Question about hospital food - advice would be very welcome 🙏

(icky) #1

Hi @all

I’m currently in hospital because I may need surgery for a slipped disc.

There’s no Keto food available here, so I’m just doing my best to get by on a “normal” hospital diet, for the days I’m here.

My question is this: If I’ve suddenly switched from Keto to a “normal” carb-based diet in hospital, could I be retaining water and getting bloated from that?

Because one of the symptoms I’m meant to be watching out for regarding the impinged nerves in my back are whether I’m passing water and poop normally.

If I’m not, that can be a sign that the nerves are dangerously impinged and that surgery is needed to rectify the issue.

I am passing much less urine than usually and haven’t had a bowel movement in 2 and a half days now… Which has got the Dr’s concerned that the nerves to my bladder and bowel may be impinged, now.

But could it just be the sudden switch to the hospital carby food? That I’m retaining water and constipated from “just that” ???

Thank you for your thoughts and advice!

I really don’t want to undergo unnecessary spinal surgery, if bladder and bowel are simply being affected by the hospital food !!!

(Robin) #2

Obviously, I have no medical opinion. Doubtful tho if it’s the change in diet. But be sure to tell them about your normal keto diet.
When I was in the hospital it was for colon surgery, so obviously that impacted (lol) my poop issues. The hospital menu was atrocious.
I ordered in thanks to my hubby.

Good luck!

(icky) #3

Thanks @robintemplin :blush:

I saw your posts about your surgery…! How are you going now? Are you fully-ish recovered? Has the surgery been a success?

(Robin) #4

Yes, very successful and my healing is ahead of schedule. No complications. Still sore, but to be expected. I’m extremely thankful to have this behind me.

You’ll get there too. Disc issues are so painful. Hope they can take care of it for you.
All the best.

(icky) #5

That’s great to hear! What a relief when a medical issue causing distress for years is finally resolved!

And thank you! I’m curious how this will continue on Monday… Apparently the hospital is “down” in weekend mode now and all regular, non-emergency treatment only resumes on Monday… Until then it’s just lots of rest, pain meds and carby food :sweat_smile:

(Geoffrey) #6

Depending on how strict you were on keto I could see where your high carb hospital diet could affect your gut biome and cause issues.
A high carb diet will definitely cause inflammation in the body and that could very well be your issue.
I’ve had a protruding compressed disk in my back for 30 years and in the past ten years spinal stenosis and even after surgery I still suffered. It got so bad that I couldn’t walk very far.
I had no idea all of my pain and disability was due to inflammation. Within 90 days of being carnivore I was able to walk and bend like I hadn’t been able to do in 20 years.
I’ve often thought about what I’d do if I’m ever hospitalized again and I’ve decided that I will not compromise my diet for the poison they feed in the hospital.
I hope you and your doctors can figure this out for you without having surgery.
Good luck.

(KM) #7

Ugh, sorry to hear you’re in the hospital! Always seems like the least likely place to get well. :frowning: Hang in there!

There is this: if you have been really strict about your keto diet, you won’t have any glycogen/water stored. So yes, basically the opposite of the very fast water weight loss that occurs when a person starts keto can happen when “big carbs” are added back in. I have “gained” up to four pounds from a weekend of carb after strict keto.

Even so, I’m not sure this would contribute to either reduced urine or constipation if you are consuming adequate liquid. This could be a completely different issue, as your doctors suggest, but what happens when you just up the fluid consumption?

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #8

I’ve been reading about this. Both ways (keto to Carb or Carb to Keto. Biome for most peps could be an issue.

(icky) #9

I’m drinking sooo much water… To test my bladder function… I can pee, but it seems very little/ slow compared to usual.

And I’m drinking lots of coffee here, cos that always keeps me “regular” at home… But the nurses reckon the coffee here is pretty crap (close to de-cafinated) so that I shouldn’t be concerned about coffee not having its “usual” effect on me…

I dunno… I guess I have to just keep observing it and report it back to the nurses and doctors.

And wait and see what the MRI results are on Monday…

I’m glad I realised that the change from strict Keto to hospital carb crap may be a factor in water retention and irregular bowel movements, tho… that I don’t necessarily have to be freaking out about it being impinged bladder and bowel nerves…

(KM) #10

Whenever I’m away from home my bowel function is different. I tend to leave a small deposit of rabbit pellets in every bathroom I come across.

(Alec) #11

IMHO, adding back carbs will definitely cause you to retain water. When we fast or go low carb at first most people get an initial water weight drop… well, this is the reverse, and I think you’ll get a water weight jump, and that’s the muscle glycogen holding onto water.

(Alec) #12

This original question leads me to remember when my son had an operation at an Australian hospital… I took him to the hospital, stayed there while they operated, and then spent time with him in the recovery ward before we left (same day, later in the evening).

What I remember most is the atrocious food they offered him: orange juice (reconstituted), jam sandwich, jelly, crackers, biscuits… all absolutely terrible for you. He was in severe need of protein and fat to kick start the healing process, but there was just carbs (bad carbs). I am sure they thought it was very healthy. They have NO idea.

#13

Can you order in? Some hospitals prior to Covid used to allow that. Can a family member bring you food? Maybe even bring an insulated bag, get ice from the nurses? The hospital food can be ok and it can be a disgrace. Wondering why they cannot serve you eggs, chicken, cream and so on?

Each pound of fat is accompanied by water so that may be the reason and the reason so much water weight is lost initially. Coffee is dehydrating so do not count it as part of your water consumption

Ok this will be way TMI but I have the same thing but normally. When I am sticking to keto I have a lot of days of that and then after about 5 days I have a day that is the opposite. Any idea what causes that? Definitely not something I had 10 years ago preKeto

#14

When my son was in the hospital last year I was pleasantly surprised to see their menu offered low-carb alternatives, marked with a low carb icon. It’s slowly starting to resonate.

If they hadn’t had that, I was prepared to guide him in ordering eggs, just the meats no gravy, sandwich without the bread but served on lettuce leaves, broth soups, plain broth, salads, and sugar free jello if they had it (they did.) Is there any way you can do that for the remainder of your stay? They have whole food staples handy in their kitchens to make what’s on their menu so they should be able to serve special requests.

I’ve been many places that have a predominately high carb menu and still I manage to order the least carb alternatives and avoid anything with sugar or overly refined grains or chemicals. You can’t go wrong with a salad, eggs, and/or just the meat.

I’d question the efficacy of any hospital that only offers sugar-ladened, empty carbs. With such a lack of nutritional understanding how can I trust their other supposed expertise? It’s lazy to pass it off to nutritionists to deal with since a diet does interfere with medicines, procedures, and our body’s response to anything they are doing.

Anyway, good luck to you! I myself avoided the constant referrals to back surgeries for over 30 years. (3 herniated discs, two lower one upper.) I used physical therapy and then regular training in the gym instead and it has done more than any medical intervention ever did or could have. No more steroidal injections either. Found out they are bad over the long run for a short reprieve of pain.

Now I’m fighting against osteoporosis and age-related degenerative disc diseases. The best I can do is put all available time and money into staying fit and being consistent with weight training and muscle development. I hired a trainer with money that would have been spent on surgeries.

#15

The food in hospitals, top hospitals is scary. Had a friend with a recent stay. Spouse brought in meals and they are not keto anyway. An older relative was recovering from heart surgery a few years ago. What they considered heart healthy was equally ridiculous. I would not read too much into it, simply that some doctors who run hospitals have not learned about nutrition in medical school and do not consider nutrition (other than overeating, or saturated fat and processed meat) to have any real ability to change health

I have been avoiding anything with artificial sweeteners lately as they negatively affect the microbiome based on what I have been reading. I still will use stevia (never liked it), allulose and erythritol (have dogs so no xylitol). I do not see a change but hoping it is helping

(icky) #16

Low carb isn’t an option for me in this hospital… Nor is ordering in or getting anyone to bring me meals.
So I’m simply not going to stress about it and just get back to low carb once I’m out of hospital.

The only thing that matters for me right now is whether the change in diet is affecting my fluid retention and my bowel movements. I just need to get those effects sorted out from any possible nerve impingement re bladder and bowels.

Given that that’s way, way more important than what food I eat this week, I’m going to focus my energy and my stress where I need it to be and not get fussed about whether hospitals are still serving standard diets… Especially as, if they weren’t, then 90% of the patients would be completely confused and refuse to eat the non-standard diets served them… Society has a long way to go re health nutrition and hospitals are part of society, so I’m not going to go around randomly blaming them…

I’m grateful for the medical treatment I’m receiving and I’m judicious about picking what medical treatment I seek and consent to and about educating myself about my choices.

(KM) #17

I honestly don’t know. I assumed when I travel it’s stress - even good exciting stress is still stress, after all. But it could actually be a change in diet, drinking less water although I don’t realize it, or just routine / timing that’s off. Annoying, popping into every loo in creation and then basically saying (yes, yes, TMI, I say it to myself!) “ah, nope, never mind”.

(KM) #18

That’s kind of what I was thinking. It’s a shame they’re not at least Offering healthier options, but it’s a partnership, I think it’s understandable no one wants to offer a better mousetrap if people won’t use it. My mother’s been in hospital a lot, and her main complaints are that they don’t serve what she likes - liverwurst on pumpernickel. I have a hard time imagining how that would go over!

How’s it going? Are your levels still off?

(icky) #19

Right… back home after almost a week of hospital crappola…

I think I’m gonna try and fast for a week to reset my system…

#20

If you feel that’s best for you…
Whenever I eat too much carbs, I want FAT galore! :slight_smile: Somehow fat balances out things nicely. I was into black coffee too when I was sugar poisoned…
And I can’t fast anyway (but I hope one day I get it back).

I usually miss my freedom at home after just one day eating off. The hospital was fine as I wasn’t sick and could go to a supermarket (and relatives are to bring food in that situation anyway). And it was before keto and my body is sturdy enough.
I couldn’t really survive Australian hospital food though - if I didn’t choose to eat a tiny part of it, it’s not some low-cal stuff like here.
I saw some hospital food around the world, some countries do it way better than others. We are probably in the middle but luxury wise on the bottom :smiley: You have problems with dairy? A slice of white bread is your breakfast and dinner (if not, you get some low-level almost-cheese too). Wholemeal if you have diabetes. And something special for specific problems where bread would be an obviously huge medical failure, that’s good. Lunch is proper cooked food with soup, that’s okay (well the meat is super tiny but the budget must be way lower than for people living on half minimal wage and that is pretty low here). Sure, not all hospitals are the same but it’s very typical. And people say one barely eats in hospital anyway. Well, the sick ones, I was just injured and functioned properly. But we don’t get a TON of sugar and a ton of calories every day, that’s the Australian style, apparently. Surely the American too. We don’t get cakes here :slight_smile: Or Milo with extra sugar(!)…