I need the groups help for my spouse lipid results

(Barbara M) #1

We’ve been low carb keto for 7+years and my spouse today received his lipid results and he is freaked out
Cholesterol 458, LDL greater than 350.
HDL 68, Trig 100. He is 58, 164 lbs and 5 ft 8 inches tall
He walks 2 miles every day and over the years has lost about 40 pounds. He was fasting 13 hours before the blood work was drawn

I’ve tried to tell him to ask for a NMR and cardiac calcium score next.
He is convinced the doctor is going to require him to take a statiin.

I pulled up articles about LDL and that cholesterol is no longer a concern (per Nina Teicholtz). I talked about lean mass hyper responders and he is completely blocked from reading or hearing anything.

He is telling me that eating SAD, at least his cholesterol wasn’t high
I explained that humans have eaten meat for millions of years and the diet we follow is correct. He says lean wild hunted meat is not what we are eating.
He says, well either way we are going to find out when he either drops dead of a heart attack or doesn’t.

Thanks for reading this long story and I welcome your responses and articles.

He just left for a walk, now replying that I guess all he can do is drink water.

I know he is the healthiest he has ever been and will help him in any way I can
I would hate to see him go back to SAD all for a darned Cholesterol and LDL result.

(Peter - Don't Fear the Fat ) #2

Hi there, tell me, do you know how his stats compared to the previous ones?
I’m stalling until someone good gets here. I hate cholesterol because so much of it is nonsense and I don’t easily convert US units.

(Alec) #3

You can’t force people to understand what they don’t want to understand.

If you, he or his Dr are in any way concerned about CVD, then go get a CAC scan done, and then you can see whether he has heart disease or not. These scans are cheap and quick and definitive. Cholesterol levels are terrible measures to use… I know you know this, but pls persuade him to go get a scan done.

(Bob M) #4

He is most likely a lean mass hyper-responder (LMHR), meaning that he’s lean and eats keto, so he gets a lot of his energy from — LDL. Yes, LDL. He doesn’t exactly fit (HDL a bit “low”, trigs a bit “high”):

But he’s close.

I would wait until after a CAC (coronary arterial calcification) scan to do anything.

(Michael) #5

I have about the same lipid values for past 18 months. I just got a CT angiogram with perfectly clean arteries. A CAC is very good, but a CT angiogram will conclusively demonstrate his current status. If after 7 years there is no indication of heart disease, he can rest easy that the diet is not causing CVD. As a CT scan is more expensive, a CAC score is a great starting point.

(Barbara M) #6

Thank you for the CT angiogram info. I’ll add it to his list

(Mike W.) #7

Just remember that no one in the medical community can force you to do anything. Especially taking a statin. If this doctor does get pushy and you both don’t feel the same way, find another doctor.

(Barbara M) #8

He tells me he trusts I know what we are doing for food. That said, I’ll add more salads and veggies for his snacks. We’ll see if that helps
Much appreciated info team!

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #9

100 / 68 = 1.47 Any value less than 2.0 signifies minimal cardiovascular risk. LDL and total cholesterol are irrelevant, except that your husband is likely to be healthier than the average. Please congratulate him for me.

The doctor can strongly advise, but cannot require your husband to take a statin. The standard of care in most jurisdictions is to push statins on patients, but most doctors will be happy to make a note in the file, “Advised a statin; patient refused.”

He’s right. “Lean wild hunted meat” is never what the human race ate. Our ancestors ate the fatty cuts and gave the lean cuts to their dogs.

There are plenty of posts about all the evidence that shows that cholesterol cannot possibly be the cause of cardiovascular disease. And even the most rabid statinist has to admit that the ratio of triglycerides to HDL is far, far more indicative of cardiovascular risk than the other lipid numbers.

This is so true! It sounds as though hubby is caught up in the drama and doesn’t want to listen to reason. You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it think.

(Barbara M) #10

Thank you Paul for your evaluation. He seems better after some time we’ve spent talking. He is armed with NMR and CAC scan requests for when they call.

(Bob M) #11

Agree, although CAC scans are cheap ($100 where I live), and CT angiograms are more expensive and might not be covered. It depends what insurance will say (though where I live, CAC scans are out of pocket expenses).

(Barbara M) #12

Peter, historically his Chol was upper 200’s, HDL fell from 87 to yesterdays 67.

#13

To wit: Great Danes were bred to hunt wild boar, and they got the lean parts, while the humans ate the fatty parts. Introduce domestic pigs - the Danes were totally out of a job, the meat was mostly fatty and wild boar wasn’t needed. A handful of Dane owners took it upon themselves to breed the ferocious hunting instinct out of the breed and create gentle giants instead - just to allow the breed to survive. They succeeded. Gentle Giants one and all. Still meat and bone lovers.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #14

That is excellent. I’m glad he’s perking up, too.

(Bob M) #15

87 is quite high for a male, so I’m going to assume he’s a LMHR. His trigs are a tad high (for LMHRs), but coffee affects those for some.

(Barbara M) #16

He has generally 1 cup of coffee a day. Thanks for highlighting that.

(Bob M) #17

Here’s a test someone did:

For me, coffee doesn’t seem to affect trigs at all, but others are different.

(Bob M) #18

You know, about the NMR. To the extent that this indicates risk because of nutrition or whatever it is, like HDL and trigs, then it’s useful. But if LDL is meaningless for CVD, then it shouldn’t matter whether the LDL is “light and fluffy” or “hard and dense”. Just sayin’.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #19

Apparently, t’s just that there is a very tight correlation between a good triglyceride/HDL ratio, Pattern A, and low cardiovascular risk. And even people who believe that LDL is deadly have to admit that Pattern A or a good triglycerides/HDL means low risk.

(Barbara M) #20

I believe he understands after a lot of talking today that the large fluffy LDL will take up more space than the small dense probably oxidized ones.

I’ve been sharing every comment with him to let him know I’m not the only one who believes the way we eat is beneficial and not harmful.

We even got into a discussion about bile! And what happens to the bile of people who have had their gallbladder removed.
Thank you