Diverticulitis and B words

(Robin) #1

Hey all… coming up on 1 year of faithful keto. Just had a curious incident. My third round of diverticulitis. (Yearly, in the spring.) The only thing (besides getting one year older) that I did differently was eat some veggies the two days before the flare-up. (Brussel Sprouts and Broccoli) But still under 20 g of carbs. I’m usually on the carnivore side. So… wondering if the veggies brought it on, or just a fluke. I’ve been reading the earlier posts on this topic and it seems there’s no consensus on probiotics and taking fiber supplements. I sure would like to avoid this pain next spring!

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #2

Try the experiment again, and if you get another flare-up, I’d say stay away from the Brussels sprouts and broccoli. Given that you know you have diverticula, I’d also especially stay away from foods with seeds that could get trapped in them.

(Bob M) #3

I’ve seen articles saying fiber is bad for diverticulitis. This is, of course, the opposite of what you’ll be recommended.

My bet is that the brussels and broccoli are the culprits, but as Paul says, an experiment might help.

I find that some veggies and I don’t get along, and salads in particular for me cause some issues. I still eat all of these, but just much less than I once did.

I’ll also note that these types of experiments can be tough. It might take a few tries.

What I’ve also found is that highly cooking veggies seems to help. A soft, mushy veggie is better than a hard one. For me, anyway.

#4

research what causes divert. and mostly ‘it is unknown’ as in we ALL got pockets in our gut systems but some of those get inflamed and inflammation from your menu is probably what keeps it rolling but without a true elimination menu, one can only guess?

As in when we inflame and more thru other med issues we might have etc we have the pockets, and we all do kinda but then when one eats XYZ then can trap. Causing the infection and pain from it so?

brocc is little baby pin head round leaves to trap easily. Brussle sprouts could be an inflammation trigger still to your body ya know??? who knows unless we eliminate.

So thing is what I am saying is divert. is BROAD…very broad. It is heal the guts but what is not letting the inflammation heal and then not trap those particles?

Alot of bigger thought on it.

My hubby deals with this and he is SAD and believe me when I CONTROLLED him he lost this issue mostly and got better but he could not point blank hold the eating change so back to nasty guts he went.
but that was personal for him.

I think your best bet, total elim. Go 30 days ALL in meat/fish/fowl and seafood and WATCH your any extras you might wanna do very carefully and slow small additions if you chose but your body is TELLING you and ya got to listen if you want further better benefits and healing in your gut area.

I don’t know what you eat being keto but elimination and start over is the key but I also know many won’t go there but it is what it is for each of us personally on gut/pain/nasty issues so…

wishing you the best!

(Bob M) #5

My problem with diverticulitis is there are very few studies of their recommendations. They recommend more fiber based on epidemiological (aka “crap-edemiological”) studies indicating people who ate higher fiber (as per food frequency questionnaires) has less diverticulitis. From this, they deduced if you have diverticulitis, you should eat more fiber.

But there are almost no studies of this.

And here’s one where they found fiber supplementation was not beneficial:

Though there is one where there was a benefit:

As with all of these studies, you really need to read them to see what they did.

But it’s not like there’s 100 studies (and I mean RCTs with two groups of patients) where they gave patients extra fiber or had them eat more fiber, and 90+ % of those showed a benefit. There’s like a handful of studies (that I can find, anyway), and they conflict.

#6

yup it is inflammation causing our normal pockets in our gut systems to then go rouge and trap when we get more inflamed and out of balance…they ain’t got a friggin’ true diagnosis or true point blank direct issue for this…BUT US keto/lc/carnivore people get it :wink:

(Robin) #7

Thanks. Hey, What’s your opinion on products like Benefiber?
Actually I have zero issues with regularity since I take Magnesium Carbonate. So, this may be a one off. But I’m just gonna avoid those brussel sprouts and broccoli… which were not cooked till soft.

(Robin) #8

Soft makes sense. I don’t think I’m up for any experiment

(Robin) #9

@ctviggen, @Fangs @PaulL… Okay, I’m going with my gut (pun intended). Going back to no veggies. Come to think of it, my first two bouts were pre-keto and I definitely used to eat a LOT of veggies. So, I guess I’ll count this as my experiment. Appreciate the feedback.

(Bob M) #10

I started looking into diverticulitis when both my mother and brother were diagnosed with it, so I assumed I had it too. I also starting putting more together when I started eating fewer plants and particularly salads. I felt better overall, and a large portion of that was digestive issues.

I still eat some plants, though. We went to a Mexican restaurant last night, and my daughter did not eat her bell peppers and onions. So, we brought those home and I ate them with some meat for lunch today. But they were well cooked (though now I’m thinking they were cooked in PUFAs; forgot about that).

But once you begin to look into this (or, heck, any) area, they are all the same: everything is based off epi studies.

#11

My mom has diverticulitis. From what she has told me the worst things were seeds - even residual seeds in tomatoes and the like. That said, it seems she has been better off overall on the low-carb/keto diet she has adopted more recently.

(Bacon is a many-splendoured thing) #12

Experiences I’ve read have been mixed, but mostly support the idea that fibre is unnecessary on a well-formulated ketogenic diet. It is true that some ketonians do better with fibre in their diet, but fibre doesn’t seem to affect a lot of other ketonians one way or the other, and a lot of other ketonians claim that fibre has a bad effect on their digestion. Ketonians with Crohn’s disease or irritable bowel syndrome almost universally feel that fibre on a ketogenic diet makes their symptoms worse.

The benefit of fibre is supposed to lie in the fact that it is eaten by intestinal bacteria, which then produce a by-product called butyrate, which is supposed to be good for the intestinal lining, because it converts into β-hydroxybutyrate. Since β-hydroxybutyrate is one of the ketone bodies produced on a low-carb/ketogenic diet, it appears that we can mostly dispense with the middlemen (middlebacteria?) and just give our colons the β-hydroxybutyrate we produce ourselves.

Dr. Jason Fung’s famous line is, “Carbohydrate is the poison, and fibre is the antidote. If you’re not taking the poison, why do you need the antidote?” Dr. Paul Mason’s analogy is that eating fibre to prevent constipation is a lot like adding autos to the road in order to prevent traffic jams.

Personally, I find that ease of bowel movements depends mostly on whether I’m getting enough salt or not. I do get some fibre in the vegetables I eat, but so far as I can tell, its presence in or absence from my diet is irrelevant.

(Robin) #13

@PaulL @fitbod @ctviggen, Thanks, everyone. It’s not as if I don’t EVER eat any veggies. But in very small amounts and cooked till soft. This last time was larger amount than usual and still crispy. Lesson learned.

(Ivy) #14

Thank for this post. Mr. Tiny Diver gave me a visit today and I found the culprit to be too much dairy, for which became clear with the first time I had a keto-poo issue
for which too much red meat might’ve been a culprit at the same time, over 2 days

Seeing my GI 2maro

Not really an issue going forward as im eating the rest of the fridge to clear out to try carnivore – which promotes avoidance of it

Too much egg whites in butter.

(Robin) #15

@Fangs I should have responded to this at this time. I 100% agree. I am pretty narrow in the foods I eat, so it was easy to eliminate those veggies. Because you’re right… when we only eat a select group of foods, and pay attention, it’s easy to see what is giving us problems. Like I can only eat a little dairy and just in the morning. I will likely just give it up soon.