Covid-19 versus the Flu


(Jane) #41

Ok, then you are assuming it was COVID - you don’t know for sure without a test. Many viruses have simiar symptoms - just like my neighbor. And perhaps she did have it and is one of the false negatives you mention. Her insurance paid for her antibody test.


(Vic) #42

That was not the reg flu,

I only remember Flu vaccines being a thing last 15 or so years Def not in the 80’s and before most people didn’t get a flu vaccine


#43

My Doctor is assuming it was COVID from my symptoms.


(Doug) #44

:slightly_smiling_face: Yeah, because now we do have vaccines and varying amounts of immunity.

Most people in the U.S. don’t get one now. You have to go pretty old, like 65+, to get to it being over 50%. The lethality most years is very low for the flu, and it gets almost vanishingly low for younger people, i.e. the given rate for 65+ year olds is like 100 times that of those less than 50. There is some increased concern for babies, right? I don’t know about that one - just seems that way to me.

Really, once World War II was over, flu vaccines in the U.S. were a common thing. I’ve been through a lot of decades and I don’t remember doctors even asking me if I wanted one until the last couple, as I became an old so-and-so…


(Vic) #45

they ask everyone if they want one for the last 15 years or so Not 30 years ago though, and most did not get vaccines then and was a non factor at that time

though based on what you say most don’t get it now then it would be a non factor now, Though I do know many do get it now and for the last 10 or 15 years as doctors ask everyone if they want it and there is usually a sign at local pharmacies and other places offering free vaccines as well


(Doug) #46

Not a “non factor” at all - any immunity gained through vaccination can make a difference, and among those who are relatively vulnerable to the flu, it indeed makes a big difference.

I don’t know how much more doctors are pushing flu vaccines now, if at all - this is a good question.

During flu season (and maybe just before?) the CDC does encourage doctors to offer flu shots.


#47

Or that the flu virus isn’t as deadly as is generally assumed. I haven’t been sick for a decade until this sars-cov virus and I’ve never needed a vaccine thanks to Vitamin D but I do remember very well always suffering with a fever after receiving a vaccine. No vaccine = no fever.

I give credit where it is due… Vitamin D, carrots and liquid soap.


#48

It’s normal to feel a little off after getting a vaccine. That’s your body producing the necessary antibodies to fight a real infection.


(Peter) #49

It’s almost like that’s how vaccines work.


(Jennifer Kleiman) #50

I rarely get sick but for me I give credit to keto. Carrots are too carby for me to include in my usual diet, and I do sunbathe/garden enough to keep a good VitD level. But I was just listening to a podcast earlier this morning discussing how vitamin D supplements are snake oil & there’s no human RCTs showing that they have any benefits. FWIW.

I did have a dry cough/mild fever in late Feb/early March after two weeks of traveling through O’Hare and Atlanta Hartsfield, though. I figured it might be Covid-19 & my doc had me come in to get tested but since I didn’t need hospitalization I didn’t qualify for a PCR test according to the policies at the time, only a rapid flu test which was negative. Just got an antibody test to satisfy my curiosity and it was not in fact covid-19.


(Jennifer Kleiman) #51

[quote=“OldDoug, post:36, topic:101140”]
That other article was written by a doctor who was essentially arguing against stay-at-home restrictions , but he still referred to Dr. Faust and flu mortality being grossly overstated and probably much lower than 0.1%.[/quote]

I think this world-wide real-time science experiment we’re all engaged in has encouraged many of us who aren’t public health professionals to become armchair epidemiologists… I have been trying to learn as much as I can and I am becoming somewhat aware of how complicated things are, so even MDs or “well respected researchers” who aren’t actually in the field probably shouldn’t assume their expertise in one area allows them to assume the decisions are being made by chimpanzees and they themselves are more enlightened.

That said, it’s become increasingly clear that the southeast Asian countries, having lived through SARS and MERS and now largely skating through SARS-2: The Sequel, did much better than western countries by having near-universal mask wearing and much better and much quicker test-trace-isolate protocols.

Yeah def!


(Doug) #52

:wink: I think everybody should make predictions for the future - it’s easy to attempt to find fault. In some places it’s now been long enough that we’ve got some fairly solid information.

Things were handled well with the first SARS and MERS. Really, looking back, it’s surprising to me how well. If we get something in the future like MERS or Ebola, stuff that’s really lethal, with wider spread, that could be a true nightmare.


#53

Little off? I was bedridden for days.


#54

Carrots are fine for me at the end of the day.

I live in Canadia and therefore must take a supplement in the winter however I do agree that most Vitamin D supplements are snake oil since the majority of companies can’t gurantee purity and supplements contain other toxins. There was studies years ago which found 10 times the amount of Vitamin D per capsule in Vitamin D supplements derived from lanolin. ie 200,000iu instead of 2000iu. I take a lichen based Vitamin D3 and I’ve noticed a difference however the first sign of chronic vitamin D toxicity is insomnia. Advocates often take too much and then supplement melatonin instead of stopping or lowering their Vitamin D supplement (dose). ie. Rhonda Patrick.

Did you get a blood or saliva covid-19 antibody test?


(Jennifer Kleiman) #55

It was a blood test at Quest, which I believe is using the Roche test with 99.8% accuracy. Ah well, would’ve been interesting if it had been positive but I accept the result.


(Peter) #56

Balanced views like that would see Ivor calling you “vermin” on Twitter, you know :slight_smile: This whole “I tell you all repeatedly that I know a lot about field A, so let me dazzle you all with my utterly uneducated views on why field K is a govt conspiracy” thing is just tiresome.


(Bob M) #57

More evidence of differences, from autopsies of lungs:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/more-evidence-emerges-on-why-covid-19-is-so-much-worse-than-the-flu/2020/05/21/e7814588-9ba5-11ea-a2b3-5c3f2d1586df_story.html

So far, we know of several people who have died. Somewhat “rural” NY, my wife’s niece’s boss was working from home and niece was working with him. His 93 yo mother was in the house. She got covid, they think due to a health aid, and gave it to him. She died, he was in the hospital a week. Niece did not appear to get it.

My wife’s sister talked with someone who had both parents die of it. We know of a dad younger than I am with kids about my age who went into the ICU. We believe he survived.

Colleague’s friend and her husband got it. Friend did not go to the hospital, but said it was by far the worst thing she’s ever had. Many days of high fever, completely wiped. Other times, not bad. But weeks of sickness and recovery.

That’s what makes this disease so strange. Some people don’t know they have it, yet others get crushed.

Follow a lot of doctors on twitter. One doc retweeted a post from another doc. That doc is an emergency room physician treating covid patients. Seven of his friends had a poker party (in a state now “open”); he wasn’t there. All seven got covid. At the time he posted, one was intubated, one was in the hospital, and the other five were recovering at home. And that occurred within 6 days of the party.

That’s something else: with the flu, you typically feel as if you’ve been hit by a bus. (Or at least people tell me that’s true; knock on wood, I can’t remember having the flu.) With covid, you can have an active, communicable infection, and not know. Even if you subsequently develop symptoms, you could transfer it to multiple people.


(bulkbiker) #58

Wow he’s really upset you hasn’t he…

I do wonder how…


#59

Yup. Like I’ve said in the past… these SARS coronavirus viruses inhibit the cell mechanism which calls out to the immune system. So those susceptible don’t know they’re infected until their viral load is high and the asymptomatic silent spreaders don’t know they’re infected and infecting others. However the first sign I remember and noticed in asymptomatic people is a reduction in energy level. Tiredness.

This virus is a silent killer.


(Jane) #60

@Consistency - how are you doing now? Completely over it or still fighting symptoms?