 is the insulin-regulated glucose transporter found primarily in adipose tissues and striated muscle (skeletal and cardiac).

Although insulin normally gets the credit for “fat storage”, it’s actually insulin triggering GLUTs of doing the work of pushing glucose into the cells, most, but not all GLUTs require insulin, so some GLUTs can function without insulin.


(John) #90

Listened last night, curious about the response time to metabolism changes but it just sounds like ramp it up and fast, repeat.


(MooBoom) #91

@Kerry_Swarthout_O_Ke this is a great thread to read top to toe :blush: