Yet another carb-cycling / refeed experiment

(Dom DePlume) #1

I know this topic ruffles feathers, but I think it’s still important for a number of reasons.

I’m running a carb refeed experiment. My partner and I have hit a wall with both weight loss and emotional/mood issues. I think our metabolisms are a bit worn out, our leptin is flat, and (in her case, at least) her/our brains wants a break from ketones, and would benefit from some slow carbs. Tonight, I had a serving of whole-wheat pasta and marinara sauce with meatballs. She had half a serving (but to give you an idea of the emo sensitivity issue we’re dealing with: she nearly burst into tears when she thought about the carbs, instead of treating it like a slight cheat for science). I think for right now, I’m going to n=1 this. I’m going to look at tonight as a toe-dip, then try and have 100g carbs tomorrow (real carbs, not Fruit Loops), and see how I feel. If this works (for the mood, as well as the months-long stall we’ve both been in), she’ll try it, and if it works for both of us, we’ll likely start doing a refeed every now and again to try and switch up our metabolisms.

Is anybody doing, or have experience with low-fat, mod-protein, high-carb refeeds?

(Karen) #2

When I eat carbs I hold water. It’s demoralizing to see the scale creep up for three days. You are going to have to keep your scale loss to yourself. Women lose slower, although you can help her measure, and see the inch loss, which she might get sooner. We are so different. Think about the cold studies. Men shunt blood to their extremities to allow for action, before they freeze to death, women shunt blood to their core to protect their life, or a life if they’re pregnant. We survive.,although hands and feet freeze. We have massively different hormones… the crying. She’s going to need good support. You appear to be aware of it. Bless you!

K

(Roy D Rushing Jr ) #3

I hope it works out for you. My first inclination would be to go deeper into keto-centric methods though. Do whatever I could to increase the depth of my ketosis. Cut carbs further. Start IF or EF, depending on what I was doing before. I dunno, a carb refeed just feels like stepping back from what has been working so well for me.

Now I’m not opposed to having some carbs just for the pure pleasure of it from time to time. I just list that under living to the fullest though. Having the leeway to experience whatever life has to offer at least sometimes is important to me, so long as it’s the exception rather than the rule.

(Dom DePlume) #4

Respectfully, I’m not asking for opinions on if I should do this. I’m asking for people’s experiences employing carb refeeds.

I’ve been strict >20g carbs for 8 months (honestly, more like >10) and have spent most of that time in “optimal” ketosis. I regularly IF and EF, as well as carnivore days, fat fasts, and fat feasts. For the past three weeks, I’ve been feeling mentally and emotionally “off”; dramatically so, for no obvious reason. We both have. I think there’s some good science that argues that any long-term, non-changing diets tend to draw down the metabolism, because your endocrine and metabolic systems get used to them, and your metabolism just goes on sustain-and-maintain auto-pilot. If you’re not switching things up, your BMR drops, and you flat-line.

From everything I’ve read (and a modicum of common sense), ketosis is not some magic state that does all the work for you. Also, (and Fung et al back this up from what I remember) being “deep in ketosis” is not always as helpful as some may think, and can have its own side effects (irritability, depression, and anxiety included). Throwing the metabolism a curve-ball every once in a while forces the body to remain energy flexible, because it can no longer predict what energy it will get, when it will get it, and from where, much like when we were living a more primal (and unpredictable) life. A challenged metabolism is a more active and effective metabolism. That just makes sense to me. Besides, what’s the worst that can happen? I put on a few that I have to take back off. That’s no worse than the situation I’m finding myself in now, so I think it’s as good a time as any for an experiment.

(Katie) #5

I do not have experience, and my reply is not to say whether or not you should do it, I am merely suggesting that your carbohydrate source is a good one (vitamin-rich, unprocessed). I am thinking things like sweet potatoes, squash, and/or plantains instead of pasta and grains.

(Dom DePlume) #6

(real carbs, not Fruit Loops)

That was stated. A light amount of whole grains, and tubers. I’m not “abandoning ship”, even for a few days. That’s not a helpful experiment: that’s self-sabotage. I chose a whole-grain pasta because of its medium GI action (backed by my post-meal blood check) and easy to digest after 8mo hard keto.

(Dom DePlume) #7

I’m kinda coming at it from these tacks:



(Bunny) #8

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(Sarah Slancauskas) #9

I haven’t done any carb refeeds but I am using targeted carbs to help me with performance in exercise. It really suffered since being keto and this is an unacceptable ‘side effect’. I’m eating sweet potato and tubers with meat about 30-40 minutes before a workout and then an increase in my usual keto friendly carb (spinach/salad etc) plus a protein ball with carbs in. It has transformed my energy during workouts and has given me a general energy boosting effect. A bit different from what you’re doing but just to show you aren’t alone in tweaking things a bit and trialling some different methods.

#10

I do keto and find that after a tough workout I sometimes CANT get satisfied after a full meal. It’s the strangest thing because I’ll top off a full, high fat meal with spoonfuls of ghee and still can’t reach that feeling.

So I experimented and found that 1 - 3 slices of sweet potato (cold - more indigestible carbs) and some almond butter absolutely put the satisfaction factor to rest. I also use a frozen, green banana (again, resistant carbs) with almond butter and that also does the trick, but not as well.

If I am strict keto for a long time with heavy exercise, I get really messed up hunger and fullness signals. It surfaces as a humming type feeling in my throat, which is strange I know but I have hypothyroidism so that could be why.
At any rate, adding a TINY amount of these clean carb sources does the trick for me. I don’t think i would try heavy carb loads as I believe a smaller amount than we could even imagine works for the purposes.
That has been my experience
I’m always in ketosis, even doing this

(Dom DePlume) #11

I like the idea of “targeted carbs”, and I can see the reasoning. Glad it’s working for you.

I did and do feel better after having done this 100g refeed. As of this morning, I’m back in ketosis already, and my blood sugar is back where it should be.