Total Carbs - Fiber - sugar alcohol? = net carbs


(Matt) #1

Trying to figure out net carbs.
Total carbs minus fiber minus certain sugar alcohols = net carbs

BUT WHAT ABOUT SUGAR itself?

I am in Canada so the label says Sugars and Sugar Alcohols
I got some Slimfast something or others.
Carbs 10g - 6g fiber = 4g per 20g cluster
1g sugar
2g sugar alcohol
Ingredients are not good
Caramel [[[[[inulin, soluble corn fiber, glycerin, water, palm kernel oil, cram, milk proten concentrate, butter (cream, salt), soy lecthin, natural flavors, mct oil (cocunut), stevia extract]]]]
choc coating (chocolate, erythitol, inulin, cocao butter, milk, soy lechtin, vanilla, salt, stevia extrat), peanuts.


PS, I half assed the Keto diet, went from 380lbs and hit a wall at 320lbs but broke through it now at 291lbs in a year. Watching youtube, doing the tricks, bland same food forces me to eat less, 18/6, one meal and a snack.

Zero sugar
Zero flour (bread, pasta)
Zero fruit

sure helped termendously, it was hard at first, lots of running to the bathroom

Plan is to get to 250lbs which I will then go to complex starches, more vegetables, little meat and stick with the no sugar, no four, no fruit.


(Laurie) #2

Congratulations on your progress. I’m not sure what you’re asking here. Are you wondering where the “sugar” is in the Slimfast ingredients?


(Marianne) #3

I’m glad you are doing so well. Ninety pounds lost and maintained is incredible. Obviously, you are doing a lot of things right to have achieved this.

The only thing that caught my attention is that you find your food monotomous and bland. My husband and I eat a lot of the same things over and over in a rotation but still find those things satisfying and delicious. We are fortunate to naturally prefer fat over anything else. Eating predominantly meat and just a few steamed vegetables with salt, butter or bacon grease (or a salad with homemade blue cheese dressing) removed the carb cravings completely while still being delicious. Now we are zero carb and still find that satisfying with a lot of variety.

I’d stay away from any processed “keto” foods. If I were to eat them, I’m afraid they would be too similar to processed comfort foods I used to love and want to binge on. When I’m hungry before dinner, I’ll eat like some chicken legs or thighs and dip the meat in mayo - delicious! Scrambled eggs or egg salad is also a delicious choice. I think something like that would hold you better than a Slim Fast bar.

Good luck on your continuing journey!


#4

remember too WHO you are on fake sugar sub alcohols means the world in a way.

we mostly want some sweet but at what compromise.

Malitol is usually the runs for most.
That nasty Asparatme stuff is giving people tons of issues.

SO just saying watch you on it and how your body reacts to ‘all this natural OH SO great for you ‘kcal free’ stuff in life’ and just if you are one who does ok, more power to you :slight_smile:

just sayin’ on it all cause it worked so against me in my guts that I wasn’t one who did well on any of it.

Net carbs are a very personal joke to me. COUNT all in real carbs is how I came in but it was personal again that I required it, but many can do net carbs and be ok…just saying find you in it all and hoping you do ok thru your journey!


(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #5


23%20AM

PS: I’m in Canada. My understanding is that if Sugar is listed as a specific carbohydrate then it’s added refined sugar - ie sucrose and/or fructose. It’s not part of some food component, like fructose in fruit.

PPS: The list of ingredients is organized by greatest to least and the first 3-4 ingredients are the major components. In your Slimfast example, the primary ingredient is Caramel Inulin, which is a so-called ‘non-refined’ ‘natural’ sugar. The corn fiber is non-nutritional filler. It’s indigestible like other fibers but because it’s ‘soluble’ it dissovles in the intestinal fluid and becomes gelatinous during the digestion process. There is some evidence that it can ferment and/or feed colonic gut bacteria. Whether this is good, bad or indifferent is debatable. Glycerine is a sugar alcohol. Water is water.

So Slimfast is basically a nutritionless sweetener. Are you using this as a meal substitute? Or a meal supplement? In my opinion you could make something far better than this stuff. I do and add it to my morning coffee. Of course, it wouldn’t be quite as conveniet as scooping a spoonful out of container or drinking a bottle of liquid. But I think well worth it.

PPPS: I suggest you drop the idea of going to so-called complex starches and more veggies. Chemically, ‘carbohydrate’ is just another name for sugar. The only difference between ‘simple’ and ‘complex’ is how long it takes to get to your blood stream as glucose. In my opinion so-called ‘above ground’ and/or ‘leafy vegetables’ are so nutrient dilute that they’re not worth the effort. But if you think you must eat something or other, I recommend bok choy and/or baby bok choy. You get a lot more nutritional bang for your carb buck.


(Take time to smell the bacon) #6

In the nutrition panel, U.S. law requires all sugar to be mentioned in the amount, and now they seem to make a point of mentioning added sugar, which is helpful. In the ingredients list, it’s what you said. If fruit is an ingredient, the sugar in the fruit is not mentioned, but any added sugar is.


(Laurie) #7

Not correct, in Canada anyway. Fir example, the ingredients in my Pace’s Picante Sauce are

water
crushed tomato concentrate
jalapeno peppers
fresh onions
white vinegar
dehydrated onions
salt
dehydrated garlic
flavor.

Sugar is not an ingredient. But the nutrition label shows 3 grams of “sugars” from the tomatoes, onions, and peppers. There are also “sugars” in my unsweetened yogurt, etc.


#8

Correct, Total - Fiber - Sugar Alcohols, so your math is right. Pretty sure the labels in Canada are the same as here in the US that way, I know there was something that I kept buying that was Canadian and that label seemed to be the same thing as ours (minus the french stuff LOL) so must be the same rules, because I know when you buy European stuff there’s usually another label stuck on it so you have both the original and a US style one. In Europe I know that are already at Net carbs. Actual sugar counts 100%. Those ingredients really aren’t that bad. Some people flip out at the corn fiber… eh. I don’t.

The complex carbs give me zero issues (I do CKD/TKD) but simple carbs still require me to be locked out of my kitchen for my own safety a couple hours later. Still fires up that part of my binge brain. Why little meat? You need that protein. At your weight you have way more muscle than you think, don’t lose any more than you have to, it’s a driver of your metabolic rate, last thing you want is it being any lower than it has to be. The calorie trap is no fun! Trust me from experience there!

Also, 380 to 291? Nothing half assed about that! Congrats! I went from 300 to 190 at one point and screwed myself bad at about the 220 mark, almost a year there because I refused to pull my head out of my backside and pay attention to what I was doing to myself. Now I’m back up to 230 for now, but at 10% bodyfat so it’s cool (this time) but the joints aren’t exactly happy with it… Stupid joints!


(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #9

The sauce thickens! Following from the USDA, but most likely applicable to Canada. You’re right about the ‘added sugar’. There’s nothing in the list of ingredients that says SUGAR. However, it remains to be seen whether it’s from the tomatoes, onions or an ‘other’ source.

PACE HOT PICANTE SAUCE

Carb Amount
Total Carbohydrate, by difference * 6.67 g
Fiber, total dietary 3.3 g
Sugars, total including NLEA ** 3.33 g

Ingredients: CRUSHED TOMATOES (WATER, CRUSHED TOMATO CONCENTRATE), WATER, JALAPENO PEPPERS, ONIONS, DISTILLED VINEGAR, DEHYDRATED ONIONS, SALT, GARLIC, NATURAL FLAVORING.
Source / All Pace Sauces - Select Branded Foods

  • * In the United States and Canada, carbohydrate values are calculated using what is called “carbohydrate by subtraction.” This means that when a food is chemically analyzed in a lab, the grams of protein, fat, alcohol, water, and ash are subtracted from the total gram weight of the sample, and the amount left over is considered the carbohydrate value. Using this method, the carbohydrate value contains sugars, starch, and fiber , and may also contain small amounts of other compounds that do not fit specifically in one of the other assays. This carbohydrate value is used in food composition tables and for nutrition labeling in the U.S. and Canada. Source

  • ** Nutrition Labeling and Education Act (USA) See this for an explanation.


(Matt) #10

I was asking about Sugar on the label, is it added or subtracted, but thats been answered.
Total Carbs
minus
Fiber
minus
Sugar Alcohol dependending on what it is but also depending on if it increases YOUR glucose
ADD
Sugar

Literally every video on YT does not mention it, but like the one person posted. I will have to read it again but “Sugar” is apart of Total Carbs. I will have to confirm whats been posted.

I used to always just go by total carbs which is what I still do, but I watch a lot of Youtube, mostly doctors, some non doctors. I do what makes sense, and what makes sense to me is still going by total carbs.

US vs Canada food labels are slightly different, I don’t know what they are.
Are the ingredients in Canada listed from most to least, probably.

I still have a sweet tooth, packaged Keto treats are expensive. I keep pumping myself up to make my own.
I tell ya the quantity I eat has diminished. I had some Keto cookies, bland as can be but I scarfed them down. Tried cauliflower pizza crust, didnt happen just stuck. To much clean up, to much work.

The rational for eating bland boring food is a calorie restrictive mind game or the Millennials will say “hack”
I eat less if I eat the same meals every day. I pretty much did that from the very beginning, with a lot of cheat days, 1x a week, fasting helps mitigate that I think.
The same tricks can be played by using a smaller plate, smaller glasses to drink from to fool the brain into thinking your eating more.

Its weird, I carb loaded 4-5 days ago, 3 slices of bread, 3 cookies and something else at night, 10pm.
I bounced to 309lbs from 291 and took 3 days to get back to 291lbs (today) with massive calorie restriction and 24hr fast, eating at 4pm only. I’m really going for it now, taking multi-v, omega 3, VC and D. I will probably carb load big time with pizza and desert at 270lbs then jump back into Keto.
Which is another aspect, keeping the body on edge because it has no idea when your eating next or what food. Some of the Keto YT’ers talk about that, but spiking glucose for long periods, 4 meals a day with snacks is no good, thats engrained in me me now.

I dont have diabetes, its just when I cant wipe my bum or tie my shoe laces, its time. I told myself if I go beyond 300lbs I will diet, never happened decade(s) ago. I lost my gut, and I learned my butt is smaller and my face is slimmer.

So 291lbs is another wall I am hitting. I think it could be due to not working out, or simply the macro’s arent right, not hitting 80/15/5 or whatever.
Like I said I dont count nothing. Figure a portion of meat (hand with fingers) size, Chia, Butter, EVOO, Coc Oil.

The protein post got me thinking.
Yeah I’ve been thinking I need more protein, meats. Watched a dozen of the vegan videos, and it scared me but I clued in right away, they are animal lovers, environment lover scare tactics, but can’t discount complex carbs, but like anything, everything in moderation. The interesting angle on that is farming kills tons of animals, so the YT’ers say.

I find it hard to figure out proper portion sizes and to count, how to achieve 75-80/10-15/10
I watched one video on it but cant find it.
My un"researched" mind says a whole hand of meat, half an inch thick with added fats, evoo, c.o., butter.

I never bothered with grass fed, but just learned about the toxicity of veges so try my best to get organic celery, peppers etc.


(Take time to smell the bacon) #11

The word “sugar,” when it is used in a nutrition panel, is part of the amount of “carbohydrate” listed. You do not subtract or add the amount of sugar from or to the carbohydrate number, regardless of whether the label is from North America or from Europe. The amount is listed simply for your information.

So whether the “carbohydrate” number is total carbohydrate (North America) or net carbohydrate (Europe), the amount shown includes the amount of sugar in the the product, whether that sugar was naturally found in the ingredients, or whether it was added to the product separately. It also includes the amount of sugar alcohols, but not the amount of non-sugar sweeteners.

Just to reiterate, in North America, if you wish to count total carbohydrate, you use the “carbohydrate” number as given. If you wish to count net carbohydrate, you subtract the number for the fibre and subtract whatever percentage of the sugar alcohol number you feel comfortable subtracting.

In Europe, if you wish to count net carbohydrate, you use the “carbohydrate” number as given. If you wish to count total carbohydrate, your add in the number for the fibre. What you would do about the sugar alcohol content is anybody’s guess.