Why do T1 and T2 get hypos?

(Peter minahan) #1

I was T2 and never had an hypo .
If you do hypo surely keto is not for you…or is it?
Why do hypos occur in T1 and T2?

(bulkbiker) #2

Hypo’s mostly occur when people are on medication to lower their blood sugar.
It is quite hard for the body to put itself into a hypo state (impossible maybe?).
I find that if my blood sugars go quite low when fasting they don’t stay there for long.

(AnnaLeeThal) #3

I’m not T2, was borderline with PCOS and insulin resistance, but I struggled with hypoglycemia. Mine was reactive hypoglycemia, meaning I would pump out too much insulin when I ate carbs and it would drop my blood sugar too low. Now that I’m Keto I don’t get that anymore, ever. Not once in 5 months. So Keto is not just for high blood sugar, but think of it a a way to optimize blood sugar.

(Peter minahan) #4

Hi all , I was talking with someone on diabetes.co.uk about intermittent fasting and he said he was taking glicklazide and fears hypos but was very interested in the idea !
So that got me thinking " when I fast , for 5 days, for example I am not supplying my body with sugars. And even when I do eat, only incidental carbs . As I’m a reversed t2
Hba1c = 30 down from 58, and never had an hypo , and as you say a dropping of sugars , what stops my potential hypo?
And really doesn’t stop theirs?

#5

Now this is interesting. A friend of mine is T1. He watches what he eats but from a high carb perspective - so oranges and only a couple of biscuits a day is eating healthily. He mentioned that he had read somewhere about 5 days fasts once a month having great results. I of course leapt on this but suggested maybe I find some sites that go in a bit more gently with IF first. His wife is adamant this wont happen unless the doc says it is OK (doubtful). I feel he is receptive to change so am going to lend him Bernstein’s book. He also has time on his hands as recovering from having pacemaker/defib fitted recently.

She maintains that he takes his insulin and if he doesn’t eat within and hour his blood sugar plummets. Well this makes sense but can he just not take it and fast? Understandably she is worried about him having a bad hypo attack as he has had them before and it scares the crap out of her.

My feeling is that starting with diet would be the better way to go. Getting things normalised as much as possible and then consider fasting. I simply use logic rather than experience though so would value your input.

(bulkbiker) #6

There are some Type 1’s on diabetes.co.uk who follow a very low carb diet and have a correspondingly low level of insulin requirement. So it should be possible… but from what I have read it can be difficult to get the right balance when injecting insulin. I can see where his wife is coming from as she will have to cope with the hypo.
The 5 day fast is the most recent Dr Valter Longo study which was implying that it may even prompt a broken pancreas to start producing its own insulin… but I think that may be a bit optimistic.
I think this is the article from the BBC
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-39070183
Hope that helps.
M

(Peter minahan) #7

This doesn’t answer my question but interesting anyway!

(Eric Sawyer) #8

To put is as simply as I can, T1 and T2 experience hypos because their brain is seeking more energy than it is currently getting. T2s can experience hypos at a blood sugar of 190 if their brains are used to BSs of say for example 350. I have been in nutritional ketosis for 8 months now and my hbA1C is 5.1. My Dr. thinks I have been experience lots of hypos because my BSs have been well below 70 at times. However, since I have been fat adapted, I don’t get hypo until I get below 40. It all depends on what fuel your brain is mainly feeding on and what BSs it’s used to getting. Keto diet will benefit both T! and T2 and both will take less meds as they become more fat adapted and brain becomes more adapted to burning ketones than glucose.

(Peter minahan) #9

Hi ketoT1Diabetic, if you don’t mind me asking how did you achieve the very brave
Thing you did in going keto!
It seems that T1s accept what the doctors say without much question and don’t know where to start with keto.
You prove it can be done!:pray::heart:

(Eric Sawyer) #10

What my doctors were recommending was not helping. So, I had to help myself. My kidney function kept decreasing while doing everything my doctor asked me to do. I really had no choice but to at least try the ketogenic diet.

(Peter minahan) #11

So how did you start? And carry on?
Please is so important !

(Eric Sawyer) #12

Well, I did a lot of research and listened to a lot of people and podcasts. I read the book keto clarity by Jimmy Moore . I read the book the art and science of low carb living by doctors Phinney and Volek. I listen to podcasts like keto talk and Ketovangelist. Not to mention 2 keto dudes. I got a few cookbooks. I set weight goals and blood sugar goals. And since I am diabetic, I started the diet Cold turkey – fully immersing myself. I started out at 20 g of carbohydrate or less per day. I started out at 45 g of protein per day. And about 130 g of fat per day. Right now, I am 5 foot nine and 155 pounds. I was at 220 pounds at one time.

(Eric Sawyer) #13

You have got to do your research and educate yourself. This is not a diet – it’s a lifestyle.

(Peter minahan) #14

Thanks for that , it’s really good to know .
Your insulin-how has that changed from pre keto to now ?
There is some word in the press that a low carb way of eating can , in certain circumstances help the pancreas to function again. What do you think?
Once again thanks for sharing.:pray::heart:

(Todd Allen) #15

I forget the details, but I heard in a podcast with Peter Attia or maybe Dominic D’Agostino about an experiment where somebody in ketosis did a test where they intentionally lowered blood sugar (taking insulin or some other medication, I forget) and found no ill effect as blood sugar dropped and they pushed their blood sugar so low it would have been considered a medical emergency with risk of fatality. I mentioned this during a presurgery consult hoping I could get them not to use the sugar IV they insisted on but failed to persuade them.

Anyway, before I understood what was going on I used to drink a glass of orange juice every two hours as I would crash and feel weak and foggy sometimes dizzy, terribly irritable and sometimes panic if I couldn’t get my fix. Cutting all high glycemic carbs fixed the problem after just a couple rough days. Trying to follow the advice to eat a healthy low fat low salt diet was killing me.

#16

There was a study done by Cahill is referenced on these forums if you search for “Cahill”.

There’s another thread where someone was talking about ketosis and insulin and a more recent article that also discusses extremely low blood glucose and a ketogenic diet.

https://www.ketogenicforums.com/t/no-more-hypos/6867/10?u=billjay

Starvation of Cancer via Induced Ketogenesis and Severe Hypoglycemia

An official citation to an insulin and hypoglycemia study is below, including the link.

Drenick, E. J., Alvarez, L. C., Tamasi, G. C., and Brickman, A. S. (1972). Resistance to symptomatic insulin reactions after fasting. The Journal of clinical investigation, 51(10):2757–62.

(Eric Sawyer) #17

I reduced my insulin intake from 75 units a day to less than 25 units today. In many cases less than 20 units a day. When you limit your food they give you glucose spikes such as carbohydrates and too much protein, you can take much less insulin. I’m not sure about regenerating the pancreas. If something like that does happen, it will simply be an added benefit – something I never expected to happen.

(Peter minahan) #18

Thanks so much I’m so happy and grateful to you for being so open and brave to to go keto! I can only hope others could see the value of keto through you! I for one would not wish diabetes on anybody, and I hope one day you , and many more will have a cure and better life . KCKO! :pray::heart:

(Peter minahan) #19

http://www.cell.com/cell/pdf/S0092-8674(17)30130-7.pdf

(Peter minahan) #20