What would you eat in that case? I guess you’d need to get essentially all your calories from fat. The usual coconut, avocado, olive, I suppose. Protein would be a serious question since high-protein vegan foods tend also to be high carb… unless you went with refined foods or protein powders.
(Also, happy new year all!)
Getting more calories from monounsaturated work better with carbohydrates?
Would be hard to do though?
Happy New Year Also!
Footnotes:
[1] Comparison of monounsaturated fat with carbohydrates as a replacement for saturated fat in subjects with a high metabolic risk profile: studies in the fasting and postprandial states. …More
[2] “…If dietary saturated fat intake has little to do with saturated levels in our blood, then what does? There is, in fact, sound evidence that dietary carbohydrate is a major determinant of serum saturated fat levels. We know this because two respected research groups [16,17] fed humans carefully measured, weight-maintaining diets either high in carbohydrate or moderate in carbohydrate. In both studies, blood levels of saturated fats went up dramatically on the high carb diets, even though they were very low in fat. We [18] performed a weight loss study during which we fed diets varying from 32 up to 84 grams of saturated fat per day, with “healthy carbohydrate” making up the energy difference when dietary fat was reduced. In blood triglycerides and cholesteryl esters, saturated fat levels trended upwards when the high carbohydrate, very low fat diet was consumed, despite the diet being energy restricted, causing ongoing body fat loss. …” …More
Amazing you don’t even have to eat saturated fat to have high saturated fat levels in the blood stream only thing is; just add very high carbohydrates to a low fat diet and you will have high saturated fat serum levels in your blood anyway just from eating low fat and very high carbohydrate?
That just blows my mind!
This makes no sense. Macros don’t have nutrients. Foods have nutrients. Name a “nutrient dense” fat.
And except for the polyunsaturated fats (n-3, n-6), fats aren’t essential either. Saturated fat is definitely not essential.
N.b. by certain metrics whole wheat bagels have more nutrients than ribeye meat:
Please advise @atomicspacebunny. My response was to her claim here about “not getting enough nutrient dense carbohydrates”.
She also apparently thinks there are essential carbohydrates, so you may want to advise her about that while you’re at it.
Thanks. 
References?
I don’t think that’s true. The evidence we have is that it is the dietary fat that gets stored, not the carbohydrates, unless the total carbs exceed the total energy requirements. In other words, as unsexy as it sounds, if you eat a caloric surplus, it will get stored.
De novo lipogenesis is a minor pathway, at least in healthy people. Carbs rarely get stored b/c they are usually consumed along with fat and have priority when used for energy.
This was tested at least twice. Here’s a study in which subjects were fed 1000 grams of carbs in a 5000 kcal diet. You’d think that if something triggered lipogenesis, then 1000 grams of carbs should do it:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/3165600/
And here’s the layman’s analysis:
TLDR it’s actually hard to have carbs converted and stored as fat because energy expenditure goes up to compensate.
Avocado is a nutrient dense fat/carb…lol
Dude you really are comical…lol
Oooh! I like your brain whoever you are…lol
Seriously that is awesome info!
There are certainly arguments to be advanced against fructose, and I’ve seen some good ones made. I do think their application rises rapidly with the frequency that fructose is ingested, and in certain contexts - like the “Standard American Diet” or anytime lots of carbs are being eaten. If a given individual was demonstrably being affected by their overall carb intake, and a lot of that was fructose, then I’d certainly think that reducing the fructose portion would be a good thing, even if the total carb intake remained the same.
There is a metabolic “landing zone” for high-carb that can work, almost always with very low fat. The people around the world who eat a lot of rice or other carbs and don’t suffer from it tend to eat less often, and with no snacking between meals. They are not “constant grazers.” Often, there is just one big meal per day, with a smaller one at the other end.
If we’re a “ketogenic community,” then insulin levels are a big focus, and hence, the avoidance of carbs. Around the world - eating a lot of rice sends one’s insulin level up, no doubt about it, but doing it only once or twice a day - with a lot of time between meals for insulin to decline and stay low - can allow the average insulin level to remain low enough to not present problems.
One thing early settlers noticed about Native Americans is that they were constant grazers even eating bugs and anything edible in the wild or in sight constantly (probably a very fast metabolism) but were thin as rails.
I imagine they were not sleeping on a couch all day either and diet probably matched there energy expenditure.
That makes sense to me. Lots of rice, a little meat and vegetables, and eating 1-2 meals a day with no snacking seems like it would yield lean people. Also, if the rice has a chance to cool it turns into more resistant starch and probably doesn’t spike insulin as much.
Dr Fung talks about the transition in the West from “eat 3 meals a day” with a typical 12 hour overnight fast and true gaps between meals, to the current culture of “all snacks all the time … plus meals too”. I’m sure this has had a big impact.
Another big impact has been sugar and other additives increasingly both in Asia and in westernized Asians - desserts or sodas becoming a daily thing rather than just once a week or for holidays and/or ultra-processed foods snacks, etc.
So that sugar impact has taken the usual safe bowl or two of rice with veg/meat/fish and given it a sugar poisoning that boosts obesity and in those that aren’t obese, increases other disease like cancer.
Oh! And also the nasty fats!!! Used to be mainly animals fats - now though, awful processed PUFAs and TFAs.
My observations from traveling to Asia and not just to the big cities, but rural populations.
They are not all skinny anymore. There is Coca Cola and Burger King in remote cities. The opposite of here - the men suffer more weight gain than the women. By a LOT. Not the same social pressures to stay thin on men as there are on women.
Nope. You are the expert here. If you could market your out-of-the-box AMAZING abilities you would be rich and no need to post condescending posts on this forum ever again.
I bet you must look like a female bodybuilder to have the muscle fitness to metabolize the carbs you claim to consume and remain thin and in ketosis. Or does swigging resistant potato starch provide all the magic??
Funny I don’t recall any before-and-afters you’ve posted here. Those brave enough to do so (and there are MANY!) are where I get my inspiration from.
My perception of Asia doing “two meals of rice a day, with a little meat and vegetable” is probably as outdated as the American idea of “bacon and eggs for breakfast, a peanut butter sandwich for lunch, roast with green beans and potatoes for dinner, with no snacks between meals”.
I haven’t been to China but in Japan, even 20 years ago, soft drinks machines and convenience stores were ubiquitous.
Why even bother responding to my posts, just ignore me if you don’t like me.
I’m not here to entertain you with my body or my N=1’s I’m here to educate myself and figure out how to do this correctly.
You seem to think any thing I do is just baseless even if it works for me and I think that you are more interested criticizing others because they don’t agree with you?
I can’t share anything because you say so?
Who are you to tell me what to do?