Fat intolerance

(Jane ) #1

My son has just started keto and says he thinks he can’t tolerate that much “grease”. I know he is a bit worried about the changes his body is making- changes in bowels and those flu-ey feelings. I told him to rebrand grease as " healthy fat" and I told him to trust his body. It is changing how it uses energy and is wanting glucose but is getting ketones. But my question is: are there people who can’t tolerate 70% of the daily energy intake coming from fat?

(squirrel-kissing paper tamer) #2

Hi Jane. What is your son using for a resource? Google, certain site, doctor, book?

I think, with a little help and some more details about him, he could make adjustments that make this woe easier for him. Sometimes it’s a mental thing, eating fat. Sometimes it upsets a tummy.

Invite him to join this forum and we’d be happy to help him out.

(Carl Keller) #3

I have a sister who is grossed out by animal fats and I don’t think I can ever convince her to eat fat. When we were younger it didn’t bother me since it meant more bacon for me and her fatty parts of dinner always ended up my plate… but now I know keto could do her some good.

The good news is Vegetarian keto is a thing and apparently some people do well on it. So it’s possible for your son to get the bulk of his fats in things besides animal protein. Of course if he enjoys lean animal protein that can be a part of his diet as well…

https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/keto/vegetarian

(Karim Wassef) #4

My niece went through the same thing. She had been so carb dependent that her microbiome was essentially broken. She had pain like cramps and that made the thought of anything fatty nearly make her throw up.

It took time and integrating fiber + healthy bacteria (pre and pro biotics) to reset her system. Basically, the carb loving bugs are throwing a fit in there… they’re sending signal through the vagus nerve to the brain to stop eating fats and get some carbs.

Those bad bugs basically need to die off and a new culture of fiber and fat living bugs need to replace them. That takes about two weeks of suffering unfortunately…

Once that happens, the good guys will start sending feel good signals to the brain and things will get much better.

Also- fiber comes in two kinds - one we cannot digest and one we can. It needs to ferment in the gut (hence the need for the bugs), and gets converted into short chain fatty acids… yes! Fiber is really another source of fat.

So the combination of fiber and fat really fixes the gut. The best source I’ve found for this combo is seeds and nuts (avocados and pickled olives are great too). Chia seeds and macadamia were my go to…

Also, people who have not been eating fats for years need to kick start their fat burning engine. The body has basically “forgotten” how to do that due to low use. Fat digestion depends on bile and the gall bladder needs to get going. I used bile salts to help this going. This is important because bile is basically a detergent that emulsifies (breaks into tiny pieces) fats so the digestive system can actually grab on to it and use it (vs causing problems).

Fat metabolism (most of it) also need some amino acids like carnitine to work. That comes from red meat. An exception is MCTs that skip that step and go directly to fuel the mitochondria. That is another way to accelerate the process.

So - pre/pro biotics, fiber+fat and MCT. And always keep up with electrolytes (salts). That’s what worked for me and my niece. It will take two weeks of misery.

The answer to your question about whether some people just can’t digest fat… if the gall bladder has been removed or some other medical issue has caused a reduction in bile salts, that could happen. If it doesn’t get better, you should ask your doctor to look into it.

Again- just my experiences. Everyone is different. :slight_smile: good luck.:+1:t3:

#5

I found the fat bridge one I had to work on. Decades of brain washing didn’t vanish over night.

What helped me was realising we are not talking about swimming in butter. All I needed was one lousy tablespoon on my steamed veggies. This makes them taste great and served with some meat of any sort it makes for a pretty satisfying meal.

My kids won’t go for it. They don’t want the meat or the veggies. I think they’re addicted to carbs and sugar. They show little reluctance to eat ice cream, candy, cookies …

The other thing that helped me was sugar avoidance. After Robert Lustig’s “The Bitter Truth About Sugar” I wanted to avoid sugar. So fat didn’t seem so bad compared to sugar. I realised if you keep fat’s low then you necessarily increase carbs and or protein - both of which are not good in high quantities.

Sure some people get into MCT oil, coconut oil, butter in coffee and fair play to them - but none of that is essential.

(Sheri Knauer) #6

Some people can jump right in to eating higher fat, some may do better slowly transitioning into higher fat to allow their body and mind to adjust to it. Your son may just need to transition more slowly into it by increasing the % of fat in the diet on a weekly basis, for example. The flu feelings are most likely carb withdrawal and can be helped by ensuring he increases his electrolytes (do a search in the forum for keto-aid and you will get some recipes).

(Jane ) #7

Thank you everyone for the feedback. I think he is the kind of person who will suffer through the body changes rather than take a supplement. He says he is committed to see it through. I just hate to see him discouraged. After 2 weeks, he has stuck with it and that makes me happy. I think he is a big time carb addict and his body is screaming for glucose. You all rock! Thank you!

#8

Big difference between healthy fats and grease. If he’s saying this he’s found the group of people who literally dump grease and olive oil on everything as opposed to just getting in a good amount of healthy fats. Also, no rule saying you have to be at 70% or any other amount. Ketosis comes from the lack of carbs, not from eating a specific amount of fat. As long as he’s eating (enough) healthy fats he’ll be fine.

(Jane ) #9

I think his use of the word grease generates from years of hearing that fat is bad. I told him to rebrand it as healthy fat. There is no way he would slather olive oil on anything. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: I think it is a matter of changing his thinking. He says he’s keeping the carbs below 20 g which is the most important thing. His body will adapt, I’m sure as will his perception of the fats. Thank you for your advice.

(Karim Wassef) #10

It’s absolutely true that ketosis comes from limiting carbs. But there’s an easy way and a hard way to get into it. It you limit carbs without fat, the body goes into starvation burning muscle and protein from food instead… and really fights back. Finding a gateway to alternative energy path is important. I don’t consider MCT a supplement, it’s just another oil source. There are also foods high in bile salts. You can eat fermented foods to get pre and pro biotics - sauerkraut, kimchi…

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #11

Make sure the fat is mostly saturated and monounsaturated—in other words, avoid vegetable oils, which are very high in polyunsaturated fatty acids. The only fat that is absolutely necessary is ω-3 and ω-6, and we only need small amounts of them (and ω-6 causes inflammation, if taken in quantity).

Dr. Phinney says that when people complain to him that “all that fat” is making them ill, it invariably turns out that they are getting too much vegetable oil. Butter, tallow, lard, bacon grease, and the fruit oils (avocado, coconut, and olive) are mostly saturated and monounsaturated fats, and so shouldn’t provoke an “all that fat” reflex. Not to mention the flavor they add to food!

BTW, saturated fat improves cholesterol numbers (it especially increases HDL), and monounsaturated fat is a great source of energy.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #12

I’m staying with my best friend in Florida for 7 weeks. She told me before coming that she wanted to give keto a go. We’re about 5 weeks in now. She has been
low-fat all her life basically. It’s been a real struggle for her with obvious fats. I have found that I can hide the fats some.

She thought she was gaining weight but she weighed in after a month and is about 6 lbs down so she’s becoming more open to the WOE.

(Karim Wassef) #13

So agree! PUFAs like corn, soy and canola oil are so inflammatory. It even shows up in my glucose testing. Ghee is my go to and avocado oil for vegan cooking.

#14

I never said without fat, I said get enough, most people can get enough without going insane with it, and your body would only be in a starvation panic if it had no fat to access, which is very rarely the case. Our bodies will always burn our fat stores before metabolizing muscle. Muscle protein breakdown is a last resort, and even then if people are getting proper protein in it’s that much less likely that it’ll happen.

(Karim Wassef) #15

when they tested low calorie (“balanced diet”) vs low carb, the results showed that even if the low calorie subjects had plenty of fat, the insulin would significantly block fat access. It’s a super hormone and the body actually breaks muscle first.

High ketones and low insulin protect against this … but the body will really break muscle tissue first if insulin is high and ketones are low. We, in the keto world, don’t see it because our insulin is low and ketones high… but the low calorie low fat world is the opposite.

The “balanced” diet is destructive in so many ways.

(Jane ) #16

Wow, I can’t tell how much I appreciate all the help. I am sure he is not eating PUFAs. He sends me picture texts of foods he is looking at to buy and I have helped teach him what to look for. He sent me his “week in review” pie chart and it looked really good. He lost 10 lbs the first week (he knew it was mostly water) but hadn’t lost anything by midweek the next week he was discouraged because he has followed the diet very closely. By the end of the week he had lost 2 more so he felt like his efforts weren’t in vain. He sent me a pic of his lunch today- a nice meaty-cheesy-taco salad on a bed of lettuce. I know he misses his old way of eating. And I’m so happy he is going Keto and doing it without cheats. Thanks again, everybody!!

(Full Metal KETO AF) #17

I read through this thread quickly scanning a second time so excuse me if this is redundant:

There are many healthy sources of fats other than “grease”. Eggs, avocados, cheese, nuts, olives, salmon, sour cream and heavy whipping cream, salad with olive oil and vinegar to name some.

(Kim) #18

You were very informative, and I am hoping you can pull me off the ledge. I have been doing Keto for about 1.5 years, but the last 6 months have been very lazy. I started re-tracking my food last week, and saw I was not getting enough fat, and this week it’s my goal. But … I am spending a LOT of time in the bathroom and I don’t want to be deterred by this. I do some metamucil every night for more fiber… but I am wondering if I should start my probiotic again? I want this to work, but I don’t want my life to be in the bathroom! How long does it take for your body to adjust to the extra fat you are putting into it?
I appreciate any insight that you have for me!

#19

If it’s the additional fat that’s causing the problem, I would suggest that you might need a digestive enzyme, lipase, with a fatty meal to help your gall bladder/liver digest the additional fat until your body can get up to speed. Typically, it’s ox bile.

Alternatively (and maybe the better approach), you could back off of the fat level that’s causing the problem and restart with a more gradual approach to the increase in fats so that your body can keep up.

(Kim) #20

Thank you! I had wanted to try that the last time I went through this, but was afraid to, but I think I will give it a shot now. I appreciate your quick response!