Long term Keto and ketones

[GreeneggsNham]

Hello all. I don’t post much anymore, but I’ve been a member on this forum for a few years and read the posts every day. I’ve been eating this way since the fall of 2018.

This past Christmas I received a Keto-Mojo, something I would have loved to have had a few years ago. I’m not sure how useful it will be to me at this point.

Since I have regained a bit of the weight I originally lost (about 20 - 25 lbs), it might help me to figure out if I’ve slipped somewhere. I have been more sedentary, so that is likely part of the problem. I’ve also started using Stevia sweetener or Monkfruit sweetener in my tea or drinks. I will test if that is raising my insulin and lowering ketones. My perception is that I consume fewer carbs now then when I first started this way of eating, but I am going to monitor that more closely as well.

I’ve only used it a few times. My ketones have been .4 or even .3 and my blood glucose tends to be in the 80’s or 90’s. I’m not specific about the numbers as it has been a week or more and I don’t remember the specifics, but I’m sure I used it a few times mornings and a few times before lunch (usually around 3 pm).

I intend to try it out again later today after going shopping, and before and after my first meal. Perhaps I should also try it before and after I drink something sweetened with Stevia.

Anyway, I have searched this forum and online and on Youtube. Most of what I find seems to be for new Ketoers (word?), and not as much for long term Ketoers.

Any suggestions on the best time of day to test? I want to use the test strips I currently have carefully so as not to waste them and gain the best info. If you know of any really good resources I might learn from (for longer term ketoers), I would appreciate the info. In the mean time, I’ll keep researching.

Thanks!

[amwassil]

This is a phenomenon noted by many long term folks, including me. I have also wondered what’s going on and why. Here’s at least a partial explanation:

What are optimal blood glucose levels for ketosis?

You may also find the following dialogue helpful:

Does a healthy ketogenic diet cause irreversible insulin resistance?

My question is ‘what might limit ketogenesis in long-term fat adapted individuals?’ A secondary related question is it something to be concerned about? Do we just go with the flow and accept it as a natural outcome? KCKO, etc. The experience of greatly reduced ketones after being on keto for several years and presumably fat adapted has been noted by multiple posters here on the forum. This is going to be a long post. So I shall break it up into pieces. This is the first piece. Let’s first get…

Then:

• here
• here
• here

This is a topic of some interest to me since I’m older and have been convinced - at least so far - that the older one gets the more beneficial to brain health ketones become. So I wonder if declining ketones indicates a problem or not. The current mainstream paradigm is that the brain can derive up to about 2/3 or maybe as much as 3/4 of its energy requirement from ketones, but some energy must always be derived from glucose. Dr. Ben Bikman, on the other hand, finds no physiological reason to prevent the brain running on 100% ketones if available. Ketones are, in fact, the brain’s preferred fuel and it will utilize as much as it can get. Ketones contain more than twice as much energy per unit as glucose and produce much less ‘exhaust’ to dispose of. So they’re a much more efficient fuel. Studies of elderly patients still eating SAD but supplemented with exogenous ketones show marked mental improvement over controls. I’ve recently begun a test consuming vinegar (acetyl molecules) and lime juice (citrate molecules), both of which are important ingredients in lipolysis and ketogenesis, to determine whether or not the energy balance can shift towards ketones. I’m also testing this hypothesis that ethanol in small regular amounts can boost ketogenesis as well.

[ctviggen]

I’d test once in the morning (should be lower) and once in the evening (should be higher).

I have very low ketones in the morning. I think what happens is that some of us get used to using ketones and FFAs (free fatty acids) so that the amount in transit – that’s what you’re testing – is low. We’ve become very efficient at using them, so the body learns not to “over produce” them.

I’ve been doing this for over 9 years. I generally work out 3x/week, but let’s keep it a 2x/week just to be the most limiting. That’s about 1,000 workouts over 9 years. That has allowed my body to get quite efficient in use of ketones.

[GreeneggsNham]

Thank you Michael for those links and comments and thank you Bob M also for your comments.

I have looked at the links and was already reading/following one of them.

This morning 8:50 am BG was 87 and Ketones .3 with GKI of 16.1.

At 11:50 BG was 68 and Ketones .4 (GKI 9.4). At this point, just for testing I drank a can of Zevia to see if it affected a difference. Unfortunately, my son asked me to make him an omlet and I was busy for about 30 minutes. I retested at 12:35 and BG was 85 while Ketones were at .4 (GKI 11.80.

Ketones didn’t go down, glucose went up, so perhaps that was because I was busy. Perhaps the Zevia (Stevia sweetened drink) doesn’t lower my ketones. Might retest later.

I’ll post again as I test before and after I eat later.

[GreeneggsNham]

Yesterday I used Keto-Mojo again at 3:05 before I ate lunch and my BG was 83 and my Ketones were at .5 with a GKI of 9.2.

Then I ate lunch (6 scrambled eggs in about .5 Tbs of butter with two slices of protein bread and mustard, 4 slices of Boar’s Head Smoked Bacon, and a Meyer Lemon Greek Yogurt). I think I finished about 4:00. I tested again and BG was 89 and Ketones only .2! I should have tested again an hour later, but got busy.