Not new to KETO, but new to these Ketone Levels - HELP!

(Canaan Perry) #1

Hi, sorry if this is covered already somewhere, but I’ll take the chastising in exchange for an answer or comforting response…
This is probably my 7th or 8th time going on the KETO diet. In the past I have been on it, practicing probably what is considered dirty keto and having mediocre results. I have a blood test meter and have never gotten obove 1.8 or so.
I’ve been off of my diet since spring due to lockdown and a case of the f-its. Last week I started again by fasting for 3 days with protein shakes, bone broth, and lots of water. Two days after my first meal, I measured by blood and it was 3.2 - a number I have never achieved before… next day was 3.4. Today, I measured in the evening (around the same time as the previous attempts) and it was 4.2!
I have read that “nutritional ketosis” is between .5 and 3 so I’m a little concerned that my numbers are 1. already above that and 2. rising. I am sticking to a relatively simple diet of salad with blue cheese dressing along with some bacon bits, avacado slices, etc… butter coffees in the morning with MCT capsules. This is the same routine I have always used.
My question is - 1. why in the world is this attempt yielding 5x more results than previous attempts with most known metrics being consistent between attempts and 2. why is my level increasing, beyond what is generally considered beneficial for weight loss, and 3. what can I do to curb my ketone level to go back down to optimal nutritional ketone levels, or is this even something I need to be worrying about?

Thank you very much for reading!

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #2
(Allie) #3

Don’t chase numbers. Blood ketone levels have no correlation with how much body fat you’re burning.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #4

You’ve probably seen Volek’s and Phinney’s famous chart of the levels of ketosis. As it indicates, they define “nutritional ketosis” as beginning around 0.5 mmol/L of serum β-hydroxybutyrate, and going up to around 3.0. “Fasting ketosis” is characterised by levels of β-hydroxybutyrate that are somewhat higher than that, and the risk for ketoacidosis begins to be a concern around 10.0 (although Dr. Phinney says that symptoms don’t generally start until β-hydroxybutyrate reaches the neighbourhood of 20.0).

That your β-hydroxybutyrate level reached fasting levels is not particularly surprising. Ketone levels vary a lot. If you were exercising, that could explain the higher level, or it could just be the result of your particular metabolism. Also, I would expect your readings to drop at some point, if you continue on a ketogenic diet for a while. As we go on, the liver seems to get a bit better at matching production to consumption. (Not only that, but as the muscles re-adapt to metabolising fatty acids, they stop needing ketones, so the liver doesn’t need to produce as much.) In many people, β-hydroxybutyrate readings can get very low, and yet we know they have to be in ketosis, because (a) they aren’t eating carbohydrate, and (b) they aren’t dead.

Dr. Phinney states in a fairly recent video that, while they think they see more benefits from a reading of 1.0 than from 0.5, readings above 1.0 don’t appear to confer any particular added benefit. So he tells patients not to try to chase particular ketone readings. Remember that your blood ketone reading is a measure of the gap between production and consumption. But it’s the best indicator we have of what’s going on.

(Canaan Perry) #5

Sounds like great advice from all, thank you very much. My previous readings were all taken in the evening, probably at least an hour or two after dinner. This morning about an hour after waking, I measured at 2.7, so that’s a bit reassuring that it’s not continuing to climb. I think I will measure less and just keep an eye on the scale and watch how I feel.

Thanks again!

(Bob M) #6

Actually, they probably will climb. My lowest ketones (and highest blood sugar) are always in the morning; my highest ketones (and lowest blood sugar) are always in the evening.

#7

No such thing. Your ketone levels and rate of fat loss aren’t connected. I lost 100lbs and without fasting rarely ever hit 1.0. Only thing I can think of since you used a lot of protein shakes that you cranked up your metabolism to metabolize it. Protein takes a lot of horsepower to digest and our metabolisms respond to that. I lost a lot more when I went higher protein than I did when I was intentionally trying to keep it low. Also, MCTs artificially raise your ketone levels. So when your using them you can’t take your readings at face value.

(Scott) #8

Going two years now and converted to carnivore four months ago and have yet to measure anything but my weight once daily.

#9

" by fasting for 3 days with protein shakes, bone broth, and lots of water"
Is that fasting?

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #10

Actually, I’ve heard a well-formulated ketogenic diet described as being just like fasting, but without the hunger.

I don’t do hunger well, which is why I like keto.