I’m using the CarbManager ap and running into questions regarding Body Armor LYTE Coconut numbers.
There are user entries on the ap ranging from the 5 grams of carbs that result in the 20 calories on the “nutrition label”. All the way up to the 18 grams of total carbs on the label.
I have the ap set to log net carbs.
What are your thoughts regarding net vs total and what numbers would you recommend for this drink?
I don’t drink these often but of course obsess on following my numbers for the day.
So what can you share regarding the science of keto and how to understand and log this intake?
You might try looking the product up in the USDA Food Composition database. Most of those values are provided by the manufacturer, so they ought to be reasonably accurate.
amwassil
(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.)
#3
If you insist drinking this kind of stuff, I’d suggest sugar-free Red Bull instead. Has ZERO carbs.
This is caffeine free so RedBull isn’t an appropriate substitute but thanks.
Anything to add to the actual OP?
amwassil
(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.)
#5
I understand the desire to avoid caffeine. The only other thing I’d add re ‘the actual OP’ is net not total and whatever amount of this stuff you want to imbibe, keep the day’s total net carbs sub-20 grams. And if you’re only drinking it ‘not often’ it’s not a big deal. Best wishes.
Guess I’m looking on this “science of keto” page for some education on total vs net. And in understanding “nutrition labels” which is a chore due to intentional misinformation ie: slightly more valuable than the government food pyramid.
If this product has a total of 20 calories that’s 5 gms useful carbs. From a keto education standpoint why would we care about the 18 total on the label.
So how does our body respond to some portion of the total even though we only get 20 calories
Was only really hoping for links as I’m sure this has been hashed out. Unless someone has a pearl of wisdom on is this 5 or 18 or somewhere in between carbs
Like this label, 2 gms sugars, 5 by calorie count, 18 total.
Cheers all
amwassil
(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.)
#7
What matters for keto is to keep glucose/insulin low enough not to interfere with ketosis. And to do it as consistently as possible. This varies for each of us somewhat. Phinney and Volek say ‘sub-50 grams’ total carbs, but they studied/published mostly very fit athletes who burn carbs a lot faster/efficiently than the rest of us ordinary folks. On this forum, the recommendation is sub-20 grams net. Some folks with higher insulin resistance find that they must limit carb intake even more, some right down to zero.
The reason for ‘net’ is that presumably the rest is indigestible cellulose fiber. However, if you read a label, like the label for Body Armor Lyte Peach Mango, and you see something like 18 total carbs, 0 fiber and 2 sugar, you have to realize that something doesn’t compute. 18 grams of carbs and 0 fiber means the producct contains 18 grams of digestible carbs.
Also, NA and Europe count carbs differently. So ‘total carbs’ in NA is just that and you have to subtract the fiber amount to get net. In Europe, the ‘total carbs’ is the net, since the fiber has already been subtracted and is listed as a separate total for reference. Hope this helps.
OldDog
(Gregory - You can teach an old dog new tricks.)
#8
Net should be your guide… Net is typically carbs minus fiber.
That said, I can’t imagine there being any significant fiber in those drinks.
Keep in mind that when it comes to nutrition labeling, food processors are not concerned about your health/nutrition needs, they are just meeting legal requirements. They will manipulate the numbers in any legal way they can to make the product more sell-able. Typically, they suggest a ridiculously low serving size in order to show low calories per serving.
If the product is playing games with their nutrition information, it is probably best avoided.
If you are serious about your health, perhaps you should consider formulating your own drinks instead of trusting some company who is only serious about maximizing their profit.
What pages do you find reliable information and interpretation on?
This one lists net as 18 which is impossible for 20 calories per serving. And yes OldDog the lies in nutrition labels is exactly why I started this post. Is there some way that the manufacturer can lie about the calories with hidden calories?
The nutritional label on a 16oz Body Armour Lyte is completely incorrect or missing info. 20cal per bottle, yet 18 carbs and only 2 added sugar…no mention of dietary fiber which would of course be deducted from net carbs. Second ingredient is Erythritol which has .2 carbs per gram so considering the rest of the mysteriously missing carbs are Erythritol that would still be 3.2cal add that to the two added sugars and you come up with 11.2cal not 20. Is there fiber in there? Why do USDA nutritional fact labels almost always incorrect???
Of note I’ve been able to generate ketones with as much as 30 gms daily carbs. Have not had the opportunity to add carbs and find my limit but will soon. Currently trying to induce with sub 20
So maybe the real question is what pages do you trust for nutrition information interpretation?
Net versus total carbohydrate is not a settled question. I think almost all the experts would agree that limiting by the carb total is better than going by net carbs. Dr. Phinney tells patients at Virta Health to keep their total carbohydrate intake under 50 grams/day, in the hope (as he stated at Ketofest 2019) that they will stay below 20 g net. Dr. Westman tells his weight-loss patients to stick to under 20 g/day of total carbohydrate—period. He says there is evidence to suggest that fibre may not be as indigestible as was heretofore believed. And nobody knows for sure about sugar alcohols.
To further add to the confusion, everyone’s carbohydrate tolerance is different, so it is hard to specify a limit that will work for everyone. The story going round the forums when I joined was that Carl and Richard really wanted to tell everyone not to eat carbohydrate at all, but they knew no one would listen, so they picked the limit of 20 g/day that we advise here, as being a level that would get almost everyone successfully into ketosis, except the most metabolically damaged.
Was curious about the same thing. Did a little research and the answer appears to indeed be the erithyritol. Sugar alchohols are listed as carbohydrates on the nutritional label. Since there are 2g of sugar and no fibre i guess there are 16 g of erithrytol. Most of the information i found suggsted to use half the amount of sugar alchohols as the net carb number, which is what i decided to do. though some them suggest treating it differently depending on the particular sweetener (https://paleofoundation.com/sugar-alcohol-net-carb-keto/).
As to how that works out on the calories i’m not completely sure, but there could be some fractinoal protien and fat that are included in the calorie total but get rounded to zero for macros. Hope that helps.
