How much total calorie in 24 hours?

(chottu) #1

How much total calorie am I allowed … I am taking too much dairy cream, lots of cheese, sausages, burgers , eggs, meats occasionally fish and portions are always big. Please advice me how much total calorie should it be in a day? I am diabetic type 2 & on metformin.

(Jack Brien) #2

Depends on what your aims are and whether you subscribe to the ‘need to reduce fat to burn fat hypothesis’ or the ‘reduce calories, reduce metabolism theory’

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #3

On a well-formulated ketogenic diet, the important point is to minimize carbohydrate consumption, so as not to stimulate the pancreas to produce insulin. A low level of insulin in the blood allows your body to metabolize its stored fat.

The idea is to replace all those carbohydrate calories you’re no longer eating with fat, since fat doesn’t stimulate the production of insulin. Since fat is highly satiating, if you eat fat to satiety, your body will respond by telling you when you’ve consumed enough calories. According to one researcher in the field, people with a lot of body fat to lose generally end up eating somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500 calories a day, when eating fat to satiety. The remainder of their caloric needs are met from body fat.

Of course, as the amount of stored fat in our bodies declines, we will find our caloric intake naturally increasing. The point is that there is no need to figure anything out; the body will tell us how much energy it needs, and we just eat fat until we’re no longer hungry.

(ianrobo) #4

total calories in a day - do not worry about it, just eat until full and no further. If you are T2D also measure your sugars after eating LCHF and compare as you were as a carb eater …

My guess is within weeks you will see improvements wildly beyond your own expectations.

#5

Chottu, it is impossible to estimate TDEE without knowing sex, age, height, weight.

(ianrobo) #6

but that is believing CICO ?

#7

No. It’s believing in basal metabolic rate. My body has different energy demands than LeBron James’ body. Since our nutritional needs are different, we need to eat accordingly.

PS: I believe King James follows a HFLC diet.

(ianrobo) #8

he did but surely the only rule you need is to eat until full ?

#9

That may be the only rule YOU need.
But that doesn’t work for everyone.

(Ken) #10

It’s a matter of eating until sated, not full. The feeling of being sated comes from the mouth and brain, it’s a sense of distaste in the thought of eating more. That’s the true leptin response. This is very different than the feeling of fullness or bloat from the stomach, which people feel when eating carbs.

During your first couple of initial weeks, eat plenty of fat to feel sated, caloric restriction comes when adapted.

#11

Thank you for clarifying this. Some people see eating till full as eating until you can’t eat another bite, which may cause overeating. Eating to satiety leaves one satisfied and comfortable, not stuffed.

(chottu) #12

Thanks to everyone who cared to reply. I still have some query regarding losing weight … Yes, I am overweight in fact I had gastric bypass 4 years ago
which was a complete failure … I did not lose any weight. My aim is to lose some weight by ketogenic diet hence I am here.
Advice I received as post gastric bypass patient was to eat very very small portion size & ofcourse carb free diet & diet should include protein, salad & veg. Unfortunately, I could not stick to small portion hence it did not work. I felt really hungry after small portion
although my pre op idea was I won’t be able to eat after op. I could eat easily & it didn’t work.

I know satiety is important for me & with ketogenic diet
I feel I am overeating with all my favourite fatty stuff, cheese burger sausages cream & what not! I am making sugar free bread with lots of almond powder didn’t taste good, I made ketogenic bread etc …
Some people here talking about satiety … But I noticed my satiety comes after a real big portion of meal & I am gaining weight not losing. Could it be that these sausages, burgers, almond powder all these in big portion supplying me with carbohydrates? Sausages/ burgers has binding starch in it …so they may not be helping weight loss?

Also butter, cream in huge amount how can be weight reducing?

Anyway, if anyone in my situation & have knowledge of post gastric bypass patient with diabetes type 2 plus
raised LDL, hypothyroidism etc please help with your suggestions regarding how to lose weight with ketogenic diet. There must be a restriction of total amount of intake, portion size ?

Btw, I have noticed that I can bring my weight down with water fasting & I have been successful but can not stick to it long term as you would realise how difficult it can be for food lovers!

(Todd Allen) #13

Eating fats such as butter and cream is supposed to produce satiety such that one spontaneously eats less with little effort. Some report losing weight even when eating fats to excess, perhaps because their insulin is so low they aren’t absorbing and retaining the excess calories.

#14

It sounds like you may be deranged such that “eating to satiety” will not work for you. You may need to measure your food and develop the discipline to not overeat.

Sometimes its easier to abstain than to exercise moderation. Fasting may be a better tool for you. It really does get easier as you do it more. I say this as someone who didn’t know what fasting was a few months ago and now routinely go 4-10 days between a meal.

You have a really hard row to hoe, but there are folks here who have been in similar situations. Hopefully some of them will chime in.

(ianrobo) #15

OK I accept my words may not have been perfect but most of us can tell when we are full once we are keto adapted, before that there are issues with the receptors which Dr Lustig does a fine job in explaining Ghrelin etc.

But to the OP

says this and I think he/she has already identified the issue and that is still eating too many hidden carbs which will supress Ghrelin. As difficult as this may seen I would go Zero Carb for a month to basically completely flush the system. you may feel a bit awful during this but benefit/gain > discomfort.

(Ken) #16

I suspect you’re still eating when not hungry. Habitual eating can be a tough nut to crack, because you’re used to responding to energy balance issues rather than a true hunger response. Hunger is caused by a ghrelin release, and is felt in the stomach. The funny, shaky feeling you feel is not hunger, but a resistance withdrawl reaction due to blood sugar dropping, as your body gets closer to glycogenolysis, which is both the initial glucagon secretion and the first step to lipolysis. Now that you’re aware of the difference, you have to break the psychological response to the withdrawl, and wait for an actual ghrelin producing hunger reaction before you eat.

Once you’re able to do that, you’ll adapt rapidly.

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #17

As Ken says:

In other words, it’s early days yet, so don’t give up. You are still in the middle of adapting, and it is likely to get much easier as you go on. So give the keto way of eating some more time before giving it up as a bad job. It may very well be wrong for you—but right now it’s too soon to tell. The famous Dr. Phinney’s advice to people who are confused is first, eat less carbohydrate. If that doesn’t do it, eat more fat. (And always keep protein moderate. Too much protein can cause as many problems as too little.)

Remember: fat doesn’t stimulate insulin secretion, but carbohydrate does, and so does protein, though not as much. This is why you can eat so much fat and still lose weight—because the lack of insulin in your body allows it to burn its stored fat and to avoid storing the fat that you’re eating.

So go back to cooking with lard, tallow, and butter, put butter and mayo on everything, and drink that bacon juice (let it cool down first!). Get the high-fat hamburger meat and the fatty steaks, buy the pork roast with the layer of fat on top, grill your salmon steaks in butter and tallow, and make sure the supermarket leaves the skin on the chicken breasts! Avoid all those vegetables that you hate! In other words, do what we tell everyone: keep calm, and keto on! You can do this!

Here’s a little virtual bacon to encourage you: :bacon::bacon::bacon:

(ianrobo) #18

OK, what I did to adapt was to go ultra low carbs, usually 20g or less and fasted exercise, I do think if you go Keto you have to really cut back those carbs to low or zero and once you are fully adapted you can as I have done, allow a few more to come back (especially if you exercise regularly).

#19

@ianrobo Satiety and fullness are somewhat subjective and because of my experience with these terms, I am glad a distinction was made here.

Zero carb may or may not help the OP. I gained a lot of fat on zero carb because I was eating until full every time I felt hungry. It was after I learned about macros, ghrelin and started IF that I lost most of the fat I gained. I’m still (mostly) ZC but now I eat until satisfied rather than full, and only 1 or 2 meals a day. I now understand that ghrelin’s hunger pangs, for me at least, are not true hunger, and that eating until satiety is healthier for me than eating until full.