When 'Eat to Satiety ' is meaningless

#1

I am almost never hungry. not a result of keto . its the same on or off keto and has been for many years. . not that this has stopped me from eating. I can be a stress or boredom eater or someone who eats at mealtimes. Or I can not eat for 2 or 3 days because I am busy and forget. all the same to me.

I have quite a store of energy saved up which I am have not been burning for about 80 lbs worth. But on or off keto, I am not hungry but maybe a couple times a week. I also don’t aways feel full after eating whether I was hungry or not to start with. . so ‘eat to satiety’ is somewhat meaningless to me. Obviously my hormones and appestat are deranged.

I have a sleep disorder and when sleep is good for a few days, my appetite is more normalized but its not a lasting thing. my primary care doc (a well known keto doc) wants me to eat at least 120 g of protein a day - preferably more like 200. the doc is not a fan of fasting but seems to not understand that eat to satiety for me would likely mean 5 or more days of fasting a week. .

I’m not sure how to factor all these variables into an equation of food and groceries and times of eating that makes sense. perhaps I should just set up a proper set of macros and plan menus and eat it. For now, maybe just forget about the ‘eat to satiety and don’t eat if not hungry’ guideline? any one else ?

my BC and AIC are pushing the high end of pre- diabetes and my fasting insulin is too high also. I’m game to reverse these trends but a bit confused on how to proceed even after a year of following the dudes and the science. curious if anyone else does not find eat to satiety and eat when your are hungry to be helpful tenets. thanks.

(Carl Keller) #2

If at all possible, I think addressing the sleep disorder might lead to your hunger and satiety hormones behaving properly. In the meantime, I would probably try to stick to your doctor’s advice as best you can.

I do wish you the best of luck in getting this figured out.

(squirrel-kissing paper tamer) #3

I think if this were me I would set up a meal plan (macros, timing and amounts) and stick with it. Maybe setting a routine in motion would help train your hunger and satiety hormones.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #4

You have to start getting into a routine as @PetaMarie suggested. It might go against the eat when you’re hungry and don’t when you’re not rule but your metabolism seems uniquely deranged and it’s affecting sleep which affects appetite in a vicious circle. Just eat reasonable meals for a while. Irregular eating can also lead to digestive slow down and decreased appetite. Save fasting for later when it’s a conscious choice and you’re fat adapted.

And try to get into a habit of going to bed at about the same time every night. It’s a process, eventually the pattern will stick and you’ll get better sleep Don’t do computer or TV for 45 minutes or more before you go to bed. If you can’t sleep just get into deep relaxation, your body is still getting some rest benefits even if you aren’t sleeping and there will probably be times you drift in and out. I have had sleep disorders for a long time but it’s getting better with this stuff I mentioned. :cowboy_hat_face:

#5

Thanjs. I think will set up a high protein meal plan with regular meal times

The sleep Is not a sleep hygiene issue. Its a circadian rhythm /central apnea/inability to stay asleep for more than 40 minutes combo thing which has perplexed sleep docs for 8 years now I’m sure that worsening bc and insulin performance does not help. The extra weight also adds an obstructive compnent it to the apnea and contributes to aches and pains and physical discomfort which of course does not help sleep. .

I recently started Low dose lithium carbonate 150 g /day . That has made a big difference in circadian rhythm shifting and improved sleep a bit. Though I find myself dreaming about tiramisu and baked bread and I didn’t really have a sweet tooth before the lithium. :slight_smile: hoping it does not make its way into my waking hours

#6

I think this is good advice and I will give it a go. . It’s just counterintuitive to eat when you’re not hungry even if you’re not consciously following the leat when you are hungry and stop when you are full haiku . But its certainly doable.

(Full Metal KETO AF) #7

I hope that you find improvement in your sleep patterns, I used to wake up every couple of hours or more frequently during the night before keto. I would have to eat a few crackers or a piece of toast around 2am or I couldn’t get back to sleep because of limb cramps. That all stopped after carb withdrawal. I sleep longer now and I have been told that I rarely snore anymore, I think the result of less sinus inflammation.

#8

Oh thanks for that info David. I am hoping for similar results. Reducing inflammation and snot is never a bad thing.

#9

@anon8258863
At the risk of mentioning something that might be familiar or obvious to you, you’re careful with morning light as well as evening light?

Blue light in the morning seems to be as important to establishing circadian rhythms as avoiding it at night. I drive my family nuts with lowering all the house lights in the last few hours before bed, but it wasn’t until I started making sure I got bright daylight on my face as early as possible that I felt a definite shift in my sleeping rhythms.

Food early on in the day seems to help as well, so if you follow @PetaMarie’s idea of a daily plan, you might want to start with a relatively high-protein meal early in the day. I know that’s not the norm among keto folks, but it seems to be really good for sleep rhythms to shift our eating such that we’re getting an early morning meal and also closing our eating window several hours (at least) before bed, so basically breakfast and lunch.

You probably know all, this but just in case…

(Full Metal KETO AF) #10

@Madeleine I do this, almost everyday I eat a heavy fatty protein breakfast and it holds me until afternoon when I eat dinner, which has more vegetable content. I don’t eat after dinner or have snacks in between meals. I have read many times a big breakfast and less food later in the day is always best and just shifting the time of meals to earlier in the day will increase weight loss with the same menu. You also sleep better without a bunch of food in your belly. :cowboy_hat_face:

(Cris) #11

We’re kindred spirits, I have never really felt hungry, and I don’t feel full. This is even more prevalent on Keto tho. I just eat whatever my wife gives me, whenever she gives it, and she does love taking care of me so I’m lucky that way. If she’s not around I usually just forget to eat, even for long periods, ouch… But I never did have any health problems and I do love my sleep, so we’re a bit different after all.