High Urine Ketones = Less Weight Loss?

(Bill Kieger) #1

Hi, new here. I was pre diabetic(barely) spring of 2017, 186#, 58yrs old now, Cholesterol 188. Doc said to be careful with diet…
My dad(84) has significant dementia. June 2017 read tons about EVOO(extra virgin olive oil)(Costco :+1:)decreasing/slowing dementia/Alzheimer’s, so started consuming 1/3-1/2 cup/day… and I’ve always known carbs weren’t good for you. 12/2017 my sister got me Mercola’s Fat for Fuel… I have a medical background so could totally relate to lots of his stuff in supporting mitochondria, and totally anti vegetable oils, though am skeptical on some other things he discusses… anyway, I was pretty much already in ketosis. After 4 months of a better understanding of what I was doing(eating 6oz of ribeye/meal vs 20+oz), lost 23#'s. June 2018, bad cholesterol down 44 points, good up 1… and no longer pre diabetic… can hike 7 miles in under 2 hours with endless energy! A success story and a way of life, not a fad!

Here’s the catch… I have always measured urine ketones, usually very high end of the stick. Always thought that was good… since finding this forum, high levels only mean you are eliminating EXTRA ketones… probably from all of the EVOO…

Question!

So(got 5 more #'s to go) is it true that if I am negative (and still fat adapted) or trace to low on the urine stick that I am more likely to lose weight than if my urine ketones are maxed out?(have way more than my body can use? ).
Just testing a theory here…

P.S. also was checking my waking morning glucose, upper 90’s, read on here to check it later in the morning… mid 70’s :+1::+1::+1::+1: wish I had found this site a year ago…

Thanks in advance…

Bill

#2

Hi and welcome Bill,

Urine sticks only measure one type of ketone (acetoacetone), which are good to see but they are only produced in the early stages of adaptation. Later that type virtually disappears and the sticks generally measure nothing (but some people still get a reading just to confuse the point…).

If you want to measure (some do, some don’t, but I do) you need a blood analyser because only they can measure beta-hydroxybutyrate (which is the keytone we burn for fuel)

(Source Dr Phinney/Volek “The art and science of carbohydrate living”)

I think chasing all these numbers is like chasing shadows, it’s best to spend all that energy making sure we don’t go over 20 g carbs.

If we go over our carbon limit and we will be going in an out of keto which is better than nothing at all but not optimal.

It’s great to hear all your positive results, well done

(Bill Kieger) #3

Is it possible to not be fat adapted and still have very high urine ketones?

(Full Metal KETO AF) #4

That’s a lot of EVO per day. Are you consuming other fats? Saturated fats like animal fats and coconut oil are known to combat dementia and it seems like you might want to have a more balanced fat intake.

And when you are fat adapted you won’t have high urine ketones. Put away your test sticks and trust the process. If you’re staying under 20 carbs you will be in ketosis.

(Allie) #5

You’re more likely to pee out higher amounts of ketones BEFORE you’re fat adapted so the sticks tend to stop working once you’re adapted. This is why the pee sticks really aren’t helpful for measuring amounts.

That said, I’m four years in and very fat adapted but still show crazy high levels in pee after a few days of fasting…

#6

Yes. In the early stages we are not fat adapted and that’s when I’d expect to see higher urine readings.

They say everyone is different. But generally I’d expect urine ketones to go down or disappear as we get more keto adapted.

Blood ketones should be present in the early stages and after adaptation.

Can someone be keto adapted and still produce high levels of acetoacetone (as measured by pee sticks)? That I don’t know. I’ve heard of lower or trace readings but Dr Phinney says everyone is different so…?

That’s the problem with urine sticks, they can measure zero if not even in ketosis or they can measure zero if you are well adapted.

And if we go in and out of keto due to hidden (or perhaps not so hidden) carbs then it gets more complicated.

I like to measure everything. I just use my blood analyser to endure I haven’t been hit by hidden carbs. That happened to me 3 times. So I’m essentially looking for a zero or none zero not any particular value.

(Bill Kieger) #7

Just got my inexpensive BAC tester today(not ready to splurge on the blood tester… yet)… blowing a consistent 0.10. I guess I’m trying to confirm that I’m fat adapted, especially since I’ve been doing this for 1 1/2 years and this is the first time I have heard that term used…

After some reading on here, it appears there is an inverse relation between BAC readings and blood ketone levels… still reading…