Can someone please explain?!

(Adam Kirby) #21

Something I think many ketoers miss is in LCHF, most of your body’s energy is provided by fatty acids not ketones. Ketones are the secondary source of fuel. People need to chill on the whole ketone readings thing, the numbers vary wildly from person to person and I don’t think they’re that good of a metric for anything.

#22

this is not accurate. your brain doesn’t use fatty acids. your heart prefers ketones. they are the perfect metric for measuring your level of ketosis.

(Khara) #23

@Jason_v So are there “levels” of ketosis. I thought it was just that either you are or you aren’t in ketosis. Are there low to high levels? And if so what happens in the body on these low to high levels? Any write-ups or podcasts on this that anyone knows of? Thanks :nerd_face:.

(Mark Rhodes) #24

All it takes is one time to not use cream. I still don’t like fasting days because of no cream, _but___That first time was noon till noon. Only six hours without morning cream. I didn’t drink more than two cups of coffee that first time. LOL. Normally I am a coffee hound!

(Khara) #25

@irol770 OK. So, one more thing. All the health benefits you listed are the same ones I feel and have read about with nutritional ketosis. So are the exogenous ketones sometimes being used or marketed to people who are not in nutritional ketosis as a way to reap the benefits without living low carb? Or is it meant to be on top of or added to an already nutritional ketosis state?
Good luck with the fasting. I do daily intermittent. My first meal usually around noon-2 and last meal by about 8pm. I feel great eating that way. Haven’t yet intentionally done the full or multi day fast. Let us know how it goes! Feel like I’m sort of behind the news on that topic. All in time…

(Mark Rhodes) #26

I would think that yes, they are marketed to create a niche among both low carb but not ketogenic eaters and keto people who are driven by MORE…MORE. I haven’t found any difference between a high BOHB reading and a low as long as it is in nutritional range. I also cannot find any data that suggests a higher number leads to more weight loss. For cognitive function like my wife, well she averages 2.8mmol vs my .8mmol but we’ve had about the same success.

I do know athletes who use them. I lift, Kayak and hike and I have not felt the need to use them.

(Lori) #27

@KBG yes ketones provide those benefits to you. I believe endogenous ketones (ones your body creates) are better for you than exogenous (supplemental) ketones but because ketones can reap such great rewards, they are marketed toward people who choose not to live a ketogenic lifestyle. So that they can also benefit from the energy and healing aspect of ketones. Additionally, ketones are “supposed to” give you so much more energy than glucose stores (same as when you create them naturally) that the supplemental ones supposedly also may cause you to not be hungry and have fewer food cravings…but I have no proof of that.

My husband is really looking forward to trying the exo ketones because he feels as if he doesn’t have the increased energy and decreased brain fog from just eating this way…however as I said, he also does not work out and I think that plays a major part in it. But since he was going to try it, I was curious if it would enhance my results so far or hinder them. I think I am going to forego them for now. I will try the fasting (perhaps :wink: ) and keep doing what I’m doing now. I can’t deny that I feel really good just by changing my eating, so no use in trying to fix something until I know its broke!

Thanks!

(Lori) #28

@akirby83 Thank you for that. In posting this original post and then communicating with all of the people who took the time to help me out, I think I have finally come to that realization and conclusion. I was just saying to another person that I do feel remarkably different since eating strict keto. I have lost weight and acknowledge it will be slower and harder the closer I get to “normal” and my gym performance has really improved…so if I’m not throwing the high numbers that someone else might have, it may not actually be a “thing” and I’m not going to worry about it. I will continue to try to tweak and improve my diet or schedule or lifestyle as needed but I don’t think I’ll worry about exogenous ketones.

thanks for taking the time to help me out!

(Adam Kirby) #29

Here’s another thing: even if you measure the ketones in your blood which is the most accurate metric, those are still the ketones in circulation but NOT BEING USED by your body. So really who cares how many excess ketones you have? Your body takes what it wants and all you can measure is what’s still in circulation or being peed/breathed out (aka wasted).

#30

of course there is. 0.1 mmol would be a low level of ketosis. 100 mmol would be high. (and you would be dead :smile:)

most experts feel you need to be above 0.5 to truly be in “nutritional ketosis”

as for what happens with higher levels, thats a pretty big topic, lots of information here

(Lori) #31

I did two fast days last week (unfortunately they sandwiched a couple of days of keto eating but alcoholic drinks at night (no carb drinks however). In any case, the first day, I fasted from Sunday evening dinnertime to Tuesday morning when I again had tea with cream but no food until Tuesday lunch time. So essentially that was a 34 hour fast from my last food to my first tea with cream…the following day my ketones measured 0.4mmol. Then I was out of town for 3 days…ate as best as I could without actually knowing the macros but as I said, I did imbibe a bit. And on my last day out of town I ate some potato chips :frowning: which I regret…however I got home Thursday night, ate dinner and then did not eat again until Saturday morning when I again had tea with cream. Same basic scenario however I think the fast was a 36 hour fast this time. Only herbal teas and water was taken in. My ketones Sat morning were 0.2 mmol.

My weight has not really moved since May (4 months ago)…I don’t know if I am in ketosis or not because the meter shows anywhere from 0.2mmol to 0.6mmol which is a rare occurrence. I know the ketones measured are what is “left over” after I have used what I needed so I’m trying not to worry too much but nothing seems to be changing.

This week I did a 3 day egg fast. This resulted in me eating about 500 extra calories and 50 extra grams of fat per day from what I normally eat (which someone suggested I do anyway, theorizing that I wasn’t eating enough). My carbs were kept to about 15 or 16 grams per day which equated to about 2-3% of my total calorie intake and my weight did not budge, my ketones did not rise and I did this 3 day egg fast right after my last full 36 hour fast…so I was expecting something!

Ugh!!! I’m so frustrated. I think I need to go on like a week long fast but it makes me sad to think about not eating food :frowning:

(Tim) #32

May I ask what the reason is you decided on the ketogenic diet in the first place? What are your main goals? Weight loss, improved health, feeling better, high ketone readings?

(Edith) #33

At what time do you test your ketones? I was testing mine within minutes of waking and they were always on the low side: 0.5 to 0.6. Then I heard that i should wait an hour because just before we wake up, our bodies secrete cortisol to release glucose into the blood stream to help us get going. That lowers our ketones. After an hour, we have used up some of that glucose, the cortisol has dropped, and the ketones go back up. When I wait an hour to test, I am frequently around 1.0 mmol/L.

Also, I think my ketones are higher on the mornings after days that I did NOT exercise. I don’t have enough data points to confirm this hypothesis, yet. I’m going to be testing that idea over the next month.

Finally, I was also at a slight plateau and I had to up my protein somewhat and cut back on the fat a bit. I started dropping some weight again once I did that.

Gotta love that n=1!

Edith

(Kathryn Lambkin) #34

Are you forcing yourself to eat that number of calories? Ie could you reduce your calorie intake and still feel full? 1200 seems quite low to me anyway. You probably already know this, but if you lose significant weight, you will need to consume less calories than you previously did to maintain your weight, and even less to keep losing weight.

Also remember that you’re working out and building muscle, so towards the end net weight loss isn’t the best measure, you should go off a waist measurement, or visuals.

You seem like a keto pro! I can’t really advise because I’ve only been doing it for a week!
I have noticed that my app recommends I eat 1550cal each day to lose 1 pound per week. I’m struggling to get all those calories in sometimes tbh. Something about high fat just makes my body freak out and tell me I’m full. I guess this is a good thing!

(Mark Rhodes) #35

I hadn’t heard that. Would you have a link? I am interested in the GH secreted at about the 4-6th hour of our sleep. I have been fasting for 72 hours at a stretch to increase this hormone and doing things like a 5 minute workout prior to my coffee to lower my cortisol at night, this according to Shawn Stevenson. IDK if it really helps but I don’t mind.