What happened with Jimmy Moore at the weekend?

(Stickin' with mammoth) #108

I think this thread may be headed for another ravine.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #109

(a) It depends on what you mean by “work,” and (b) we don’t know whether Mr. Moore is following the diet or not.

(b) But it is undeniable that Mr. Moore used to be quite a bit heavier than he is now, even though he now weighs more than he used to after his first success on the keto diet, so he probably knows something about how a ketogenic diet should work.

Richard Morris, one of the founders of this site, remarked that he’d overheard a participant at Ketofest (a few years ago, now, this was), say something along the lines of “That guy’s so fat, what does he know about weight loss on keto?” Well, Richard said, the guy in question was Tom Seest, who has lost something like a couple of hundred pounds on keto, even though he is still quite large. What is more, Tom has kept off the pounds, too. So he knows quite a bit about losing weight on keto.

(a) You will notice that Richard and Carl Franklin (the other of the Two Keto Dudes) are neither of them skinny. Nor am I, if you were to meet me. But we have all reversed Type II diabetes and a number of other problems, and we have all lost, and kept off, around a quarter of our starting weight.

While it is true that I wouldn’t mind losing a second 80 lbs. (36.3 kg), my primary goal was to heal my metabolism, which I have done. And I have lost enough fat to be able to function in my life again, so no complaints. But to look at me, you’d probably be saying, “Tsk, tsk, that guy really needs to learn about keto.” :grin:

#110

Ketogenesis isn’t a diet per se. It’s a unique metabolism driven by growth hormone contrary to popular belief in the so called keto community. Many people also confuse carnivore metabolism for ketogenic metabolism and intermix these drastically different metabolisms.

The loudmouth did loose weight during his honeymoon phase but gained it back because his way of eating wasn’t ketogenic. He was wasting away as many people do when they attempt to eat excess protein, too little fat and don’t exercise.

Same story with shawn baker and him eating some rice on his carnivore diet to prevent himself from wasting away when attempting to eat nothing but meat.

(Bob M) #111

Ah, I eat a lot of protein and little fat, though I do exercise. Lost 50+ pounds, gained a lot of strength. Though I also was never carnivore.

Jimmy Moore had a bad metabolism. He was doing a show where the doctor on the show put him on certain tweaks. Often, they both did it. They both did a PSMF (low calorie, high protein), and while they both HATED it, only Jimmy got hypoglycemia.

To put that in perspective, I’ve eaten many meals 130g, 160g, 200+ g of protein in the MEAL, and never once found a blood sugar difference. Wore a CGM for over a year. Random sample:

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Another sample:

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Meanwhile, Jimmy Moore also went on a 90% fat diet. Fat, not protein. Got even worse hypoglycemia.

There was (and probably is) something wrong with Jimmy Moore’s metabolism.

(Stickin' with mammoth) #112

And the distinction would be…? I’ve never met a pure carnivore who wasn’t in ketosis. Only dirty carnivores slow dancing with dairy can get out of it, seems.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #113

Actually, and for the record, insulin is a growth hormone, and therefore it is a high-carb diet that is “a unique metabolism driven by growth hormone.” A ketogenic diet is any diet that lowers insulin to the point where (a) the liver is free to make ketone bodies and (b) fatty acids are not trapped inside adipose tissue. That requires insulin to remain pretty much below 25 μU/mL. Since keto and carnivore are both low-carb diets—carnivore being a no-carb diet—they are pretty much the same in their effect on the metabolism, though many people also derive additional health benefits from not eating phytochemicals.

And for the record, I’ve never heard of Shawn Baker eating rice. His diet is mostly steak, with a bit of other meat on occasion. He eats about four pounds (around 2 kg) of meat a day. Most carnivores don’t need that much. As I heard him say at Ketofest a few years ago, “I wouldn’t advise anyone to eat the way I do; I’m a freak.”

As a final note, anyone who attempts to eat low-fat and low-carb simultaneously is going to suffer from an energy deficit, and his or her body will turn to muscle protein as a source of energy. A high-protein diet can work, but only if it provides enough energy in addition to the protein. Since the two energy sources the body prefers are glucose and fatty acids, one or the other must be present in sufficient quantity in the diet to supply the body’s energy needs. And we know the problems that result from too much carbohydrate, so that means getting sufficient fat.

(Stickin' with mammoth) #114

Not when you mainline cheddar cheese at every meal. Don’t ask me how I know.

(Robin) #115

Could be worse. Could be slow carnivores dirty dancing.

#116

According to https://showbizcorner.com/

“Jimmy Moore has been charged for 7 counts of sexual relations with a minor (13-15 years old)”

(Ethan) #117

Yes. Hearing was today . Supposedly, he requested a continuation to June 16. We will see what happens as the case unfolds. Not much else is clear

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #118

It’s a messy situation, and I don’t believe anything will be accomplished by discussing it, sorry.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) closed #119