Getting that full feeling

#9

I’m using Chrono to count intake. So far today: P/C/F: 26/5/28. Yesterday P/C/F: 65/26/70. All in grams.
If you look at the recommended amount of protein intake for my build; its around 60g max. Depending on what expert you listen to all you are going to do is cause gluconeogenesis by taking in more protein. And I’m not factoring in I’m 55 years old.
The way I see it is to ingest more leafy greens (at very little carb cost) mixed in with more fat. But as I’ve already said, it doesn’t really do it for me.

#10

Why would you expect to? Broccoli and Cabbage doesn’t equal a meal!

More than you need? You sure about that? Sounds like your body telling you to still eat what it wants to me.

Are you tracking what you’re eating? What are your body stats and what are you calling “to much” meat? You’re not a converted vegetarian or something are you? Just trying to understand your mindset.

What does that mean to you? Do you have a protein gram limit you’ve set? Unlikely you’d over eat protein as it’d satiate you which seems to be what you’re lacking.

#11

I am a short, not active, not muscular woman, 75-100g is my goal, it’s a nice amount for me (yeah, I probably wouldn’t lose much muscles eating 60g either but 2g/kg for lean bodyweight isn’t a bad amount. maybe a tad unnecessary but I need to be realistic, this amount is already so very low for me that I go over regularly even on carnivore where I eat the least fat, protein and carbs).

Sometimes we can’t follow guidelines without shooting ourselves in the food, so to speak… Both adequte and high-protein feels great to me and it’s not like I can avoid that so I don’t worry about it but I use fatty protein so my average protein intake isn’t way too high. It should be enough.
For good satiation, I personally should avoid plants especially vegetables. But they are great for many people. Use them together with meat, cheese, eggs or whatever satiate you. Vegetable and fat is a combo that would never satiate me and I did try it with a huge (not keto) amount. It didn’t do a thing, I need protein too. Vegetable is usually a nice side dish but getting satiated with it on keto is impossible for many of us.
And even with our satiating food, amount matters a lot. A too tiny meal isn’t enough.

#12

The broccoli and cabbage statement was somewhat tongue in cheek. No, the protein thing is recommended guidelines, that’s all.

#13

Ok, but meaning what? Who’s guidelines? Your protein intake is dependent on your LBM/Bodyweight. Many people don’t even remotely eat enough and set themselves back huge, no shortage of people under eat protein and then just loose muscle weight instead of fat thereby TECHNICALLY making themselves fatter as their fat vs LBM has flipped.

#14

If you’re not eating much vegetation where are you getting your nutrients?

#15

LBM/weight is what I’m basing it on.

#16

Ok… and what are those and what are you eating? I think you’re missing my point.

#17

Possibly.
LBM is about 70kg. I say that because it’s only estimated at this stage.
Protein intake is about 75g

#18

Gotcha, that’s what I was thinking. I don’t know your body weight but that’s a decent amount of LBM, and in my opinion and I’d think the same as most of us with a descent amount of muscle you’re eating about HALF of what you should be to keep it, let alone build on top of it.

#19

er, where do you get your calculation from? I just looked on google.

#20

For anybody that want to maintain muscle or gain it ESPECIALLY while losing body fat which inherently affects muscle mass no matter what the common goto would be 1g/lb of body weight, not LBM. I can’t convert that for you as I don’t know your bodyweight, but if I were you I’d keep a VERY close eye on your muscle mass eating that low. When it comes to muscle you need to have a muscle mindset, not a “weight loss” mindset. The protein isn’t going to stop you from loosing fat, quite the opposite actually as protein is very thermogenic and it takes a lot to process. Remember, the more muscle mass you have, the more metabolism you have!

I’d plug your stats into this calc, it’s still a calc so it’s an educated guess but this one’s pretty good. Especially for us as it’s made with keto in mind. Measurements are key for accuracy. (again, accuracy for a calc).

#21

Ok, I need to go away and do some homework.
I give you one last point to consider:

If I eat 150g of protein a day; given the macro percentage ranges I should be eating three times as much fat. 750g of fat is a LOT of calories. If I’m eating more than 2000 calories a day how do I lose the weight?

#22

Congrats! You just figured out what eating by % is stupid. Go by grams. You do NOT have a fat goal, keto doesn’t equal FORCING fat in everywhere. Calories should be a limit, Protein should be a GOAL, fat fills in the gaps. I have days where my fat is around 150-200g, I have days when it’s 60g. I could care less. I don’t look for excuses to cover everything in butter and cream cheese. I used to, and that was stupid (and tasty) but I held myself back for a long time.

#23

From my normal food. Eggs, meat, cheese, I have days with plants too, sadly as I have little meat now but they probably don’t help… Even then I barely touch vegetables. I don’t need them, they seem bad for getting nutrients on keto as they are very carby anyway. My animal food is highly nutritious and not very carby… I was a huge vegetable lover a few months before but I hated most green leaves even then so they never could help me as I refused to consume them.

I didn’t research nutrients since I am flirting with carnivore yet (it’s tricky as even my needs noticeably changed) but it works for many people and I can’t start eating vegetables anyway. I don’t want them, they mess me up due to carbs so it won’t happen except very rarely or in tiny amounts (10-20g but not every day. nutrition wise nothing).
If I will have any problem, I will change something I guess. But I am hopeful I can buy enough proper meat to avoid it.

#24

You can eat, like, 80g fat with your 150g protein, it’s quite fine. You don’t need some specific ratio - unless you figured out you need that for some reason. Many people eat twice as much fat in grams than protein because it works for them. I couldn’t care less if I eat much more protein or much more fat, I am okay with both.

You are in ketosis because you eat little enough carbs. That’s it. The fat may be low, you are still in ketosis, it’s not the fat that cause that…

(I personally wouldn’t set 150g as a goal, I experienced that I don’t need near as much and every calculator and nearly everyone told me way less and I trust that, I just wouldn’t worry about going higher with the protein intake. You have a good reason to eat more, it helps with satiation.)

(Michael - When reality fails to meet expectations, the problem is not reality.) #25

@roop298 For comparison’s sake and not to say this is exactly what you should do, but maybe get an idea of what’s a good starting point. Been keto for 3 1/2 years and in maintenance 3 years. I’m male, 75, fairly active with a full-time job (~30 hours per week) at Walmart that requires continuous standing and walking during my shifts (I’m not allowed to sit). I do not ‘work out’ other than my job, walking lots (I do not own a car) and riding my bicycle occasionally. Here are my numbers.

Total weight is 145 pounds; lean body mass is about 125; BF about 14%. I use Bikman’s protein recommendation of about 1.5 grams of protein per kilo of total body weight. Bikman uses total rather than lean mass because it’s much easier to determine accurately. Bikman’s numbers are a range of about +/- half a gram. My current number is 1.8 gr per kilo. I’m on the high end of Bikman’s range because as an older and fairly active male I want to make sure I eat enough protein to prevent possible loss of lean mass. I’ve been thin all my life and don’t want to get even thinner as I age.

Currently that is: 120 grams of protein per day. I get this protein mostly from meat, fish, eggs and cheese; secondarily, but significantly, also with whey and casein, collagen/gelatin and bone broth powders. By trial and error over the course of about a year I have settled upon approx 2700 total calories per day as my daily energy requirement to maintain my current weight. To eat that amount, I consume 240 grams of fats per day. Thus, my current keto ratios are fat/protein grams: 2.00; fat/protein calories: 4.50. I also consume max carbs of 15 grams per day and generally consume less than that max and frequently 10 grams or less.

I use a spreadsheet to plan and record my meals and calculate daily numbers. I could not find a free or commercial application that gave me the flexibility nor the resultant data I want to see.

(Bunny) #27

Everyone keeps going on about protein :roll_eyes: protein is not the common denominator…lol

TEMPORARILY I would eat more saturated fat if I were you, that’s why you are so hungry, fat also helps you make more hormones to do what hormones do to keep you from becoming insulin and Leptin resistant (why you feel so hungry all the time)?

Eat saturated fat until you are sick of it! (not joking; trying to count fat macros and limit saturated fat intake and all that BS is just going to make your hunger worse?)

Mainstream science wants you to believe insulin and Leptin resistance comes from saturated fat, the problem is, that is true to a certain extent (just add refined sugar?), the problem being the research did not look deep enough into the actual holy grail root cause (hint; it is not the saturated fat causing the insulin, Leptin resistance, it comes from not enough dietary fat in the absence of refined sugars).

And if you don’t believe me about eating more fat to feel satiated (unlimited) look at what Dr. Fung has to say about fasting and saturated dietary fats and its relation to insulin resistance and how to treat diabetes the correct way:

…10 High-Fat Foods That Are Actually Super Healthy

Just got my insulin level test results
#28

We talked about protein because meat seemed a nice way to get satiated. Plus it’s not nice to be afraid of protein when there is a big chance it causes no problems.

More fat may be a solution and may not. It never satiated me well except when it was fat in my protein source, that works finely. If it works for the OP, fine but with a little calorie limit, the nutrients that some meat provides may be needed, a bunch of fat isn’t that good.

We shouldn’t be afraid of saturated fat, indeed :slight_smile:

(Bunny) #29

Real fatty meats (the cheap stuff)!