Karim's muscle gain carnivore adventure

(Karim Wassef) #682

Interesting observation today.

Woke up with 85G and 0.2K

When I’m in real ketosis > 1, I feel no hunger during the day… and eat OMAD with no issue.

Ever since I’ve switched to high protein (low ketones) low fat, I am hungry during the day. This is uncomfortable but seems to be working for these last 15lbs of fat loss and to grow 10lbs of muscle.

I also used cold packs to add thermogenesis and mitochondrial growth (browning adipose) and that generally increases ketone production on OMAD. It’s been effective for spot reduction but only with high ketones from fasting.

I tried it today with low ketones and my body did not like being forced into that state. The hunger I experienced was severe and sudden. Stomach grumbling like a beast and approaching hunger pain. It’s during my “switched off” eating period so I can ignore it. But as an impartial observer, I have to say “Wow”… that’s an impressive reaction for someone who’s fat adapted and endured weeks of fasting.

My hypothesis is that the high protein, higher glucose/insulin and low ketone state is especially vulnerable to hunger when ketone preferring forces are brought to bear. Thermogenesis is the perfect example of this. It’s cold enough to force heat generation but not enough to cause shivering. I think low intensity cardio and weightlifting would have similar effects.

I wish that I didn’t have to go through the hunger pain, but I will say that being fat adapted by eating high fat first gave me the mental fortitude to know what my body can do. Then fasting pushed it further… but I felt weak at 160lbs on keto/fasting. But the OMAD discipline lets me say “no” much easier. Eating is just not something I do during the “off” time - no matter what. Technically it’s not “no”, it’s just “not yet”.

Also, I’m not hangry - I’m a little irritable but still calm unless provoked… :slight_smile:

Just sharing my observations on the lab rat under study.

(Mame) #683

that is so awesome, glad to hear you got good news!

(Little Miss Scare-All) #684

Says you. Let’s ask wifey. :grin:

(Karim Wassef) #685

That’s why I said that I’m calm unless provoked. Wifey can be provocative… :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

(Little Miss Scare-All) #686

Like if she took all your almonds and threw them in the trash?

(Karim Wassef) #687

that’s not provocative… that’s just nuts! LOL

actually - it might spare me the punishing temptation so it’s a good thing

but I don’t like to be forced to give something up… so that’s a bad thing

as usual with wifey things - it depends

(Little Miss Scare-All) #688

Same. I like it it to be my own choice

(Karim Wassef) #689

so in fun, I wanted to see just how good of a carnivore I have been over the last two months and compare it to my pescatarian and fasting plan going forward (one month).

I was doing pretty good… but the almonds corrupted me and I struggled until I found my way back. They’re so high in fat that even a little deviation pulls my carnivore ratio down hard!

Anything fermented is classified as the raw components - so honey or sauerkraut are plant based… milk and eggs are animal based.

Given that the next phase is only 70% carnivore, I might start a new thread.

However … I need some help figuring out where it goes:

  1. It focuses on building muscle (first) and losing fat (second) with very high protein.
  2. It’s mostly carnivore (70%), but not entirely. First 4 weeks are pescatarian carnivore (mostly).
  3. It will include 3 days a week of fasting or fasting with vegan protein.
  4. It is high protein, low fat and no carb almost.

(Mario) #690

i would go with #4. 2-3 is nothing special and 1 i would talk about workouts too.

#4 is almost HSD: High Speed Diet. very controversial

or do you have this in your mind: Lyle McDonalds Rapid Fat Loss Handbook

(Karim Wassef) #691

I’m going to try Luis Villasenor’s (Ketogains) approach … but modified… with high protein, no carb and low fat with heavy lifting. Luis endorses higher carb - and I’m willing to experiment with higher protein instead.

My question was actually where on the forum to start that thread…:smiley:


Maybe Progress, N=1?

(Karim Wassef) #693

ok… here’s the next phase:

I decided that it didn’t fit since my carnivory would be dropping down to 70%… but you can follow me over there if you want.

(Karim Wassef) #694

For my last day of carnivore, I’m planning on going nuts and having wings… so much delicious fat

The fat is higher than my target but I’m going for it… without the almonds! :blush:

(Karim Wassef) #695

ok… it’s confirmed… fat is key to regularity on carnivore.

As I’m upped my protein and reduced my fats, I’ve been experiencing some slowness in digestion. What used to take 6 hours now takes 18 hours.

So yesterday and today, I went high fat (and high protein)… and I am back to 6 hours (or less)… one more awesome benefit to keto high fat.

(Karim Wassef) #696

My last meal today was my protein shake:

100g Whey Protein Isolate (zero carb)
10g Leucine
5g Creatine
1/2 tablespoon of brewer’s yeast
1 tablespoon of ginger juice
1 tablespoon of apple cider vinegar
splash of Stevia

Well… that’s it for my carnivore experiment (95%+ carnivore anyway). Moving on to semi-carnivore semi-keto, high protein, low fat, low carb + semi-fasting.

(Boston_guy) #697

@Karim_Wassef Ever try turning your data through a data mining algorithm? I wonder if machine learning could spot some non-obvious cause & effect relationships, suggest hypotheses and little experiments.

We are so multivariate…
inputs: food/supplements (cronometer), exercise, sleep (oura), sun exposure, stress/meditation
outputs: HRV (EliteHRV), sleep data, weight (withings)

(Karim Wassef) #698

AI could help. The problem is that I don’t capture enough input data. Exercise details, sleep, stress, sauna, sun… all just as relevant as diet macros. Also not enough output variables - daily RMR, muscle diameter, etc…

It’s frankly too much tracking just macros!

I’ll think on it more :thinking:

(Boston_guy) #699

Yeah, agreed. I don’t either. I’m currently tracking food in Crono to try and gauge micro’s and get to 30% PRO.
Just thought of another input: meal timing (with downstream glucose/autophagy implications). CGM->Sleep would be fascinating. NBT/Chris Kelly have talked about their algorithms.
IMO, any data gathering has to have a payoff/ROI. I’m hoping that sleep, fasting, HRV are big enough levers to focus on.

(Bunny) #700

That’s a nice combo of proteins!

(Little Miss Scare-All) #701

What’s the difference between brewer’s yeast and nutritional yeast? I use the nutritional yeast.