Cramp so bad that I had a bad fall out of bed!

[peggo]

Hi all,
I’m the one that had “super high” cholesterol (according to my doctor) a couple of months back. I went right back onto Keto as per the support of a number of people in this wonderful group - and am back on track to losing 25 lbs. I have lost 17.8 lbs since January, and have 6.8 lbs to go to get to 130 (I am an athletic - 56 year old big boned person).
Last night, I had such a bad cramp in my calf and a muscle on the outside of my lower leg, that when I went to get out of bed to stretch it out, I collapsed and couldn’t get up. Unfortunately, my chest slambed into the bedside table and my butt hit the metal support frames of the bed incredibly hard. I had to take pain killers for the bruising.
I have been taking Magnesium (Jamieson 500 mg + D3 (500 IU) for months at bedtime. I have also been taking Potassium (100 mg - timed release GNC) for about a month. Things appears to be getting better in the lower leg cramp department - but truth be told - I was on the age every night…I like to stretch out lake a cat in the morning hours…and that’s when these cramps want to set in. Recently, I started taking Glucosamine/ NEM (Weber Naturals (750/250mg) twice a day for joint pain in my hands.

Does anyone have any ideas at all?
Peg

[amwassil]

My first guess is that you need to increase your supplementation levels. If you do so, do it gradually. I use Redmond Real Salt, French’s No Salt and plain Epsom salt in my current electrolyte mix, in the proportions of: 50gr Real Salt; 40gr No Salt; and, 10gr Epsom salt. This makes a 10-day supply for me, at 10 grams per day. My mix presumes I’m getting a lot of sodium from food since it’s a very common element in many foods. Please also note, that some people may advise against supplementing potassium, and I address the concern about that in this linked post:

So, what does cause (lower) leg cramps on keto?

‘Night cramps’ are pretty common and get more common as we age. So they seem to be more age-related and are definitely not a problem specific to keto. I suffered them for years prior to eating keto. When they started being a real problem for me several years ago I was shocked to discover their specific cause and cure are unknown. Although, as @PaulL points out the most likely suspects are potassium and/or magnesium deficiency. My layman’s guess is that as we age we tend to ingest less electrolyt…

Also, you could do a forum-wide search for “night cramps” and get lots of posts with other opinions and experiences:

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/search?q=night%20cramps

[ctviggen]

But if pickle juice stops the cramps, it cannot be salt, as there is no way for salt to get into the blood that quickly. It has to be some other cause. It also can’t be magnesium or potassium, as the same can be said for those.

For instance:

The most commonly reported treatment used to prevent recurrent cramp was magnesium supplementation (used by 58% of participants). Most participants perceived the magnesium supplements as being ‘useless’ or only ‘a little help’. This is consistent with randomised trials that found that, while magnesium supplementation might benefit women experiencing leg cramps during pregnancy [20], it is no more effective than placebo for night-time cramp [21] or chronic persistent leg cramp [17].

Unknotting night-time muscle cramp: a survey of patient experience,...

Now, I’m trying more salt and also have ordered magnesium, but I’m not sure these will actually prevent night cramps. For me, I rarely get them, so maybe I’ll be “cured”.

[amwassil]

@ctviggen Thanks for this, Bob. I have not tried topical application of anything, although I have read other reports from forum members that various items appear to have helped them. I have experienced a marked improvement since I began to supplement electrolyte salts in a measured way during the past 6+ months or so.

[amwassil]

@peggo Off Topic: A response from you here:

So, what does cause (lower) leg cramps on keto?

thanks Michael, I believe I am getting enough Calcium (I am an almond junkie - and I dry roast them and salt them). But I may need to add some sold in capsules and see if that makes any difference! PEg

In my opinion, almonds are not a particularly good choice and if you really want to include significant quantities of nuts I think better choices are pecans, brazils, walnuts and macadamias instead. They are more expensive than almonds, but have better keto nutrional profiles.

https://perfectketo.com/nuts-on-a-ketogenic-diet/

Finally, I think the concern about phytic acid content of all nuts is overblown. Especially for those of us doing keto.

[PaulL]

What prescriptions do you take?

[barns]

I too get calf cramps. Not often but when I do I wake up and it hurts pretty good. I can even feel the soreness for about a day after sometimes. What I did notice is that I usually have done strenuous stuff that day. Could be coincidental but not sure if maybe the overworking of the muscle with the lack of nutrient replenishment is the reason. Maybe I should start taking a mag supplement.

[cooked]

I tried all sorts of solutions. I stopped drinking any alcohol at all which seemed to help a little, but not consistently. I increased my table salt intake and my magnesium intake.
The miracle cure for me, from the first day, was introducing Chaya leaves into my diet, which contain all the stuff that is to be found in spinach (minus the pesticides) only more so. Magnesium, Potassium, iron and a lot of other stuff. I consider this to be a personal miracle, don’t know if it would work for other people. Here’s a link to my post a few weeks ago when I was not aware of the effects it would have:

Chaya

Quite by chance I discovered that a rather nice shrub that we have in the “garden” (cow paddock) is a Chaya. Link: http://people.umass.edu/psoil370/Syllabus-files/Chaya.pdf and https://hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/proceedings1996/V3-516.html#Table%201 I will be trying out a few leaves very soon, cooking like spinach… I wonder why this isn’t so well known, it is apparently a traditional medicine for diabetes in Belize. I have long been aware that frozen spinach (I can’t grow it here) is very likely…

[peggo]

Thanks Michael.

[peggo]

Celexa (Citalopram) 60 mg

[PaulL]

Huh. That shouldn’t be causing cramps or interfering with your electrolytes. Although, you could try cutting back on the dose and seeing if that helps the cramps. But proceed cautiously, and watch closely for any return of symptoms that made the drug necessary in the first place. A ketogenic diet seems to have a positive effect on serotonin in the brain, so there is a good chance that you might be able to cut back successfully.

[gingersmommy]

Congratulations on approaching your goal. I am so sorry about your leg cramps - they can be so painful and debilitating - and your fall! Had spasms a week ago that were so scary because I didn’t know if/when they would stop. I was just waiting for that “knot” that won’t release, which is horrible. Mine were from dancing at a wedding and using muscles that I hadn’t in a long, long time.

All I know is about getting adequate salt. I haven’t read the responses yet from everyone but am interested to see.

Hope all of this is soon behind you.

[peggo]

Thanks Marianne!

[peggo]

Thanks Paul, I recently switched to a generic brand - which I am told is like going down 20% in active ingredients. I have tried unsuccessfully for 10 years to get off of these anti-depressants. It takes months to get back on track when I try to play with it. There is still a fair amount of stress in my life. When a few things become less stressful, and my mood, in general is a bit better, I will definitely try again! Thank you for taking the time to respond!
Peg

[PaulL]

Check out the Mental Health section of the Health Forum for more information on anti-depressants and keto. There are several threads on the topic that I know of.

[peggo]

Thanks Paul!

[amwassil]

Check out the Mental Health section…

@peggo While there visit the Psych Ward. We’re having a hellava great time over here:

[peggo]

lol!