Extremely High level of breath ketones

(Eliza Hart) #1

Hie,
I have been on keto for longer and longer periods for the last 6 months. I am more and more consistent. For 3 weeks now I have had my Ketonix to support my will to switch to keto as a lifestill.
The problem I face is extremely high levels of breath ketons 145, 130,115, not all day and not everyday, but still worries me. I have had very bad headache for 2 days. I do not eat carbs and my keto plan has been very consistent for 3 weeks. I do not have diabetes.
Should I worry about something?
Thank you for your feedback
Eliza

(Michael) #2

Breath ketones of 145, 130, 115 are very high. in the last 3 months I have only registered over 100 on two occasions. The Ketonix is a good tool to get instant feedback. Perhaps you could introduce some Blueberries, Raspberries and Strawberries into your diet to drop your levels below 100.

Also be aware that alcohol will drive your measurements higher. Alcohol is present in many mouthwashes, perfumes etc… I was also getting high measurements previously when taking LivOn / Altrient liposomal supplements which contain 10% alcohol.

(Jay AM) #3

As mentioned above, alcohol will artificially raise the number and so will not having it calibrated depending on which device it is. Check the user guide or website about calibration. If those 2 things don’t fix the problem, send an email to the company.

(Eliza Hart) #4

Thank you for your feedback, but I did not have any alcohol, or used mouthwash before taking a measure.
I have not had these levels in a week, so I suppose it’s ok.

(Michael) #5

I think the newer Ketonix self-calibrate so there should be no issue with this for your device.

Ketonix Dial morning after OMAD and 2 glasses of wine..JPG802×733 44.8 KB

I try to stay in the green and yellow regions. If I was getting consistent red level readings or higher I think I would increase my carbohydrate intake to reduce my ketosis levels.

However, this is what it looks like after consuming 700mg of pure ethanol/ alcohol contained in a liposomal supplement:

Ketonix%20display%20after%20LivOn%20Liposomal%20sachet
Ketonix display after LivOn Liposomal sachet.JPG803×736 45 KB

#6

barring an issue with the meter, high breath or urine ketones can mean your body is diposing of 'extra ketones". the rate of ketone production is determined by the rate of beta oxidation of fat in the liver so if your cells are not consuming the ketones produced that means either the ketones can’t get in (carnitine deficiency or genetic abnorality) or they are happy with other fuels. again, assuming the meter works the “other fuel” cant be exogenous glucose because you would not be in ketosis. it could be that at times you are eating enough carbs to be out of ketosis but some how managing to only measure as your body goes back into ketosis and ramps up production yet the tissues are not uptaking them.

the headaches could be related to electrolyte issues, seach 'keto aid" on here for a recipe/strategy to see if that resolves the head ache.

if you are swinging wildly from sugar burning to ketosis you whole body will be confused and all kinds of strange shit will happen.

if you are having the results you want (whatever they are) i wouldn’t worry about it.(if the headaches don’t resolve you should consult a physician)

if you are repeatedly falling off the wagon and binging on large amounts of carbs you gotta get that under control.

(Michelle Popovits) #7

Did you ever figure out what the issue was with the high readings? I had been doing keto (and consistently tracking all food) for a month and last week my levels spiked above 80 and as high as 157…when it first happened I was sick those couple of days (concentration issues, fatigue, strange body sensations). I am not diabetic. I’ve been left wondering if my high ketones were a result of getting sick (allergies maybe) or the other way around.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #8

The question for me would be whether the breath acetone (and presumably the other two ketone bodies, as well) is high because serum ketones are high, or because something is causing ketones to be excreted rather than used.

The best indicator of trouble would be your level of serum β-hydroxybutyrate, which is one of the diagnostics for diabetic ketoacidosis. Serum levels are a far more accurate measure of what’s going on than breath or urine measures. You problem is almost certainly not ketoacidosis, unless you are becoming a Type I diabetic or your Type II has been untreated for so long that your pancreas is giving out. If the pancreas is putting out any insulin at all, ketoacidosis is practically impossible.

Diabetic ketoacidosis is also accompanied by elevated serum glucose, by the way. But there is such a thing as “euglycaemic” ketoacidosis (glucose not elevated), and it is seen in patients taking an SGLT-2 inhibitor and in pregnant or lactating women on a ketogenic diet who attempt to fast. (Keto is fine during pregnancy/lactation, the problem is the fasting. Once the baby is weaned, fasting becomes fine again.)

(Michelle Popovits) #9

Thanks @PaulL for you response.

I have never been diabetic so agree that is unlikely an issue…unless i missed something. Since starting keto I’ve tracked my glucose levels and they average around 4.9 without any wide swings and have been fairly consistent (morning/evening). I am 52YF and generally in good shape/health, no meds…and though I’d love to lose 5 or 10 lbs of fat, I don’t really need to. I typically do intermittent fasting and eat starting around. 11 am or so.

My suspicions are that any form of exercise (and/or stress) increases the levels. I have found for much of my adult life that I can’t do any sort of serious workout program for very long without my health falling apart (exhaustion, concentration issues, etc). I have no known medical issues and tests the drs. did on me several years ago all came back with no issues. I suspect allergies and am pursuing natural treatments to that since last fall (BIE).

When I started using the ketonix device a few weeks ago I thought it was great to have a metric that I could monitor. When I got sick, and noticed the levels spiked around that time (starting the evening before) I realized that something must be up. Having metrics is useful and it has me thinking about what else I could track. You mentioned tracking the serum level - I’m assuming that would mean to get one of the blood ketone monitors? Do you have a recommendation of a particular unit? Are there any other metrics that you know about that that you think would be helpful to self track.

I’m starting to setup little experiments now with my ketonix device and measuring at intervals to see if I can discover patterns and make them repeatable to see what I can discover. I’m feeling a bit like ‘what came first the chicken or the egg’…with regards to ketone spikes and getting sick.

Thanks

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(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #10

Well, that would be the body working as designed. If you are exercising, you probably need a bit more glucose running around. Though on re-reading your post, I see you are referring to levels of acetone in your breath, which is a different matter. It may or may not be a problem, I don’t know. I would expect the body to consume more ketones during exercise, not excrete them.

That, however, is a different story. But go by what works for you, not some preconceived notion of what is required or should be possible. For what it’s worth, my own feeling about exercise is similar to Mark Twain’s feelings about work: “Whenever I get the urge to do some, I lie down until it passes.” :rofl::rofl: (Exercise for its own sake doesn’t interest me much, whereas general physical activity with a purpose is a whole different matter.)

(Bob M) #11

I recommend giving up now. I have thousands of samples, and I finally gave up. I could never repeatedly find patterns. Since I still have my ketonix on my desk at work, I take it. Here’s an example:

image

If you just look at “After back/abs + jogging 30 minutes”, you’ll see the results are anywhere from 17 to 37, so double. (Note: I have a first generation ketonix, so this is just a number.) No discernible pattern.

This was the same for blood ketones, too: no patterns I could ever figure out. Edit: tested protein intake, fat intake, exercise, more. No patterns.

Though you did get really high levels for a while.

(Michelle Popovits) #12

Thanks for the feedback/info. I’m now attempting to follow time of day patterns….so sporadically testing to see if any patterns appear to emerge and then I’ll drill down….at least until i get bored and find something better to do with my time…lol