Bariatric Surgery: Death Rates and Cause of Death within 5 Years Post OP

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #41

I’m never a big fan of euphemisms. They tend to wear out every so often, and then we have to find replacements. I’d prefer to be frank, if it’s possible to do so without being brutal.

“Obese” as an insult is a new one on me, however; it is the medical term for “fat,” and should be immune from provoking insult. You might just as well take offense at “diabetic” or “heart patient.” Frankly, I’d expect objections to “fat” as being the insult, not “obese.” Oh well.

The words I really object to are “pee” and “poo.” It always sounds hilarious when an adult uses them to anyone but a child. If you can’t stand the tedium of blurring out “piss” and “shit” every time they come up in conversation, why not use the medical terms, “urine” and “faeces/feces”?

#42

Fat is a pejorative, but has had some degree of reclamation by the fat-positivity movement. Obese, though, it’s just such an ugly word, both to your ears and aesthetically, and it has also been used pejoratively. We know that just because something is a clinical term doesn’t mean it can’t be weaponized.

I’ve met overweight people who didn’t mind calling themselves fat, but I’ve never met one who happily called themselves obese.

(Lisa marie t) #43

I’ve never heard of death rate after baratric surgery I personally think drs day s*** to get u to get surgery n make em money n blah blah blah
Surgery is a tool yes I had it in 2007 it’s sensitive surgery not miracle pill the thing is keto eating is so close to wls eating after surgery had I been “taught” keto then I’d be one of the successful ones
The dr gave us surgery n ya go home n figure it out
Even tho I gained all weight back from wls I’m grateful for keto n losing weight n feeling good
I’m trying to get back on keto losing but I’m struggling this time esp over bread with gallbladder issues n low carb I’m struggling so hard to re start grrrr
But one thing the entire gastric bypass surgery I had in 07 is helping me in keto now

#44

Maybe “baroque” would be a less offensive word to some? :wink:

(Hyperbole- best thing in the universe!) #45

rubenesque

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #46

You have now! :grin:

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #47

Corpulent, portly, overweight, stout . . .

(Windmill Tilter) #48

Like a lot of medical terms, “morbid obesity” comes from latin/greek.

Obesus: That has eaten itself fat
Morbidus: Diseased

So basically, it’s a medical term that means someone has eaten themselves to a level of body fat that there are now serious health consequences and disease. It was definitely an perfect description of me when I was morbidly obese. I don’t know anybody who is morbidly obese that does not have serious health complications.

I hit a BMI of 40, which is the cut-off line for morbid obesity. Keto has helped me to quickly get down to “obesity” and and BMI of 30.7 so far this year. I’m really excited to be overweight in a month (BMI 29).

I don’t get offended by medical terms that correctly and accurately describe my condition. I’m obese.

#49

I wonder if maybe this is an age-related thing. My generation was among the first of the “fat kid” generations, and obese was definitely an ugly term for us.

(PSackmann) #50

I struggle to comprehend losing that much weight on a diet and then agreeing to surgery. I understand the really high protein, low carb concoctions are tough on the kidneys, but for me, this would be enough incentive to go the diet route a bit longer, rather than go for the surgery. Maybe what’s needed are more in-patient facilities for medically supervised fasting as options.

#51

It’s not “high” protein in an absolute sense. Only a relative sense. In order to get an adequate amount of protein in a 1000- or 1200-calorie diet, it has to be a higher percentage of calories than in a “normal” diet.

Someone morbidly obese doesn’t need any carbohydrates and can satisfy the vast majority of fat needs from stored body fat. That leaves protein as the only macro that’s really needed. But you only have to eat as much as you need. Not load up on it to ginormous amounts. :slight_smile:

At what level are proteins tough on the kidneys? Absolutely or relatively?

(Running from stupidity) #52

Only if the kidneys are already compromised.

(Windmill Tilter) #53

I’m 41, so it wouldn’t surprise me if there were generational differences. It could be also just be that I’m not very tactful though too. :yum:

Even I would describe someone else as “overweight” rather than obese. I don’t mind the word “obese” but I get that many people don’t like it.

(Alec) #54

The word obese is definitely a medically defined word that they use for simple categorisation. I remember going for a medical for the first time in a long time about 10 years ago. The nurse did some basic measurements and I read over her shoulder as she wrote: “Obese male presents…”

At the time I considered myself overweight but not even close to “obese”. I was rather shocked by the description, so I went to find out what the definitions were.

There is no doubt that BMI is a very blunt instrument of categorisation, as any weightlifter or bodybuilder will know. Anyone with a decent musculature will often be labelled obese because they are simply heavy compared to their height. BMI says nothing about fat %, which is really what should define obesity, but it doesn’t. It’s defined by levels of BMI.

#55

Small point but you can have ‘decent’ musculature & not be near obese. If you’re very muscular then it can happen.

I’d think so. It’s one of the great moral panics of the day.

(Windmill Tilter) #56

Fun factoid: Regular guys like me with high body fat percentages to begin with can be tipped from overweight to obese because of extra muscle, but it’s actually nearly impossible to be categorized as “obese” as a competitive body builder without some serious steroids. The number of world champion natural bodybuilders that have built enough muscle to be categorized as “obese” can be counted on one hand!

Here is “Butt’s Formula” named after Dr. Casey Butt, who one imagines had a very difficult stint in middle school.:yum: The formula represents the upper reaches of human potential even for genetically gifted, world ranked bodybuilders. It was derived through careful measurements of 300 nationally ranked competitors in a natural bodybuilder competition.

To your point though, it’s totally possible for them to be miscategorized as “overweight” (BMI 25-29) when they’re in a bulking cycle. Also, powerlifters probably get nudged into “obese” pretty often because their body fat percentages tend to be pretty high to begin with.

#57

I only considered WLS once in my life, in early adulthood, and am so glad I didn’t go through with it. It doesn’t make sense to me to butcher my body and permanently affect my body’s ability to absorb nutrients, when you still have to watch what you eat in order to be and stay successful. I know too many people who have had surgery and years later aren’t anywhere near healthy weights (either lost some and stopped or lost and regained). Not to mention a couple who have permanent negative physical issues resulting from the surgery.

(PSackmann) #58

Good point, I didn’t look at it that way.

So, understand is probably not the correct word. I do remember high protein, low carb, low fat meal replacement plans causing havoc, I thought it was the kidneys, and made the leap that this was what these patients were on. Granted, on a well formulated keto diet and fully fat adapted, higher protein and low carb is fine. I’ve never watched the show, so I don’t know if that’s what this patient was on or not.

(Ethan) #59

Technically, the cdc uses classes to categorize obesity. Class 1 is 30-35. Class 2 is 35-40. Class 3 is 40+. At my worst, I was 38.8. I am currently at 28.6.

Doctors are strange. In September of 2005, I weighed 155 with a BMI of 21.6. 18 months later in April of 2007, I weighed 255 pounds with a BMI of 35.6! Yet my doctor didn’t raise major red flags to say something is seriously wrong to gain 100 pounds in 18 months and go from low-normal BMI to class-2 obese!

(Nasir) #60

I have been put on waiting list for WLS on NHS and have been attending various appointments about it since 2017. Last week, had a group education session about preop and postop diets, what happens before, during and after the procedure etc. Many people in facebook group talk about issues that they face after surgery. One lady spent almost a year in hospital.

I have asked my position in waiting list to be frozen for now while I use the new found tools (keto and fasting) to get healthy instead.