My "Back to Basics" adventure

#1

This past Christmas my husband gifted me a KetoMojo. I used it a few times, and always my ketones were low. Frustrating, but I’ve been told my body is just more efficient at making/using them and has fewer to waste. Makes sense.

Then I ran across a video by Carnivore’s Angel where she shares her talk with Dr. Bozworth and was advised to reduce her protein, raise her fat consumption and keep her carbs below 20 total. I had been consuming a high amount of fatty protein while keeping my carbs below 20. Dr. Boz told her, (Carnivore’s Angel), that she wasn’t in ketosis because she was eating so much protein. She tested and had very low ketones, barely registering any.

I decided to apply that advice to myself since I have been gaining fat this year and my own ketones had been registering very low (.2 - .5). It’s still early in testing, but I have found that when I reduce my protein (1 gram of protein to 1 lb of desired body weight goal) and fill up on fat, my ketones have increased steadily. I’m only a few days in, but am finding this very intriguing and will continue to see if it results in fat loss.

Anyone else have a similar experience? I know one size doesn’t fit all, but I suspect that because I started out (almost 4 years ago) at over 350 lbs and was certainly diabetic (although undiagnosed) I may be more sensitive to protein.

(Marianne) #2

Very interesting. Does Carnivore’s Angel have a webpage or Youtube? I have often wondered what is a good carnivore forum.

What does a typical day of eating look like for you? My meals consist of fatty meat, or lean meat supplemented with ghee or bacon grease, eggs, some cheese. My carbs are virtually zero, but I have no idea if I am consuming too much protein.

#3

She does have a YouTube webpage: https://www.youtube.com/c/CarnivoresAngel/videos, has a Facebook group, and has free and paid groups: https://carnivores-angel.mn.co/feed

She used to be Carnivore until very recently, but is still very, very low carb. The Dr.Boz protocol she is following is supposed to work with Carnivore or Keto.

This protocal is what I used when I started Keto and lost 190 lbs, then I began adding more protein and fat. Loved it, but gained fat! So, I’m going back to basics. :smile:

Carnivore’s Angel’s sites are very welcoming, friendly and helpful.

#4

Of course they will, the higher the fat, the higher the ketones, that’s known. That’s why the medical (the real) ketogenic diet is like 90% fat.

It won’t. Ketone levels have nothing to do with rate of fat loss, this is very well proven. This started two ways, the first way is people starting keto and having off the charts ketones at first, and losing a ton of retained water and calling it “weight” instead of fat, which is minimal at that point.

The second is Phinneys stupidity with his make believe “nutritional ketosis” and telling people that 0.5 is some magical number that actually matters.

On the protein consumption, don’t go by desired body weight, don’t even say desired bodyweight. Desired body COMPOSITION! Do you want to hit a weight on the scale that doesn’t matter slightly faster because you’ve lost lean mass? Which will also result in a lowered RMR which makes it not only harder to keep losing, but much easier to regain?

Short version: Your ketones levels don’t matter, and GNG from protein is just shy of BS! Unless you’re trying to break meat eating records, you’re not going to cause that. You’ll know when you do because the feeling of proteins being burned as fuel is unmistakable, it’s the meat sweats.

Something about your macros isn’t/wasn’t right for you, that’s all it it/was.

Looked into Dr Boz, great when a Doc is into keto, but she’s more into selling overpriced rebranded supplements, and video training. That’s not much better than Berg, at least she’s a Medical Doc, but still. Be iffy with that stuff.

#5

Thanks for your thoughts! I DO like Dr. Boz, but realize we all have a different perspective on different Keto personages.

I follow a lot of people on YouTube; Dr. Berry, Dr. Nadir Ali, DR. Shawn Baker, Dr. Shawn Baker, Dr. Shrah Zaldivar, and many others. I glean what I can where I can.

Dr. Boz does sell supplements, but she doesn’t push them on everyone. My take on it is she is all about using them only for the most difficult transitions and for people with severe health issues trying to transition into keto. As for her courses, she encourages people who buy them to share them with everyone they know, family and friends. She has a right to make a living off her knowledge. I have never purchased her courses as interesting as the brains course sounds.

Anyway, according to her, the number you get when you divide glucose by ketones is important. A number under 80 = weight loss; under 40 = repair of immune system and a solid chance of autophagy; under 20 = goal for cancer patients and those trying to heal from severe disease and best chance of autophagy. This last level, she says, you need to be under the care of a doctor.

So I am trying to see if keeping my numbers under 80 does indeed bring weight loss. I realize that since I’ve been keto for so long, my ketones register low because, I presume, I am using them. So I’m not sure how that affects everything.

I want to STOP gaining body fat. Honestly, I love eating meat and refuse to go hungry.

(Bob M) #6

Both @lfod14 and I like higher protein, lower fat, and have experienced benefits with this. However, if you really are gaining fat, you might considered looking into Amber O’Hearn’s idea of eating fat first, then protein.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #7

In his defence, however, and granting that 0.5 is somewhat arbitrary, there are benefits to having circulating ketone bodies that are unrelated to their use as fuels for the body. Both acetoacetate and β-hydroxybutyrate have epigenetic effects, for example. Phinney says that β-hydroxybutyrate in the range of 0.5-1.0 seems to have the most benefits; below that, not so much (though the fat-adapted athletes he studied all seem to have β-hydroxybutyrate lower than 0.5, so I’m not so sure what’s up with that), and above 1.0 doesn’t seem to confer any additional benefit.

I expect that our thinking on this will change as we learn more about the proper human diet and its effects.

#8

Thanks, Paul, for your comments. I always appreciate your knowledge.

One of the reasons I’m doing this is that I was eating higher, fatty protein and my blood glucose was getting higher than I expected while my ketones were often very, very low. This is just a trial, to see if it makes any difference and how my body responds.

#9

Glucose numbers have been better, but mostly in the afternoon. Morning numbers have been under 100, usually under 80 in the mornings. Afternoon numbers get down as low as 60’s and occasionally down to upper 50’s. Not sure I like numbers that low, but it doesn’t seem to bother me.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #10

Under 80 is perfect. And getting down to 50 is not a problem, so long as you have ketones available to feed your brain. And obviously you do, since you are not feeling hypoglycaemic.