If you want the benefits of a plant-free diet, the onions, bell peppers, and avocadoes will work against that.
Enjoying carnivore but getting frustrated with lack of results
a7040ccedf40e45b756b
(a7040ccedf40e45b756b)
#22
Thanks for that, but I seem to be getting conflicting advice.
So rather than going all in on carnivore from the start, I felt that I was being advised to go more keto before going full out carnivore.
I can live without the vegetables but perhaps my body needs to be weaned off them over the course of 3 months?
But being new to this forum, I get the sense that there is some kind of rivalry/snobbery between those who are full out carnivore and those lesser folk who are only keto?
Personally, I am not looking for any badge or superiority over others on a different plan. I am just trying to gain you guys experience and knowledge to enable me to find what works best for me to feel well and energetic.
robintemplin
(Robin)
#23
You are right, it can seem like a rivalry. And many of us are prone to defending our personal path to success. But itās also just as frequently statedā¦ YOU DO YOU. Many have had a winding path and done some doubling back on the journey. Others have started out keto or carni and stayed there and never looked back.
There are many contradictions in our forum, because we often have different reactions to various things, plus some come for medical reasons, others for weight loss.
I also thought carnivore folks were a bit āsuperiorāā¦ in MY thinking. Then I became oneā¦ OOPSā¦. And I am certainly not superior in any way. Except I have great hair and am very humble. LOL
Jesty
(John)
#24
Humble is the only way to be. Plus either keto or carnivore of course!
I will work out which one suits me best in due course, and naturally not look down on those who choose the alternative option.
SomeGuy
(Joey)
#25
Since I donāt see a post from you on this particular thread, Iām sorry if Iām not getting the proper context of your situation and concerns (havenāt searched to find your other posts), but conflicting advice is what weāre all about 
Not sure why someone would want to completely ban all vegetables from oneās diet (as a result, full 100% carnivore never made much sense to me personally). But Iām blessed with pretty good health, so perhaps Iām not eager to try out extremes to combat a particular chronic concern I donāt have.
Iāve read plenty of reliable research about the dangers of TOO much protein, and full carnivore would seem to push oneās macro-nutrient mix into that direction. There must be more to it than I understand, because some highly educated, well-read forum members are all-out full-on carnivores.
But conflicting advice remains our keto communityās secret sauce. Please imbibe regularly. 
Septimius
#27
I donāt think thatās true, but I can see why some would assume thatās the case.
What generally happens is that people find a way of eating which suits them and cures a myriad of things they were struggling with, and then they evangelise to others. This is not done with malice - itās just exciting to find a solution and you want other people to share the success youāve experienced.
Thereās also the fact that people ask questions, and everyone is answering truthfully. Whilst there are lots of studies out there which help to support statements, a lot of the experience shared here is n=1.
On the one hand, weāre all humans, so thereās likely to be some crossover in experiences. On the other, weāre all individuals with different ages, body types, fitness, ailments, medications etc - so our experiences will differ.
I think it can be possible to perceive carnivore as keto-extreme, and people often think the āextremeā version of anything is better. A lot of the prominent carnivores balance what they say with āthis way of eating works brilliantly for me and you might like to try itā and āif youāre doing well eating plants and are happy, then why not eat plantsā.
In reality, the two ways of eating share lots of similarities but differ in many ways. I was vaguely horrified by the idea of eating carnivore when I first came across it - but the more I read and the more I learnt and the more I realised that I was actively seeking out sources of sugar (in food like tomatoes), the more I felt that I was at a point where carnivore would be good as an experiment.
I felt pretty good on keto. I feel 10000 times better on carnivore - and thatās not an exaggeration. So maybe itās something like āif youāre broken enough to need carnivore, itāll revolutionise your life - so then you become very enthusiastic recommending it to othersā.
I love seeing success on this forum in any way, shape or form - keto, carnviore, vegetarian keto, those who eat offal, people who cheat and people who donāt - none of it matters to me as long as theyāre happy and seeing progress.
Septimius
#30
Oh, thanks for that second link - I read all of Bearās stuff and then I realised Iād forgotten to bookmark the main link.
Plenty to get my teeth into later!
Goldengirl52
(Denise)
#31
Iām so with you John, humility is in limited supply these days, everywhere we look. I enjoy someone agreeing with me, but I donāt want that at the expense of truth.
Jesty
(John)
#32
Exactly. Totally agree with you.
Just be humble, but remember, you canāt eat humble pie as it has too many carbs in it!
Goldengirl52
(Denise)
#34
I donāt know, Iāve done some wonders baking with Almond Flour. Almond Flour, keto-friendly humble-pie, hmm?? Perfect for a Saturday bake-off 
Shortstuff
(Allie)
#35
Since I donāt see a post from you on this particular thread,
Itās the OP who accidentally hit the anonymous post button.
PaulL
(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?)
#37
I donāt think so, though perhaps you are picking up on something. I donāt know.
But what I do see in some of our carnivores is a strictness in posts that probably comes from people saying stuff along the lines of āIām carnivore; I only eat 100 g/day of plant foods.ā If I were a carnivore, that sort of thing would try my patience. As it is, I always get similarly irritated when reading yet another study of why a ālow-carbā diet doesnāt work, only to find that they define ālow-carbā as 35% of a 2200-calorie diet, or close to 200 g/day.
PaulL
(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?)
#38
Itās certainly possible. A lot of people who moved from a keto diet to carnivore found it quite an adjustment, even after adapting to keto. The common wisdom seems to be that going directly from a high-carb diet to carnivore can be really tough.
PaulL
(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?)
#39
Several of the more prominent carnivore advocates, such as Dr. Georgia Ede, Amber OāHearn, and Kelly Hogan, have stated that they did not exactly become carnivores by choice, but rather because it turned out to be the only way of eating that dealt way they could deal with certain health problems they had, that even the medications they tried didnāt help. Itās not that they are morally or philosophically opposed to eating plant foods, but that they canāt bear how they feel after eating them.
You are in good company, because it appears to baffle Dr. Phinney, too, from some things heās said at Ketofest. I gather he, like you, doesnāt understand how carnivores can eat so much meat and be healthy. I know it mightily baffled the researchers at Bellevue Hospital, when Steffanson and Andersen failed to come down with scurvy. But the only time the pair even felt ill during the experiment was when the researchers persuaded them to cut back on the fat.
And after the experiment was over Steffansson continued eating an all-meat diet until his death at 82, and seemed to thrive. From a comment he made about being able to get cheap fat from his butcher (because everyone else in that New Hampshire town was afraid to eat fat), I gather the impression that he ate more fat than protein, not just in caloric percentages, but also (it would seem) by weight.
Alecmcq
(Alec)
#40
Oh, yes, welcome to us!! There are lots of ways of doing what we do, not just one. I think that is a really good thingā¦ everyone is talking from their own standpoint, and their own experience, and that specific advice may not work for you. Therefore getting varied opinions and then choosing a way that makes sense for you is the way to go.
But in general, (almost) all of the advice you get here will be broadly in line with keto principles, and are really just tactics within the broad keto structure.
I often see advice from people that I think is just completely wrong given the stated problems and context, but, hey, I donāt have the monopoly of being right. . Every time I see a completely different perspective it challenges my own thinking on how all this stuff works. I think we all do this.
Bravo for spotting something absolutely essential to our forums: a bit of variety. Long may it continue.
Cheers
Alec