Fun fact: Qigong "Immortals" may have been ketoers

#1

I read in the Aug 2006 issue of the American Journal of Geriatrics Society that from 221 AD until the end of the late 1800’s, in the far East, traditional doctors (Influenced by a Qigong view of medicine) lived the longest at an average of 75 years (same as many today).

Buddhist monks lived an average of 67 years.

Just for comparison, emperors lived an average of 41 years!

Now, their health regimen included Qigong which is supposedly healthy and they used a variety of medicinal herbs and traditional medical treatments, the efficacy of which are up for debate.

That being said, here is an oft repeated Qigong statement about maintaining health: “Avoid the Five Cereals or Grains”. It appears in virtually all ancient works on the Qigong diet.

The “Five Cereals” are: rice, millet, wheat, oats and beans.

One ancient text reads “If a grain enters your mouth, do not hope for eternal life!”

So unless these guys were chowing down on potatoes or some other carb rich source (unlikely since the “Five Cereals” were the staples back then), it is likely that they were ancient ketoers or close to it and outlived their rice heavy and vegetarian contemporaries (Buddhist monks). They probably ate veggies, eggs and meat, avoided high carb grains and lived to ripe old ages without modern medicine! And obviously getting to eat whatever you feel like whenever you feel like it kills you young so the emperors were outlived by the doctors by 34 years on average. Wow.

Interesting, eh?

(You've tried everything else; why not try bacon?) #2

In a lot of traditional societies, before grains and sugar entered the diet, if you didn’t die in childhood, you generally lived into your seventies or eighties. I didn’t know this about the Qigong diet, but it certainly makes sense.

#3

@PaulL

I see what you mean. I get messed up by averages. For example thousands of years ago the average life span was 35. However that’s the average affected by a ton of young deaths. So how long did those who didn’t die young actually live?

Then with these guys living to be on average 75 that means that they had even fewer young deaths numbers affecting the average but still dragging it down. So if we took away all the young deaths does that mean these guys were living to be in their 90’s?

#4

Fun fact indeed! The Qigong/Taoist statement about the 5 cereals or grains - must certainly have helped.

There are indeed internal practices that enhance mindful eating and fasting… and everything!

My self-experimentation has long been inspired by ancient longevity practices from a range of sources - the taoists to shaolin buddhist lineages to yogic philosophy and the christian mystic tradition. And it’s intriguing how moderation in eating along with fasting as well as feasting is common to them all.

Also find Hildegard von Bingen inspiring… she’s the visionary catholic nun/abbess, medicine woman, and music composer of 12th century europe who lived to the astonishing age of 81 at the time (when majority of people didn’t live past midlife and average lifespan was 35) - and most of her singing abbey’s nuns were known for their health too.

Few people know that Hildegard was the architect of the first indoor plumbing in western civilization - at her abbey, which enhanced hygiene and hydrotherapy practices of course. Her abbey had a huge herb garden and its own apothecary. Her discovered works include many musical compositions along with two major medical works, Causae et Curae and Physica - which are closely related to eastern principles in the medicinal use of Plants, Elements, Trees, Stones, Fish, Birds, Animals, Reptiles, and Metals.

Her recommendations - long before the western industrial scientific method - involved eating later morning/midday, regular meats from grass & hay eating animals (no pig), and green things. She believed that butter and cream from the cow are good, but milk and cheese are better from the goat! And, surprisingly perhaps, she highly recommended spelt and chickpeas for frequent eating and as an alternative to wheat. Though she lived long, she did suffer various physical ups and downs - perhaps due to carbs, perhaps not.

The whole longevity topic reminds me also of the fascinating historic fasting/nutrition writings by long-living Upton Sinclair of this last century (lived to age 90) and Luigi Cornaro who lived a truly remarkable 102 years in Renaissance Italy - that and much more are covered in the below keto-oriented book by forum member @CristiVlad - a great read for anyone interested in vitality & rejuvenation!

https://www.amazon.com/Periodic-Fasting-Repair-Younger-Appreciate/dp/151155245X/ref=tmm_pap_swatch_0

#5

If we could only jump into a time machine, go back, and see exactly what they ate :smiley: …

(Consensus is Politics) #6

My ex girlfriend, a filipinas, had told me once that her grandfather die as at age 127. I didn’t believe her, of course, but didn’t say anything. She could tell I doubted her, so she dug up the newspaper clipping she had of him when he turned 121 and was getting married for the nth time. His bride to be was in her 30’s. Talk about robbing the cradle😉.

The article was about half the total page. It spoke a lot about his service in the war with Spain, pre-Spanish American war. Which would have been early 1890’s. He still had his conscription papers and uniform. The back side of that page had a partial article about the sinking of a Canadian ship off the coast of Korea during the Korean War. The article was only partial, but I remember the date being in 1952, and how it reportedly happened just a few days before. That gives a good point of reference for his marriage. Id like to find the article in an archived paper. It was in the Manila Times if I remember right.

He lived a long life of eating fish, and farming cassava root. It was the cassava root that killed him, and not in the usual way. He died trying to get one more root out of the ground at the end of the day. He had a heart attack.

In case you’re interested, this is the usual way cassava root kills.

Turns out it’s not to uncommon. My ex told me about an entire family, extended out through several marriages, around 200, at a family gathering. The daughter of the ‘Don’, yep, she used that term, prepared the meal. There was a lot of cassava root, it was in practically every dish served. Everyone but the daughter died from it.

Makes me rethink why we ever started eating potatoes to begin with. The greens of a potatoe are deadly. And if you are eating a raw potato and it has a green tinge under the skin, that is poisonous as well. Or so I have heard. There are all kinds of stories crawling the inter webs.:face_with_monocle: